[DoctorStrange]

Looking for advice on 380 hollow point vs FMJ for SD. Tons of YT videos on ballistic tests but before I dig in and start reviewing I thought I would check with you all for opinions. From what I know from my research years ago one of the drawbacks on FMJ vs hollow point was greater muzzle flash on FMJ ammo than hollow point under low light, no light and temporary blindness for few seconds. I think I also recall reading somewhere that 380 hollow points don’t expand much unless hitting bone which increases penetration but not much expansion. Lastly my concern would be hollow point penetration through denim and leather. And then there is different types of ballistic gel, etc, etc. Don’t mind doing the research again but thought you all might weigh in. Thanks in advance.

Hornady Critical Defense apparently did well through clothing with their ballistic tip. They also reliably expand and penetrate I think 10 inches.

Check ShootingTheBull410 channel on YouTube. He did a comprehensive test of most 380 ammo out of short barrel pistols.

He said the Precision One XTPs did the best.

Hornady Critical Defense... 90 grain with good expansion and some penetration. I switched to it because I got tired of the +P Underwood with 90-grain Speer Gold Dots in my tiny Kahr P-380... like .357 Magnum in a 2" snubbie. I couldn't get as close to the center of the target as I can with the standard pressure loads.

I have the Critical Defense in my bodyguard .380.

 

[down-range]

There are 4 answers to your question (and the same 4 everytime it comes up):
1. FMJs because .380 JHPs don't expand, because that's the way it has always been.
2. Name brand ammo that goes bang and cycles reliably in their gun. Because more readily available, use it in other calibers, and it is from 1 of the major players so it must be good, right? Can't be bothered to look up or don't believe gel test results.
3. One of the reputable ammo makers, not necessarily one of the biggest, loading with the XTP bullet, or Federal Hydrashock (or their new "deep" version if it proves out). Looks up various gel testing results & relies on that plus function testing in their gun.
4. Boutique or some would say "hot rodded" version of one the above bullets to try to keep expansion but drive deeper penetration.

You can keep this list and copy & paste it when this question surfaces again ... and it will.

Well there you have it. All the years and years of research and testing by ballistic experts, FBI and other LE agencies, new gun owners, experienced gun owners and anyone else wanting to find the best 380 defensive self defense ammo, and here you have it, all the questions and answers anyone could possibly have all summed up in your single copy and paste reply. I can’t imagine anyone who reads your very detailed summary could possibly have any remaining unanswered questions. Where were you when the FBI and other LE agencies were doing all their 380 ammo research and testing? You could have saved them all a heck of a lot of time and effort.

 

[Ingermanland]

.380ACP underpenetrate = women cheat = cats are black

 

[DoctorStrange]

So what XTP bullet ammo is available right now?

What I said was -

You can't buy something that is not in stock -- having something now is better than an empty gun.

Name brand ammo is usually better than unknown manufacturer - quick question you want Underwood or Jerry's Ammo World?

Loaded hot - you would rather have weak spec ammo?

Decent price - pay $.85 so you shoot it once in a while or $3.99 a round so you don't?

It functions in your gun - always want to shoot my carry round -

But we sort of agree -

I have bought 250 rounds of Black Hills 380 ACP that uses the XTP bullet - I still have a few boxes left and when my P3AT in in my pocket it has this round -

Precision one xtp. Also Hornady XTP. Both available

 

[DoctorStrange]

Personally, I prefer truncated cone FMJ when it comes to .380. You may get over penetration, but you’ll at least get sufficient penetration. Of the JHPs, I’d trust the 90gr. Hornady Critical Defense FTX the most because it tends to actually expand, but sufficient penetration still strikes me as an iffy prospect.

All the .380 FMJs will penetrate sufficiently, and more. There’s no issue on that.

 

[DoctorStrange]

Because 380 underpenetrates. There are countless stories of hollow point 380s getting hung up in jackets. With such a weak round, you need as much penetration as possible. Avoid HP

In jackets? On YouTube they put such ideas to the test even with .22 short. .22 short zips right through leather jackets for example.

