[DAKA]

I had a Glock 43 for a year until selling it this week, just got a P365X to replace it. I also have a Ruger LCP II. Of these three, the P365X is best because of its concealability, ammo capacity, and I love SIG. The G43 is a great gun though it was initially snappy and needed about 1000 rounds to break in the trigger.

The LCP II is a .380 (just got a S&W Shield EZ .380 for me when I get older or want to gift it to my daughter) and is highly concealable. All are great guns, I think the 365X is just a little better overall. In South Florida, you could definitely get away with a .380 that will be highly concealable in the hot weather.

Minimal clothing on the beach = Ruger LCP II. Normal clothing everywhere else = P365X.

Another S FL problem is, If you do any boating you'll find rust on many guns after just a few days on the ocean...

 

[hogfish]

Another S FL problem is, If you do any boating you'll find rust on many guns after just a few days on the ocean...

That’s where the older Glock shines.

 

[GlockerBill]

https://th.bing.com/th/id/OIP.Meyu294fq7iIVy85otu8tQHaEK?w=315&h=180&c=7&o=5&dpr=2&pid=1.7[/IMG]

 

[Alex4]

y didn't, because they can't. Not without a complete redesign of the magazine. Which is why their 'answer' to the P365/Hellcat was the larger 43X and G48. Which wasn't a very good answer. Though they are serviceable pistols in their own right, they are limited in options and

Yes, I must say that answer indeed was strange, but looks like people are still buying them. But I do not believe, that complete redesign if the magazine to fit more rounds was out of engineering capabilities for them.

They have had massive, widespread issues. We've been talking recently in other threads about all the issues with slides flying off frames during live fire, jammng with WML, bad mags, sloppy QC and the list goes on and on.

Wondering, what are those issues? Did hear about bad 10-round mags for glock 17, 19, glock 42 early issues, and slide stop spring brakages, that have been solved for 43 and gen5 with new spring design as well as new trigger return spring.

 

[Alex4]

And Glock did some cost cutting measures- the discontinuing of the tennifer bath metal treatment vs the gas based treatments or example.

Yes, this is annoying - glock 43 finish is already scratched after a week of carry - my gen 2 glock 17 has much better finish. And also MIM strikers do not inspire confidence, though did not found may stories of breakage

 

[Para-bellum]

Yes, this is annoying - glock 43 finish is already scratched after a week of carry - my gen 2 glock 17 has much better finish. And also MIM strikers do not inspire confidence, though did not found may stories of breakage

I know many of my friends have rusted the 43s pretty bad

 

[Deputydave]

Wondering, what are those issues?

Where do I start without sounding like I’m bashing Glock? Gen 3/4 Glocks on 40 S&W jamming when mounted with a WML. We’ve been discussing this in another thread. Severe enough to cause more than one agency to drop those models and go to a different platform. Worst possible situation was several G22’s jamming during a multiple OIS. Breakage issues with early Gen 4 Glocks in 40S&W. Glock 19’s that had slides flying off during live fire. The whole NYPD situation requiring mobile armorer trucks. G42Daly mag issues. G36 jamming issues. I could go on and on. Point is that Glock is a perfectly serviceable pistol but it is a brand that has had issues that were severe in terms of function and reliability. Also QC issues with Gen 5 rear sights, badly cut out ambi slots etc. Again, like the brand.

 

[boilergonzo]

Glock has had small problems are a quick to correct it. It’s quality and reliability reputation was well earned. It’s just that the other companies have caught up to it. And Glock did some cost cutting measures- the discontinuing of the tennifer bath metal treatment vs the gas based treatments or example.

As noted earlier, Glock had major issues with their G22 for the Indiana State Police, sent folks in, denied issues, accepted it was an issue, couldn't resolve it, and a year later offered G17's (when the PD specifically wanted a larger caliber and had previously left 9mm) as the only option they could figure out. After years of support frustration, they went to SIG and bought the 227, which had a handful of issues out of the gate. SIG dropped in experts, took input, and resolved the matter in such a way that they have stated the difference in support was dramatic. So much so that they then issued the 365 to all of the ISP officers.

If you went around the country, I guarantee you can find people who went from SIG (or S&W, etc.) to Glock and were happy, and vice versa. One is NOT superior to the others, and all of them step in it on occasion. Years later, the Indianapolis Metro PD got the G17M's, and we all know how that fiasco went. It happens. And for every story like that, we can point to a 320 firing upon impact when dropped.

