[marks_a_lot]

I’m having a problem with a load. I am getting squibs with my loads. I’ve had 2 out of 15 rounds leave the bullet in the bore.

I’m loading 5.5 gr of CFE Pistol with a 125 gr plated bullet in 38 Special. Hodgens reloading data starts at 5.2 gr.

I’m using a light crimp to avoid damaging the plating, the bullet has no cannelure.

Since I’m working up a lad I weigh each charge. The squib loads blow powder out the cylinder gap. This and the lack of recoil made me check the bore.

I’m wondering if the is too much free space in the case and the powder is shifting forward or if the crimp is letting the bullet loose before the powder ignites.

I loaded 50 rounds using the same primers and Unique powder. All fired normally.

Has anyone else encountered this?

 

[fredj338]

Pretty weird. I havent gotten into cfe pistol yet, but its possible the anti fouling coating they are using is retarding ignition at lower pressures? Also recheck your scale/powder measure, make sure you are getting 5.5gr. Some crimp is desirable for combustion, but with good neck tension, not as important. Are the plated 0.358"? Should be for 38sp.

 

[JBnTX]

I load a lot of CFE Pistol with cast bullets and light loads. I've never had any trouble with it.

 

[DWARREN123]

Sounds like you are getting light load/powder drop every once in awhile.

 

[marks_a_lot]

Sounds like you are getting light load/powder drop every once in awhile.

I was working up the load and each charge was weighed.

I wonder if a heavier bullet would make a difference>

 

[marks_a_lot]

What caliber are you loading? Everyone I've spoken to that uses it raves about it. But, they are loading 9mm, .40 or .45.

 

[dukeblue91]

I have been loading with CFE pistol for 9mm and .45 acp and never experienced anything like that in more then 5000 rounds made thus far.
There has to be something else causing the issue other then the powder.
Let us know if you figure it out.

 

[usnret]

You need to put a little more crimp on your rounds. Are you seating and crimping in separate steps, or do you seat and crimp all in one step? If you are doing it all in one step, sometimes you don't get an even crimp on the case.

 

[jdc606]

I get the feeling it's not your first attempt at reloading .38 Special. I went through a pound of CFE Pistol with 9mm and all worked well. Sounds like your crimp isn't strong enough. Primer explosion is pushing the bullet from the case before powder ignition. That's my guess.

 

[F106 Fan]

I would kick the load up to mid range, just because...

How certain are you of your scale? Do you have check weights? I would put a 5 gr check weight in the pan just to see.

 

[unclebob]

For S&G I would try every time you are go to fire the gun raise the muzzle straight up. To put the powder up against the primer.And see what happens.

 

[marks_a_lot]

I went back and crimped some rounds where the plated bullets showed a distinct ring when pulled. Went back to the range and shot a few more rounds.

The rounds had a noticeable increase in recoil. The first 15 shot fine. Number 16 stuck about 2 inches into the barrel. I think it may be too much space in the case allowing the powder to shift forward and fail to ignite.
It seems to burn clean and meters well. I'll try it in .45, but I think I'm done with it in 38.

 

[Steelburner]

I went back and crimped some rounds where the plated bullets showed a distinct ring when pulled. Went back to the range and shot a few more rounds.

The rounds had a noticeable increase in recoil. The first 15 shot fine. Number 16 stuck about 2 inches into the barrel. I think it may be too much space in the case allowing the powder to shift forward and fail to ignite.
It seems to burn clean and meters well. I'll try it in .45, but I think I'm done with it in 38.

Or you could fill the case almost full of corn meal/cream of wheat after you put your powder in the case, then seat your bullet, crimp it, and see what happens. This will keep your powder charge close to the primer. I'm with jdc606 in that your crimp may not be strong enough. A tight crimp is needed to let the pressure rise a bit before the bullet comes out of the case so that you get complete ignition of the powder charge. Make sure your cases are within spec, i.e., not shorter than 1.150" overall and best at 1.155". A short case won't crimp properly.

And be sure to put leftover powder back into its original container when you're through loading. Other than the safety reasons, it can pick up moisture in a high humidity area if left in a powder measure.