 

[DoctorStrange]

The guy gave it a good college try. He spent a lot of time and energy and money making those videos, and for that, he should be commended. He presented ammo's as "winners and losers" and have a big problem with that. Some of his "winners" are terrible rounds, for various reasons. And just like that, overnight, Precision One XTP rounds becomes a top seller. Those are garbage defensive rounds and never should have been put on a pedestal and paraded as "top quality, best in class" ammo. Its a joke. A dangerous joke.

Like I said earlier, garbage data in = garbage data out.

He posted those videos some 9 years ago at this point... time to move on and stop recommending or buying Precision One XTP rounds....

What do you find wrong with that round ?

I’m curious as well. What makes Precision One XTP crap ammo or a dangerous ammo? Has there been any studies or posts on this?

Right, it uses an XTP bullet that many other producers use. If it’s properly loaded, what’s wrong with it?

 

[down-range]

All the .380 FMJs will penetrate sufficiently, and more. There’s no issue on that.

With small wound channel. Unless the bullet tumbles or reverses.

 

[DoctorStrange]

With small wound channel. Unless the bullet tumbles or reverses.

Yes, but I was addressing a post. They said to get hard cast, no expansion rounds to get sufficient penetration. Don’t need to at least for two legged threats. FMJs will do that. I carry Hornady Critical Defense

 

[down-range]

Yes, but I was addressing a post. They said to get hard cast, no expansion rounds to get sufficient penetration. Don’t need to at least for two legged threats. FMJs will do that. I carry Hornady Critical Defense

Roger that. I was just adding to your comment. Not disagreeing. Apologies for any confusion

 

[DoctorStrange]

Roger that. I was just adding to your comment. Not disagreeing. Apologies for any confusion

Oh no worries. Funnily, I actually bought some .380 hardcast from Underwood just for the hell of it.

 

[pAZ Ron]

Well there you have it. All the years and years of research and testing by ballistic experts, FBI and other LE agencies, new gun owners, experienced gun owners and anyone else wanting to find the best 380 defensive self defense ammo, and here you have it, all the questions and answers anyone could possibly have all summed up in your single copy and paste reply. I can’t imagine anyone who reads your very detailed summary could possibly have any remaining unanswered questions. Where were you when the FBI and other LE agencies were doing all their 380 ammo research and testing? You could have saved them all a heck of a lot of time and effort.

My post was a categorization of the replies you got and that show up over and over on GT when this question is asked here ... not a summarization of research or experience. So it is actually more about the rationale for why people pick what they pick, how it repeats, and is predictable in every thread about it.

Hence my sarcasm that you could cut and paste in to categorize the replies anytime this question gets asked, which you joked about too. (Actually exciting to see something new in the new Federal load you mentioned and hope it proves out.)

It is fair to and feel free to show me which replies in this thread, or on previous "best .380 JHP" threads, are not close to one of the categories I listed. (Yes, I guess I missed the hard cast bullet option.)

(Yeah, I know I let my personal choice "bleed through" in the category descriptions. But I already gave that in a previous post anyway.)

(And to be sure to be clear, when I said "Don't worry about rehashing ..." in a previous post I was referring to your post 49. I was encouraging you to GO for rehashing it again and don't worry about the naysayers.)

Anyway, good luck with your choice, your wife's recovery, and best wishes that she is never in a situation where she is forced to use it.

 

[down-range]

My post was a categorization of the replies you got and that show up over and over on GT when this question is asked here ... not a summarization of anyone's research or experience. So it is actually more about the rationale for why people pick what they pick and how it repeats and is predictable in every thread about it.

It is fair to and feel free to show me which replies in this thread, or on previous "best .380 JHP" threads, don't fit in one of the 4 categories I listed. (Yes, I guess I missed the hard cast bullet option.)

(Yeah, I know I let my personal choice "bleed through" in the category descriptions. But I already gave that in a previous post anyway.)