Around here, Glock is NOT known to quickly resolve things. They have a bit of a reputation for denying there are issues. Today, nobody debates the WML issue with the G22's. It is widely known and documented. But the ISP spent almost two years trying to convince Glock and get a fix wrangled out of them. Unresolved, they simply went with another platform, and have been quite pleased.

 

[walkinguf61]

Where do I start without sounding like I’m bashing Glock? Gen 3/4 Glocks on 40 S&W jamming when mounted with a WML. We’ve been discussing this in another thread. Severe enough to cause more than one agency to drop those models and go to a different platform. Worst possible situation was several G22’s jamming during a multiple OIS. Breakage issues with early Gen 4 Glocks in 40S&W. Glock 19’s that had slides flying off during live fire. The whole NYPD situation requiring mobile armorer trucks. G42Daly mag issues. G36 jamming issues. I could go on and on. Point is that Glock is a perfectly serviceable pistol but it is a brand that has had issues that were severe in terms of function and reliability. Also QC issues with Gen 5 rear sights, badly cut out ambi slots etc. Again, like the brand.

The NYPD mobile armorer trucks? It was just a trip to the range. You make it sound like they had to go to each precinct-lol. It was for a phase 3 malfunction which was rare ( not rare enough) and was unknown before the NYPD discovered it

The 40 caliber problem with the WML is a legit concern but really worked fine without the WML. It was the flexing of the frame with the light if I remember right.

Glock was always fast to address the issues overall. Hence the changes in mags for G42. Or the change in parts for the G43.

Glock perfection? It’s a work in progress sometimes.

I just think the other companies caught up in design features and surpassed in some features. They are conservative in changes since the revolutionary initial design.

 

[boilergonzo]

I have chosen 43 and here are my considerations.
Glock's main selling point, in my opinion, is bullet-proof reliability and durability. And I want to believe, that all their designs are made to forster those:
1) Plastic cover ensures sufficient amortisation and flexibility for magazine not to be damaged when droppped or deformed when seating on. Wondering if that would be the case with thin metal magazines;
2) Not overcompressed, strong springs ensure long term durability (in fact, they even increased number of coils in 02 mags);
3) in general, sig patent "The magazine tube defines a single-stack portion extending to an upper tube end with an upper tube opening. The magazine tube defines a double-stack portion positioned below the single-stack portion and extending to a bottom tube end with a bottom tube opening." really seems like a b#ll****, since similar mags have been done by russians for a long time (see 12 round makarov magazines), and they did have a reliability issues.
4) thin magwell walls - again, for durability. I personally have dropped pistols about 5 times during ~10 years of carrying. Wouldn't like that the handle just crqcks in similar situation.

I dont believe that such a big company as Glock did not have engineering capability to stack 4 more rounds in 43, they just coundn't wo compromising reliability and hence reputation. Others just didn't have what to loose, and no one would by 6-7 round hellcat or p365, so they had to do smtg

I am not sure where to start. I guess we start chronologically, and ask what a 1951 pistol magazine made by a country known for loose and cheap firearms has to do with a modern magazine. The 365 has been through a LOG of testing with my State PD, and they are thrilled with them. I haven't heard gripes about this issue from the nearly million sold, so... I guess the patent doesn't cause me any worry.

Plastic covers over thin steel better than steel mags? Cheaper, yes. But I trust my SIG or Mecgar mags, as much as I trust my Glock mags, and I certainly haven't ever bent any by sitting on them...

Springs... the gun works or it doesn't. Should we worry about 33-round Glock mags? 17-round Glock mags? If you start to hear 365 mags failing to feed, yeah! Investigate! But I'd worry more about three magazine designs, changes to springs, and multiple iterations of followers silently released without any information before I started fretting about the 365's springs.

Your points are fair to ask, but I just don't see any evidence or reason to suspect it is an issue. Glock didn't redesign their mag composition and gun (and settled for lower capacity) because they chose not to invest the money and time to do it. They don't need an excuse. The reason is profit, and they feel they will make more by spending less, and that folks will still buy lower capacity guns and make justifications for doing so. In that regard, Glock is really smart, and they are correct. Their gamble is working! And risked less money and garnered a higher profit margin than if they HAD put resources into closing the gap or making a leap forward.

