Should do well

 

I like the full size. It is a good pistol. Hopefully this is as well

 

Natural Glock 19 competitor, with some advantages. However, as a carry gun, the Hellcat Pro may make more sense (same capacity but noticeably smaller.)

 

For some of us, smaller than a G19 is less of an advantage.

 

Got to hold one yesterday. Feels nice but did notice the thumb rest was not as pronounced. Considering picking one up. Saw both the threaded barrel and non threaded.

Finestkind

 

It seems intriguing but I'm already overflowing with 9mm handguns that I don't use because the P365 covers the bases just fine.

 

Why not just release a compact frame for the FCU featured Echelon? Oh yeah…

 

I like the Echelon platform quite a bit actually, but don't own one. The biggest reason for me is no duty holster support. Safariland has one holster for the full size and it requires the use of an optic and WML. Not every agency uses or even allows the use of optics, and WML are optional. Good that they have a holster for using all of that, but they should have had some options for just the pistol.

I know there is a few options with retention from other manufactures, but I wouldn't exactly call them duty grade. Springfield touted the full size as an excellent duty pistol, but didn't plan for it's release to backup that statement.

I got to handle the 4.0 yesterday and I was very impressed, but again won't get one since there is no duty type holster support. I am very disappointed as I was really hoping Springfield would have gotten their stuff together with Safariland and the Echelon by now. May be some unseen issue between them, but if you want to get a pistol in the holster of LE, you need to have the options to do it.

Springfield is letting the momentum die with the Echelon, just like they did with the XD series.



TXPO

 

Move that period on the left side of the 4 and I might be interested

 

Nothing will beat the old and trusty Glock 19...

 

Yup. Got my hands on one of the samples. Felt bulkier than a 19 in the slide. Didn’t feel as good to me.

I’m sure it will be a great gun. Just no need in my house for it.

 

Well I broke down and ordered one. I've handled and shot the full size models and I was very impressed with them. The only thing keeping me from picking one up was the lack of duty holsters and not having a 4 inch version. Well the 4 inch version has been solved, and I found a Safariland holster with retention I can use for my duty purposes.

Time will tell how it shakes out, but the 4.0 versions attraction was too much for me. There is a lot to like about the Echelon, and if Springfield would just invest a little more into support, it could be a game changer for them.






TXPO

 

I've heard only great things about them. They're beautiful in my opinion.

 

Earlier this year, we visited a friend in MT and got a chance to shoot the full-size Echelon a bit. Not bad at all. I told him that I was not interested in duty/full size pistols, but if they came out with a compact 19 size one, it would interest me.

If I decide to go with a red dot, the compact Echelon or the SS MR920 (I've had a few Shadow Systems guns already and really like them...) would be at the top of my list.

Doubt I'll be switching guns at any point moving forward, I'm pretty happy with my current EDC, my WCV Gen 5 Glock 19, but who knows...

 

I’d argue one of the biggest things Glock has over Springfield is simplicity of design, price and availability of parts and ease of repair and maintenance.

 

The Glock is a simple design compared to almost all other striker fired pistols for sure. More parts do not always equal more chance for failure either, again referring to the XD pistols.

Price wise, if you take a Glock G19 MOS with night sights, the 4.0 cost is very comparable.

Parts and maintenance, yes the Glock wins out, but again, Glock have been around for 42 years, so it's to be expected parts would be readily available. Maintenance I can't say as the platform has been out such a short time, not sure how many Echelon series pistols have failed, if any. I haven't found any reports as of yet. Again based off the XD line and their durability, there is no reason to believe the Echelon would be any less durable or prone to breakages or failures.

One thing Glocks have done is conditioned owners to being used to having parts easily sourced and the ability to repair them easily. Yes that is an advantage if needed, but the flip side of that coin is, if a platform is able to perform for years and years, and thousands upon thousands of rounds without the need for repair, then parts and maintenance becomes far less of problem or need.

I have a Remington 1911 manufactured in 1943 that has digested well over 30 thousand rounds at this point in it's lifetime. My father and I have put those 30K rounds through it and no telling how many went through before he picked it up in the 60's. The only maintenance that has ever been done to it was replacing springs sets several times. Even though parts are easily found for 1911's, I haven't needed anything but spring for it. It's just one example I know, but it's a case in point.

The same can be said for my Glocks as well. I have quite a few extra parts for multiple Glock pistols all the way back to Gen2 guns, and haven't had to change anything out due to failures. Only springs sets in the gun and magazines. I'm sure I'll be able to source some spring kits for the Echelons before long.




TXPO

 

Glock really needs to improve upon the MOS system…SA appears to have mastered their approach.

 

Is the Echelon actually less "simple" than a Glock? It has the same controls (trigger, mag release, slide stop) so it's just as simple to shoot. Field stripping should be about the same as well, although I don't know if the Echelon needs to have its trigger pulled to field strip.