Anyway, good luck with your choice.

With all respect sir, your reply said, and I quote: “there are 4 answers to your question (and the same 4 everytime it comes up)”. Ending with “You can keep this list and copy & paste it when this question surfaces again ... and it will”.

No offense but if your intent was to simply categorize all the 380 SD ammo questions past, present or future you could probably shorten your reply (category) to just “380 ammo for self defense”.

Seriously no offense intended. I’m sure you felt you were contributing. And your point about “research on GT works”, was valid.

 

[LocoGlockO]

I’ve had a small number of failure to feeds with the Hornady Critical Defense outta my LCP Max .380. Never had any issue with ball ammo. So i chose a 90 grain FMJ from PMC Bronze. Shoots well and have had failures with it.

 

[Railsplitter]

Looking for advice on 380 hollow point vs FMJ for SD. Tons of YT videos on ballistic tests but before I dig in and start reviewing I thought I would check with you all for opinions. From what I know from my research years ago one of the drawbacks on FMJ vs hollow point was greater muzzle flash on FMJ ammo than hollow point under low light, no light and temporary blindness for few seconds. I think I also recall reading somewhere that 380 hollow points don’t expand much unless hitting bone which increases penetration but not much expansion. Lastly my concern would be hollow point penetration through denim and leather. And then there is different types of ballistic gel, etc, etc. Don’t mind doing the research again but thought you all might weigh in. Thanks in advance.

If you want .380 ammo that makes any difference visit the Underwood Ammo web site. Then stop and ask yourself if you really want to depend on a little .380 if things get real.

 

[Bellygunner]

Hornady Critical Defense... 90 grain with good expansion and some penetration. I switched to it because I got tired of the +P Underwood with 90-grain Speer Gold Dots in my tiny Kahr P-380... like .357 Magnum in a 2" snubbie. I couldn't get as close to the center of the target as I can with the standard pressure loads.

I'm carrying it also, check lucky gunner labs, critical defence does well in 380 and above

 

[fattboyzz]

Click and watch this test.

 

[fastbolt]

I just use Winchester 'winclean' flat point 95 grain stuff and I don't lose any sleep over it.

If I wanna hot load a .380 I'll just pack a Sig 365 9mm (which is what I do!)

The simplest way to look at it.

If someone wants to try to overclock a .380 load in an attempt to make it approach a 9mmP ... why not just go with the 9 in the first place?

The only advantage to the caliber for me was that they finally started making ultra small, reliable plastic .380's that would fit where my 5-shot J's couldn't fit. Otherwise, I'd still not own a .380 pistol. I got out of the caliber toward the end of the 80's after a brief dalliance with a problematic Beretta 84F, and I never cared to spend the money on the Sig Sauers. (And I could buy a similarly sized 9, so why bother?)

 

[LaneP]

Click and watch this test.

Good stuff. That polymer cavity plug really does seem to assist in preventing nose plugging. In another test with 9mm Hornady Critical Duty, several common SD rounds plugged up when shooting through 4 layers of denim and behaved like solids, while the Critical Duty penetrated and expanded. I now carry that design in my 9mm EDC.

 

[Matteo1371]

Looking for advice on 380 hollow point vs FMJ for SD. Tons of YT videos on ballistic tests but before I dig in and start reviewing I thought I would check with you all for opinions. From what I know from my research years ago one of the drawbacks on FMJ vs hollow point was greater muzzle flash on FMJ ammo than hollow point under low light, no light and temporary blindness for few seconds. I think I also recall reading somewhere that 380 hollow points don’t expand much unless hitting bone which increases penetration but not much expansion. Lastly my concern would be hollow point penetration through denim and leather. And then there is different types of ballistic gel, etc, etc. Don’t mind doing the research again but thought you all might weigh in. Thanks in advance.

I’ve been impressed with the Hydra Shok Deep 380. It has routinely gotten proper expansion and adequate penetration