All good! Glock makes great guns. And they like making money, just like SIG, S&W, and Lorcin!

 

[alnicoG22]

Yes, this is annoying - glock 43 finish is already scratched after a week of carry

Battle scars with no battle! You didn't have to pay extra!

 

[Deputydave]

The NYPD mobile armorer trucks? It was just a trip to the range. You make it sound like they had to go to each precinct-lol. It was for a phase 3 malfunction which was rare ( not rare enough) and was unknown before the NYPD discovered it

The 40 caliber problem with the WML is a legit concern but really worked fine without the WML. It was the flexing of the frame with the light if I remember right.

Glock was always fast to address the issues overall. Hence the changes in mags for G42. Or the change in parts for the G43.

Glock perfection? It’s a work in progress sometimes.

I just think the other companies caught up in design features and surpassed in some features. They are conservative in changes since the revolutionary initial design.

I feel like you're trying to make excuses for Glock's issue. I'm simply pointing out that Glock has had many over the years, and I've only listed a few to serve as example. Glock was fast on some issues, they were not fast on some issues. According to the agency armorer I reference in another thread, Glock actually tried to ignore and then down play a very serious issue with the G22, both with and without mounted WML. They finally sent reps down to test the weapons and only then did they admit to the issues. But again, they downplayed it as being restricted to a certain narrow serial number range. We know now that was not the case. It was serious enough that the entire agency switched platforms.

So I'm not 'hating' on Glock but the question was asked what some of the issues have been. I've only touched on some. Doesn't invalidate Glock as a whole. But they deserve the same critical evaluation as any other brand. Have they had serious issues? Yes. Have they had dangerous issues? Yes. Have they had suspect QC? Yes. Do they make a generally serviceable firearm? Yes.

 

[Borg Warner]

Looking for a new EDC, I've been carrying my Shield as EDC, and sometimes BG 380 (pocket)
but I started researching other "mini" 9's
Reasons for which to buy which one, (this is for south FL so small is key)

Ideally you should try shooting each one and see which one you like the best. If not just handle them all to see which one feels best in your hands and which would be easiest to conceal.

I've shot the G43 and the Shield and the P365 and the Hellcat. And I liked the Shield better than the G43 but the G43 was smaller and lighter and I liked the trigger better. But the Shield was available in 40 caliber and I liked that better. Between the Hellcat and the Sig, I liked the feel of the Hellcat better andI liked the trigger better. But although the Sig was slightly smaller, I really didn't like the trigger

I haven't got to even look at the Shield plus but that one might end up being the best of all since I liked the Shield and the plus is almost the same dimensions and If they made it in 40 caliber and it was no larger than the 9mm that would be nice. A lot of people complain that they can't shoot these guns as well as larger guns but that just means you need to practice more. I know ammo isn't easy to get but it's only going to get worse so start reloading and shooting now while you still can.

 

[Velvetfoot]

I like the fact that the Sig p365 slide is stainless under that nitron finish.
Also, although not my thing, you can economically buy another grip module and customize to your heart's content (and fail) since the serial number is part of the fcu.

 

[walkinguf61]

I feel like you're trying to make excuses for Glock's issue. I'm simply pointing out that Glock has had many over the years, and I've only listed a few to serve as example. Glock was fast on some issues, they were not fast on some issues. According to the agency armorer I reference in another thread, Glock actually tried to ignore and then down play a very serious issue with the G22, both with and without mounted WML. They finally sent reps down to test the weapons and only then did they admit to the issues. But again, they downplayed it as being restricted to a certain narrow serial number range. We know now that was not the case. It was serious enough that the entire agency switched platforms.

So I'm not 'hating' on Glock but the question was asked what some of the issues have been. I've only touched on some. Doesn't invalidate Glock as a whole. But they deserve the same critical evaluation as any other brand. Have they had serious issues? Yes. Have they had dangerous issues? Yes. Have they had suspect QC? Yes. Do they make a generally serviceable firearm? Yes.

I am just comparing them to other gun companies. Take Sig and the rust issues. The “ F”ing gun would go from its normal metal color to rust orange from one tour on a foot post on a rainy day.
They got pulled out of service multiple times in multiple years.
Smith and Wesson quality control got so bad that the hike going down barrel on the last batch of service weapons from them was not straight in the center. The wall on one side of the barrel was visibly thicker on one side

And I am just saying the Glock was quick to fix the problem in my experience and in my department’s experience. Maybe it’s because the NYPD is their biggest customer. More than 50,000 glocks . One thousand to three thousand glocks per academy class on average ( some smaller classes) . And other local LE agencies will only issue what the NYPD uses.

