Guns beat arrows.

 

One of the earliest bear vs man stories I remember reading included a picture of a partially eaten man with a .38 special he had emptied in defense.

I'm going to want more gun.

 

One of the earliest bear vs man stories I remember reading included a picture of a partially eaten man with a .38 special he had emptied in defense.

One of the earliest bear vs (wo)man stories I remember reading included a picture of a maybe 110# woman holding the single shot 22lr she used to kill a world record Grizzly Bear

I'm going to want more gun.

All the gun in the world doesn't make up for poor placement



















Oh and PS...
My story included evidence that it actually happened

 

.30 Carbine, which I’m told is insufficient for home defense…

 

For a second….

I thought that was Lee Harvey Oswald.

 

I am torn between: (1) "anybody that took down a grizzly bear with 3 rounds of .38 special is a hell of a shot" and (2) "anybody that goes into the woods with a .38 special for a backup gun isn't a shooter."

 

It sucks that fish and game officers treat it as a crime scene and gather evidence and photos and then even submit it to the US attorney for review. That kind of treatment almost makes a man want to shoot a bear to stay alive and then depart the area and keep his mouth shut.

 

No way that should have been submitted to the USAO for prosecutorial review.

 

Can the .22 or .38 calibers stop a bear?

Apparently yes.


Should a .22 or .38 be a guys first caliber of choice as a defensive gun in bear country?

They wouldn't be mine...

 

This 38+p ammo is nothing to sneeze at

38 Special +P 158gr. Keith Black Cherry Coated Hard Cast Hunting Ammo

Underwood Ammo offers the most comprehensive and innovative Underwood Ammo™ Supersonic Handgun Ammo for personal defense & hunting. Shop now .38 Special +P Lead ammo with Hi-Tek Coated Hard Cast.

www.underwoodammo.com

BALLISTICS INFORMATION
Muzzle Energy (ft. lbs) : 548
Muzzle Velocity (fps) : 1,250
Sectional Density : 0.180

Is it my first choice for shooting a bear? No. It’s not even my third choice. But it’s better than nothing.

The two hunters in the OP were bow hunting. The handgun was not the focus of the trip. I get why they had a 38. When I’m bow hunting, I don’t want to cart along an 8” 44 mag loaded with horse pellets.

And again, as we’ve seen over and over; shot placement, not caliber gets the job done.

 

30 carbine is a crazy round. It was used with some success as a military cartridge, that little full metal jacket bullet is driven pretty fast and penetrates well. It’s defensive use is far from stellar. Penetration in a Grizzly is useful…

 

30 carbine is a crazy round. It was used with some great success as a military cartridge, that little full metal jacket bullet is driven pretty fast and penetrates well. It’s defensive use is far from has been proven stellar. Penetration in a Grizzly is useful…

FIFY

 

I add this to "Bear gun/attacks" posts.

To the best of my knowledge, this is the most comprehensive study on the above, if you know of one that is more comprehensive, please post it.

Update: Handgun or Pistol Against Bear Attack: 93 cases, 97% Effective (ammoland.com)

 

but... a revolver is comparatively capacity deficient compared to a semi.

Would I rather defend myself with 38 special revolver or Glock 19? Glock 19, no contest.
But CDW4ME how about for a "quick trip to the store" in a "good area" - Glock 19 still.

In before a revolver can be shot from a coat pocket; LOL Okay, carry it as a 2nd gun.

 

I believe I read a year or two ago that a guy killed a big Alaskan bear with a 5.45 AK…

 

Even .22 lr might do the job, but....I wouldn't dare to step into brown bear country without at least .454 casull in my holster.

 

50 years ago a New York City cop killed a polar bear attacking a citizen with one shot from his .38 Special.

One Shot, One Kill.

 

Only in New York or on the island of “Lost” would the same police department deal with a polar bear and a tiger in the middle of the city.

 

How would we know the bear wasn't infected with COVID? With COVID, any caliber will do. It is just another COVID death.

 

I’ll take a .38 special over giving the bear a wet willy as it’s gnawing my arm off.

 

I suppose we should ask a recent GT question to the bear - "Does the snub .38 still have relevance?"

 

My thoughts (which are usually in the minority and naively ignored):
38 snub: it's all you have - okay
38 snub: its cold and I carry it in a pocket plus another gun in pocket or on belt - okay
38 snub: I have to tuck my shirt for work and 38 snub conceals in pocket - okay

Lets say we own a 38 snub and a 9mm 365 / Shield / Glock - which we shoot better.
38 snub: "quick trip to the store" in a "good area" - No. Carry what you shoot better.
38 snub: I don't have to tuck my shirt but want to - No. Stop unrequired shirt tucking.
38 snub: Like the convenience of lackadaisically sticking it in my pocket - Do better.