 

[HAMMERHEAD]

Some powders need a magnum primer.
I've seen the same thing happen in .38 spl with slow powders like HS-7 and standard primers.
Winchester WSPM primers are excellent with slow powders in 38 and 357.
Don't be shy with the crimp. I've used a firm profile crimp with plated, never a problem.

 

[marks_a_lot]

I loaded up another 20 rounds. I bumped the charge up to 5.9 grs. Max for lead is 6.2. I put a very solid crimp on the case and took them shooting. All 20 made it out of the barrel, that was a relief. The bullets impacted 6 to 8 inches lower than a comparable load with Unique and there was a lot of unburned powder.

I think I'm giving up on CFE Pistol in 38. I'd always be worrying about missing a squib and launching a round down a plugged bore.

Loaded some 45 ACP and they worked fine. I think the 38 case is too long for the volume of powder.

I'd be interested in hearing from anyone else giving it a try.

 

[Turn4811]

Interesting thread. I recently picked up a pound of CFE Pistol to try out. One of my range buddies that shoot 45ACP and 357SIG is raving about how much he likes it. I will be using it in 9mm and possibly 45GAP. I see plenty of suggested recipes for 9mm but only one published load for GAP in 200 grain. I will be playing with this over the next month.

 

[thomas15]

With your plated bullets there should be a ring in the plating from the crimp. True you don't want to damage the plating but there should still be a ring when you pull a bullet back out of the cartridge. Assuming that you are using a roll crimp the roll should be visable when you look at the cartridge.

Am I correct in my understanding that it is unburnt powder escaping through the B/C gap? I'm going to agree with the other poster that states you don't have enough crimp but I don't think it's just the power of the primer that is causing your problem.

I have a bunch of CFE pistol but haven't tried it yet. I have friends that are experienced handloaders and good marksmen and they like it. But in my opinion for bunny fart loads it's a bit on the slow side. I've loaded thousands of 38 bunny farts with plated 147g (.357 Xtreme RN) but I use a faster powder, either titegroup or N320 3.3g of either, I use Dillon 38 special seating and crimp dies, the crimp is really a taper crimp and I have had no problems with this and 1000s of rounds shot. But even with a taper crimp when I pull a bullet there is a ring in the plating.

ON EDIT: I wanted to add that while I have no complaints with using plated bullets in my revolvers, I'm starting to transition to coated bullets. But let me say this I have used plenty of Xtreme, Rainnier and Berries bullets with no problem. My 686 likes xtremes the best, I buy the .357 which xtreme consideres a 9mm bullet and have probably about 5 or 6 thousand that I need to load and shoot before I can go all out with coated. I say this because coated is softer than plated in my experience and you still get a crimp ring but I have had no problems with set back using a taper crimp.

 

[Turn4811]

I know you are running a revolver but in my 9mm I am getting my best groups at 2/10 grains below the recommended max load for 125 LCN using coated 125gr RN cast bullets. I have test loads for 124gr Barry's HBRN and a 124gr JHP that I will be testing Monday to see where they fall in as far as accuracy.

For 38 Special the 5.2 starting was for a Cast LRNFP. Hodgdon has Hornaday XTP 125gr starting at 5.4gr. With your plated 125gr check your crimp as others have said but I would also try working the load up a little higher. For the 124/125gr 9mm the recommended charge between the Barry's HBRN and the Cast LCN is 1/2 grain higher for the plated bullet at the starting and max points.

 

[norton]

I tried a load of CFE with mag primers and Hornady 180 grain bullets in .44 mag. Picked a mid range load from my latest Hodgdon manual. Found it to be very soft shooting from my S/W 629. It has been available in my neck of the woods lately when other powders have not.

 

[marks_a_lot]

I bumped the charge up to 5.9 grs. Max for lead is 6.2. I put a very solid crimp on the case and took them shooting.
Pulled bullets had a distinct ring and a solid roll crimp. I used the same box of primers with a load of Unique and it worked fine.
There was quite a bit of unburned powder out the BC gap and some in some of the cases.
I loaded some 45 ACP with the powder and they were fine. I used 230 plated bullets and a taper crimp. They were accurate and reasonable recoil. I liked the load. But, I still don't think I'll be running it in 38.
I plan on trying it in 9mm next week.