45 has never been an impressive penetrator. I've seen 230 ball ammo go 3" into tree stumps and come back out the side it was shot into without the jacket.
I only trust solids in 45.
I think a 220 grain cast cone is a better choice.
More tests!

 

That is interesting.

 

I have a 9" .300 barrel downstairs i need to build. Just gotta get the chance to put everything together

 

I was having a discussion with a friend about subsonic 300 blackout and I was of the opinion that it was basically the same as a 45ACP and I didn’t like any of the ammo that was on the market for self defense.

So I decided I hadn’t done a JCN Ballistic test in a while...

My criticism of the 194gr Maximum Expansion subsonic Underwood round was that it was only good for gel blocks and I wasn’t convinced it would be any good with hard barriers. I also thought it would essentially perform the same as a 45ACP.

So I brought out my 45ACP Kriss Vector and my SBR 300 blk AR to test.

View attachment 827918

I set up a test wanting the 300 blk to fail. I put 3” of gel and then 2 pieces of 22ga steel at a 45 degree angle, then more gel.

View attachment 827920

So I tested and...

View attachment 827926 View attachment 827922

The Underwood round fully expanded in 3” gel and punched through the steel. Then went an additional 9.5” in gel past that!

View attachment 827924

The 45 didn’t make it past the steel.

Hit the “like” button if you like these tests. It’s been a while since I’ve done any.

Other tests are here:
https://www.glocktalk.com/threads/jcn-ballistic-testing-compilation-master-thread.1713742/

Interesting. Now do it with a real 45 loader, like a Underwood/Buffalobore/Doubletap 45 Super in 230 grains.

Sent from my SM-G930VL using Tapatalk

 

Interesting. Now do it with a real 45 loader, like a Underwood/Buffalobore/Doubletap 45 Super in 230 grains.

Sent from my SM-G930VL using Tapatalk

I failed to mention it, but it was a subsonic test only (with home defense and suppressors in mind). In my bag I had 45 ACP Underwood XTP 185gr at 1200 fps... but wouldn't have been a fair fight against the subsonic 300 blk. I didn't shoot it on that day.

I have subsonic 40 SW Ranger that I was going to test too but wasn't motivated enough.

If people have tests that they'd like to see, feel free to suggest them!

I had even brought out the canned ham tins again but there wasn't a point after the HST failed to get through the metal.

 

I want to get into .300 blackout but that price...

 

The 300 BK Has far greater sexual density.

 

:eyelashes::jumpingjacks::kidding:

 

I was having a discussion with a friend about subsonic 300 blackout and I was of the opinion that it was basically the same as a 45ACP and I didn’t like any of the ammo that was on the market for self defense.

So I decided I hadn’t done a JCN Ballistic test in a while...

My criticism of the 194gr Maximum Expansion subsonic Underwood round was that it was only good for gel blocks and I wasn’t convinced it would be any good with hard barriers. I also thought it would essentially perform the same as a 45ACP.

So I brought out my 45ACP Kriss Vector and my SBR 300 blk AR to test.

View attachment 827918

I set up a test wanting the 300 blk to fail. I put 3” of gel and then 2 pieces of 22ga steel at a 45 degree angle, then more gel.

View attachment 827920

So I tested and...

View attachment 827926 View attachment 827922

The Underwood round fully expanded in 3” gel and punched through the steel. Then went an additional 9.5” in gel past that!

View attachment 827924

The 45 didn’t make it past the steel.

Hit the “like” button if you like these tests. It’s been a while since I’ve done any.

Other tests are here:
https://www.glocktalk.com/threads/jcn-ballistic-testing-compilation-master-thread.1713742/

.45 ACP has always had a problem with barrier penetration.

I’d be interested in seeing a side by side bare gel/clothing test though.

Not all of us are planning on shooting through car doors with a handgun round.

 

Not all of us are planning on shooting through car doors with a handgun round.

How about through a solid core door in your house?

 

I like the test, but I am surprised you are surprised. The 45acp has never been known as a barrier penetrator, especially steel. Steel penetration is more about vel than mass.

 

very cool, thanks for sharing!!
I too like the .300blk. cost for me is an issue as well.

 

Awesome thanks for that test.

 

The 300 BK Has far greater sexual density.

It's got a better butthole coefficient as well but the energy is pretty close.

 

Good info!
I just put together a 300 BLK / AR 15 with a 16" barrel. The intent was subsonic loads for close range critters or, if necessary, home defense.
I was not impressed with the amount of "clang" the 200gr SMK bullets made when they hit a steel target. (powered by 11.4gr of RL 7.)

They did however make a total mess of 3 - 2 gal plastic cans filled with water, stacked back to back.
The copper jacket peeled off the lead and the lead broke into 10 pieces. All 3 jugs lost water and the first 2 were a mess.

I was hoping I'd stumble on someone doing a gel test on that caliber.
Thanks.

 

Great set up to eradicate destructive wild pigs.

 

I'd like to see a 300 subsonic test against 7.62x39 subsonic. I was dead set on a 300 pistol but I am considering going 7.62x39 but I haven't seen any good sub sonic tests of the 7.62. the price of ammo being the main driver for me. Both can be reloaded for close to the same price but I would need to buy/make 300 cases. I have a ton of 7.62 brass I've saved over the years.