 

"At this point, Hunter One had drawn his .38 revolver. He fired two shots as the bear attacked Hunter two. The bear disengaged from Hunter Two, fell down, and started to come up toward Hunter One. Hunter One fired another shot at the bear, and it went down for good. Hunter One reported all shots were fired from six feet or less. "

"The Wyoming F&G personnel recovered three fired .38 Special cases at the site. They recovered three .38 caliber bullets. None had exited the bear. From the picture, they appear to be 150-160 grain jacketed bullets. Two of the bullets were relatively undamaged. One bullet was significantly deformed, apparently from hitting the bear’s spine. This was probably the killing shot. All bullets had entered the bear from the front half. "

So a spine shot... yea that would do it. So folks, you think you can do a spine shot on an enraged bear at 6 ft? Possible.. but are you gonna bank on that?

I'll still take my 10mm, or .44 magnum, or better yet, 12 gauge with Black Magic slugs.

 

So folks, you think you can do a spine shot on an enraged bear at 6 ft? Possible.. but are you gonna bank on that?

I'll still take my 10mm, or .44 magnum, or better yet, 12 gauge with Black Magic slugs.

What will a 10mm/44 magnum shot that misses the CVS/CNS do...
That a miss to the CVS/CNS with a 38/357/9/40/45 wont do?

 

I’d say it makes the 357mag with the right ammo look pretty good.

 

I think I would crap my pants armed only with a handgun against a bear

 

I ain't fightin' no bear with a .38, I'm just gonna run faster'n whoever I'm with!

 

I didn’t see that the report described what handgun was used other than .38 revolver, not that I’m not impressed with how the hunters manages this situation, but I’d be especially impressed to learn that the guy was carrying a S&W 642 or Ruger LCR. The report only said that the rounds recovered were 150-160 grain jacketed bullets. Makes me wonder if the revolver was loaded with garden variety 158 grain jacketed target ammo, which would probably penetrate deeply until it struck something hard or just ran out of steam in a thick medium, i.e. bear torso.

 

U.S.A. –-(AmmoLand.com)-– This article is part of a continuing series of defensive bear shootings discovered through a Freedom of Information Act request by AmmoLand. It appears these events were not reported in other media.

Perhaps they figured it was best to keep it quiet in order to keep other idiots from deciding to choose a .38 for bear protection.

 

You guys see a lot of bears where you live?

 

I live near the black bear Capitol of Michigan and work in the woods.
I see maybe 2 per year if I'm lucky and most of the time they're beating feet.
Sometimes one will stop and look back.
Closest I ever got to one was when I was bass fishing one morning and snuck up on one on shore with the trolling motor.
Got about 20 feet away and then he saw me.
They can disappear fast!

 

Why on earth is bear defense such a huge concern on the gun forums? Why is it never Moose, or Elk, or whatever else? I understand for those that live in areas where a brown bear might be rummaging through your garbage, but for the overwhelming majority of us... what are the odds?

If you’re planning a trip into brown bear territory, take a 12 gauge loaded with slugs, or a .45/70, and something like a .44 Magnum or larger loaded with hard cast ammunition as a backup. The rest of us who might at worst have to contend with a black bear on a highly unlikely occasion can probably get by with the same 9mm that we’d carry to Wal-Mart.

 

As I have noted on this forum on prior occasions, the great majority of people in the woods at any given time are not carrying guns of any type. Hikers, campers, photographers, tree huggers etc rarely carry guns. I know several people who hike and camp on a regular basis about half don't even own a gun and the others just look confused when asked if they carry a gun when hiking. I am not sure where this ideal came from that you need to carry a hand cannon when in the woods.

My SD calibers both in and out of the woods are 357 Sig and .40.

 

Just be glad you don't live in Tahoe. Killing a bear around here, for ANY reason, will get you tarred and feathered.

South Lake Tahoe bear "Hank the Tank" gaining world-wide attention

SOUTH LAKE TAHOE, Calif. - The 500-lb black bear known for breaking into Tahoe Keys homes is gaining worldwide attention after the California Department of Fish and Wildlife (CDFW) positioned traps in the neighborhood to try and catch him.

southtahoenow.com