Are the Echelon's internals more complicated than a Glock's?

 

Trigger does not need to be pulled, and it will probably have more internal parts than a Glock. From what I have seen though, they don't appear to be small and fiddly like some of the 320's internals. I am intending on trying to host an Echelon Armorers course. I have reached out to them for more details.




TXPO

 

Not to mention Glock is easier because I already know it

 

Fresh off the delivery truck. It may seem like a simple thing ,but including a test target is something I really appreciate. Back when they were still the real Sig Sauer, they would include test targets with their pistols. It's just a nice touch, that give me the warm and fuzzies. Let the vetting process begin.

TXPO

 

Fresh off the delivery truck. It may seem like a simple thing ,but including a test target is something I really appreciate. Back when they were still the real Sig Sauer, they would include test targets with their pistols. It's just a nice touch, that give me the warm and fuzzies. Let the vetting process begin.

TXPO

Looking forward to your range report!

 

I have been debating buying a new 9mm but their are so many choices, what to do what to do?

 

Stopped off and put 50 rounds through it at lunch down and dirty. Zero issues as I had expected and hoped for. I didn't concentrate on accuracy this time as I was just trying to see how the reliability was out of the box, no cleaning and no lubrication. 30 rounds of Lawman 124 RN range ammo, and 20 rounds of Speer GD 124+p.

Everything fed perfectly and locked back on the empty magazines. I only loaded 10 rounds in the 15 and 18 round magazines specifically to check for the lock back issues that has been reported with some. I experienced none of that and I am suspecting it could be due to hand placement. The Echelon does have a soft reset when compared to Glock, but so do quite a few other pistols as well. I was wondering if this was going to be an issue for me, and happily is was not. The reset is so short, it is almost impossible to short stroke it. When I did a 10 round dump, it was perfectly controlled and I never had to hunt to the trigger break or reset. It just ran smooth and precise. When shooting one round ever second or two, it was very easy to feel the reset point.

The good thing is when it resets, your right on the wall again. It doesn't reset and then you have to take up the trigger again to find the wall. The trigger resets, and when you pull the trigger, the next shot goes off, the trigger doesn't move back at all. I very much like the trigger characteristics of the Echelon. It's better in every way except reset than my GPT/VEX setup. That soft reset has zero effect on performance for me, YMMV.

The grip on this is almost ridiculously small. I have dead square medium hands, and it feels small to me. Not in a bad way, but in a surprising way. It's almost like just wrapping your hand around a magazine. This is the smallest frame I have held on a pistol in this class. I suspect someone with a bit larger hands will want to upgrade to the medium or larger frames. For me, I am going to run this as is for a while. I have always loved my G43X/365 XL grips as they allow me a full hold, and give me the shortest trigger distance I can get just short of a 1911.

IMO the Echelon beats them, because your getting the same grip feel but in a duty sized pistol. One reviewer measured the grip circumference and it is in fact slightly smaller than the G43X/48 frame. The 43x always provides me with exceptional accuracy and performance because I can get so much of my hand fully wrapped around the grip. The Echelon 4.0 grip gives me that same feel. The contours of the grip feel very PPQ/PDP/VP9 ish, your hand melts into the grip. They did an excellent job on working out the ergos and massaging the design.

An interesting observation was the polymer the frame is made from. It feels like a polymer blend. It isn't quite as soft as a Glocks, and isn't near as rigid as the XD, VP9,PPQ, M&P, 320 etc. Their polymers are very rigid and in some cases has a hollow sound to them when you thump your finger against it. I makes them feel cheap IMO. You can flex the sides of the grip slightly and when you thump your finger against the Echelon's frame it has a muffled sound to it. This makes it feel more premium than most other polymer guns, especially the modular ones.

Yes this is virtually identical to the G19, and it is very obvious this gun was built to go head to head with it. I was excited when they announced the release of the 4.0 version of the Echelon. I did my best to hold back my enthusiasm because there have been a lot of releases over the past few years that always seem to fall short in some category that is important to me in a duty or carry pistol. This one so far hasn't disappointed at all, and seems to check every box in my criteria list.

I'll do some accuracy testing next time at the range to see how it does. As per my usual vetting, I will not clean or lubricate the pistol for at least another 500 rounds. When I plan on carrying a pistol I take it from the box, inspect it for anything unusual and then run it for 500 to 700 rounds before it get a cleaning and lubrication. If no issue pop during the initial run, then I call it GTG, since if it can perform 100% out of the box, it should perform the same after being properly cleaned and lubricated.

At this point, I'm calling this one a winner. I can tell you I will be shelving my G19's while I run this testing out. If things continue in the direction they are heading, some of my 19's may be looking for new homes, and Echelon will be replacing Glock in my duty holster.

TXPO

 

Stopped off and put 50 rounds through it at lunch down and dirty. Zero issues as I had expected and hoped for. I didn't concentrate on accuracy this time as I was just trying to see how the reliability was out of the box, no cleaning and no lubrication. 30 rounds of Lawman 124 RN range ammo, and 20 rounds of Speer GD 124+p.