And I am not making excuses for Glock. I have said their quality has gone down and the other companies have caught up. I switched rom the G26 to the M&P shield as my off duty gun before I retired. The G43 didn’t pass the NYPD reliability test of 5000 124+p gold dot rounds and the shield did.

But Glock has always been fast compared to other companies with a redesign of a part to address a problem. Just look at the spring changes over the years or just on the G43

 

[Deputydave]

I am just comparing them to other gun companies.

And that was my point as well.

Take Sig and the rust issues. The “ F”ing gun would go from its normal metal color to rust orange from one tour on a foot post on a rainy day.

Agreed. Something about the rear sight on some of the early P365's. My buddy carried one in his vest as a BUG and it developed rust on the side of the rear sight. Not the first time I've heard that complaint. So far mine is fine, but I also wear an undershirt.

Smith and Wesson quality control got so bad that the hike going down barrel on the last batch of service weapons from them was not straight in the center. The wall on one side of the barrel was visibly thicker on one side

Yep. Had a 640 that came new with a hair line crack along the barrel. Almost unnoticeable but had to be replaced by the factory. And I had only fired a few cylinders of 38 Special through it.

And I am just saying the Glock was quick to fix the problem in my experience and in my department’s experience. Maybe it’s because the NYPD is their biggest customer. More than 50,000 glocks . One thousand to three thousand glocks per academy class on average ( some smaller classes) . And other local LE agencies will only issue what the NYPD uses.

And I would fully expect Glock to be Johnny-on-the-spot for NYPD. Unfortunately, it just wasn't the case with a smaller, local agency (about 500 sworn). But it ended well, they went with the G21 which is what we have had such good success with for nearly 20 years.

 

[Para-bellum]

My first 365 has rust on the sights/mags and mag release. I never carry without an under shirt. I’d still carry a 365 over any of glocks carry options...just saying.

I like the shield plus best of all the micros by a large margin.

 

[walkinguf61]

My first 365 has rust on the sights/mags and mag release. I never carry without an under shirt. I’d still carry a 365 over any of glocks carry options...just saying.

I like the shield plus best of all the micros by a large margin.

I never carry the gun to bare skin but the rust issues over the years turned me off to Sig. It’s not just the

That’s the great thing about glocks. The lack of the need of constant maintenance some other guns ask for. Other gun companies have models that are low maintenance but all glocks fit that description. Low maintenance does not mean no maintenance. A concept some of my fellow cops don’t always seem to understand-lol

 

[Para-bellum]

I never carry the gun to bare skin but the rust issues over the years turned me off to Sig. It’s not just the

That’s the great thing about glocks. The lack of the need of constant maintenance some other guns ask for. Other gun companies have models that are low maintenance but all glocks fit that description. Low maintenance does not mean no maintenance. A concept some of my fellow cops don’t always seem to understand-lol

While I agree Glocks are some of the lowest maintenance requiring pistols, I have seen first hand some pretty rusty Glocks. My Sig was still new when the rust started and I do live by the ocean but it never saw salt water and I don’t carry with an undershirt and holster to separate any sweat that may occur. I also wipe all my pistols down with a light coat of oil from time to time to prevent this. My Sig just seemed to have issues from the start.

 

[Pontoof]

Chose the 365XL. Wasn't sure if I wanted a red dot on it so I got one for optics and one with irons,for now. 100 rounds 124gr fmj;50 rounds 147 HST thru each. No problems.

Only been carrying the XL for a few weeks bc I had to wait on a Sparks holster. Got both XLs in October 2020,both finished same month. Ordered the holster just before Thanksgiving IIRC.

XL is nice to carry with either 12 or 15 round mags. One of the easiest guns for me to get a Master grip on quickly;can shoot it well,like the trigger/sights. Did a preemptive strike on the rust wiping down heat-gun hot with Froglube. No rust problems so far;no undershirt;humid environment.

Been carrying the G19 so long; and it is easy for me to conceal/shoot. Keeping my 19s.They are just too good. Keeping the XLs for now. Time will tell.