 

300 blackout ballistics can be duplicated with the 7.62x39 and factory loaded subsonic ammo is available including a 182 grain load from PPU and a 196 grainload from Brown bear. Standard 762x39 barrel twists will stabilize heavy bullets and 762x39 supersonic ballistics are superior to 300 BK.

 

 

.300 Blackout is a pea shooter compared to .450 Bushmaster. Just sayin'.

 

.45 ACP has always had a problem with barrier penetration.

I’d be interested in seeing a side by side bare gel/clothing test though.

Not all of us are planning on shooting through car doors with a handgun round.

I agree with you about 45 ACP penetration. Many years ago, I shot someone with two Winchester Silvertip 45 ACPs out of a Colt Commander. One bullet went through the right rear passenger door window, through the drivers car seat and into the drivers back about 1.5 inches to the right of his spine. It only went in about 3 inches. The doctor was able to reach in with forceps and pull it back out. I had already shot him in the chest from the front. That bullet entered just to the right of his sternum and exited his right armpit. The exit hole was about the size of a half dollar. He was about 5'6" 130 pounds, no drugs or alcohol. Even though there was a lot of blood leaking out and a bullet hole through his right lung, he was able to throw his gun and the car keys out the window and then open the door and get out of the car. He told us later that he didn't know he had been shot when the first bullet hit him, but the second one felt like a hammer hit him in the back and he felt like he was going to pass out. That's when he decided to stop the stolen car he was driving and give up. He was an escaped convict.

 

That Underwood round in the .300 BO is all copper, isn't it? It's not surprising that it penetrated well through a metal barrier.

Comparing sectional densities:

0.451" 230 grain bullet = 0.16 lbs/in^2

0.308" 194 grain bullet = 0.29 lbs/in^2

Since this was a test of subsonic ammo, I'm going to guess that both bullets hit the gel at around 1050 feet/second.

I am impressed that the Underwood bullet fully expanded in only 3" of gel at such a low velocity. Even though the petals folded back, the bullet still measured at least 0.4" across the rest of the way through the target.

 

You do not want one.
The 300BO sucks.
Terrible round.
AR rifles and pistols will not feed the junk round.
It bounces off of Armadillos

I will continue to buy all of the 300 BO I can get my hands on to spare my fellow GTer’s the pain and agony of this terrible round.

 

i've seen gel tests where that bullet traveling subsonic expands and does not over penetrate. not an easy thing to do. nice to know it can punch thru too. thanks for sharing

 

I was having a discussion with a friend about subsonic 300 blackout and I was of the opinion that it was basically the same as a 45ACP and I didn’t like any of the ammo that was on the market for self defense.

So I decided I hadn’t done a JCN Ballistic test in a while...

My criticism of the 194gr Maximum Expansion subsonic Underwood round was that it was only good for gel blocks and I wasn’t convinced it would be any good with hard barriers. I also thought it would essentially perform the same as a 45ACP.

So I brought out my 45ACP Kriss Vector and my SBR 300 blk AR to test.

View attachment 827918

I set up a test wanting the 300 blk to fail. I put 3” of gel and then 2 pieces of 22ga steel at a 45 degree angle, then more gel.

View attachment 827920

So I tested and...

View attachment 827926 View attachment 827922

The Underwood round fully expanded in 3” gel and punched through the steel. Then went an additional 9.5” in gel past that!

View attachment 827924

The 45 didn’t make it past the steel.

Hit the “like” button if you like these tests. It’s been a while since I’ve done any.

Other tests are here:
JCN ballistic and random testing compilation master thread

What length barrel did you shoot that out of?

 

I was having a discussion with a friend about subsonic 300 blackout and I was of the opinion that it was basically the same as a 45ACP and I didn’t like any of the ammo that was on the market for self defense.

So I decided I hadn’t done a JCN Ballistic test in a while...

My criticism of the 194gr Maximum Expansion subsonic Underwood round was that it was only good for gel blocks and I wasn’t convinced it would be any good with hard barriers. I also thought it would essentially perform the same as a 45ACP.

So I brought out my 45ACP Kriss Vector and my SBR 300 blk AR to test.

View attachment 827918

I set up a test wanting the 300 blk to fail. I put 3” of gel and then 2 pieces of 22ga steel at a 45 degree angle, then more gel.

View attachment 827920

So I tested and...

View attachment 827926 View attachment 827922

The Underwood round fully expanded in 3” gel and punched through the steel. Then went an additional 9.5” in gel past that!

View attachment 827924

The 45 didn’t make it past the steel.

Hit the “like” button if you like these tests. It’s been a while since I’ve done any.

Other tests are here:
JCN ballistic and random testing compilation master thread

The .45 is a relic caliber better suited for a bygone era. If it were not for the nostalgia associated with the 1911 it would be long gone.

 

I am sure that the USMC MEUSOC will be interested in hearing from you so that they can correct their grave oversight.

The USMC is still using the M45A1 CQBP, a modified M1911A1 in .45 ACP (NSN 1005-01-370-7353), which began service with the MEUSOC Recon Battalions and Security and Emergency Services Battalions in 1985 and remains in service to this day.

 

Just to be clear here... We are talking both in 16" Carbine barrel lengths right? Both do have Sub and Super Sonic Ammunition availabilities. Right?