Everything fed perfectly and locked back on the empty magazines. I only loaded 10 rounds in the 15 and 18 round magazines specifically to check for the lock back issues that has been reported with some. I experienced none of that and I am suspecting it could be due to hand placement. The Echelon does have a soft reset when compared to Glock, but so do quite a few other pistols as well. I was wondering if this was going to be an issue for me, and happily is was not. The reset is so short, it is almost impossible to short stroke it. When I did a 10 round dump, it was perfectly controlled and I never had to hunt to the trigger break or reset. It just ran smooth and precise. When shooting one round ever second or two, it was very easy to feel the reset point.

The good thing is when it resets, your right on the wall again. It doesn't reset and then you have to take up the trigger again to find the wall. The trigger resets, and when you pull the trigger, the next shot goes off, the trigger doesn't move back at all. I very much like the trigger characteristics of the Echelon. It's better in every way except reset than my GPT/VEX setup. That soft reset has zero effect on performance for me, YMMV.

The grip on this is almost ridiculously small. I have dead square medium hands, and it feels small to me. Not in a bad way, but in a surprising way. It's almost like just wrapping your hand around a magazine. This is the smallest frame I have held on a pistol in this class. I suspect someone with a bit larger hands will want to upgrade to the medium or larger frames. For me, I am going to run this as is for a while. I have always loved my G43X/365 XL grips as they allow me a full hold, and give me the shortest trigger distance I can get just short of a 1911.

IMO the Echelon beats them, because your getting the same grip feel but in a duty sized pistol. One reviewer measured the grip circumference and it is in fact slightly smaller than the G43X/48 frame. The 43x always provides me with exceptional accuracy and performance because I can get so much of my hand fully wrapped around the grip. The Echelon 4.0 grip gives me that same feel. The contours of the grip feel very PPQ/PDP/VP9 ish, your hand melts into the grip. They did an excellent job on working out the ergos and massaging the design.

An interesting observation was the polymer the frame is made from. It feels like a polymer blend. It isn't quite as soft as a Glocks, and isn't near as rigid as the XD, VP9,PPQ, M&P, 320 etc. Their polymers are very rigid and in some cases has a hollow sound to them when you thump your finger against it. I makes them feel cheap IMO. You can flex the sides of the grip slightly and when you thump your finger against the Echelon's frame it has a muffled sound to it. This makes it feel more premium than most other polymer guns, especially the modular ones.

Yes this is virtually identical to the G19, and it is very obvious this gun was built to go head to head with it. I was excited when they announced the release of the 4.0 version of the Echelon. I did my best to hold back my enthusiasm because there have been a lot of releases over the past few years that always seem to fall short in some category that is important to me in a duty or carry pistol. This one so far hasn't disappointed at all, and seems to check every box in my criteria list.

I'll do some accuracy testing next time at the range to see how it does. As per my usual vetting, I will not clean or lubricate the pistol for at least another 500 rounds. When I plan on carrying a pistol I take it from the box, inspect it for anything unusual and then run it for 500 to 700 rounds before it get a cleaning and lubrication. If no issue pop during the initial run, then I call it GTG, since if it can perform 100% out of the box, it should perform the same after being properly cleaned and lubricated.

At this point, I'm calling this one a winner. I can tell you I will be shelving my G19's while I run this testing out. If things continue in the direction they are heading, some of my 19's may be looking for new homes, and Echelon will be replacing Glock in my duty holster.

TXPO

Thanks for the initial impressions review. I had the chance to put my hands on one the other night at my LGS and share your thoughts on the grip. I'll be picking one up in the near future.

 

I have watched your postings for years and enjoy your details BUT don't quite understand your testing guns straight out of the box. The FIRST thing I do with a new gun is run home so that I can inspect, clean and properly lubricate and then get back to the range with it.

 

I have watched your postings for years and enjoy your details BUT don't quite understand your testing guns straight out of the box. The FIRST thing I do with a new gun is run home so that I can inspect, clean and properly lubricate and then get back to the range with it.

 

I inspect everything, field strip it looking for anything unusual and then put it back together and run it. I do all of that straight from the box.

I want to know if a pistol is going to run from the get go without doing anything to it. Builds a lot of confidence that way.

TXPO

 

Love my fullsize. No need to buy the compact for me

 

I agree with @TexasPOff about the grip module. I wear a LG glove and I was surprised at how small the grip felt in my hand. I would say it's about the same size as my G48. While I can shoot my G48 good, I shoot my G19 better, so I ordered the large module from SA and with the large module and the small back strap and I think it's perfect for my hand now.

 

My medium arrived and that with the small backstrap is perfect.

TXOPO

 

I got to handle one of these yesterday. I was struck my how small it was. This would definitely work as a carry gun.