Ebay is the only reason this project started lol...

But I’m looking forward to this. Having a couple grains more capacity than the Dillon round and the wsm style case should make for some interesting numbers with the slow powders!

 

That's what I was going to ask, if by 'the Dillon round' you're referring to the 9x25 Dillon. Do the .38 Casull's numbers surpass it (fps/fpe)?

The 9x25's numbers are already pretty impressive from the Glock 20 platform, although I don't know if any of the aftermarket barrel makers have yet offered a 6.2" 9x25 tube for use in the long-slide G40 MOS.

 

That is very impressive! Good luck on the project.

 

Wow! That is some smokin round. I know the trajectory has to be pretty flat with bullet moving that fast.
It looks a big 357 Sig case. Love the sharp shoulder on the case. I know it will be a real thumper. Interested to see what es350 excellent brakes will do to tame the recoil on this
caliber.

 

Looking forward to the development of this cartridge in a Glock. I have thought about it for years. But here it is in reality. Very cool.

 

I'd like a 50 G.I. wildcat except starting with a 458 socom case. Or have Mr. Coonan design a G20 magazine that would feed 10mm magnum cases. I've been using trimmed 10mm mag cases and i prefer them now.

 

Nice to see some interest in the 38/45 ,

Here is a couple pics of the brake roughed out and fitted to barrel.
As can be seen in pics barrel is threaded inside slide and will lockup on the outside of brake in end of slide, same as a cone comp on a 1911.
Hopefully will be testing/ continuing load development by this weekend.

 

Very cool!!

 

Subscribed.

 

+1

Sent from a mental institution

 

Im interested. Now where to find a 9 mm barrel for my 41.

 

That is a cool setup. Some impressive numbers.

 

Is it based on an acp case or win mag?

 

I've used a Model 21 .38 Casull since 2003. As I understand it, the original case was based on the mag. I use factory brass for full-house loads, but form normal .45 acp cases for target loads. They end up shorter than factory, so I do believe them that the original parent was the mag.

 

Based on the ACP case. It’s sized down in 2 steps, first to 400 corbon then to 38/45.

 

The 38/45 auto has been done years ago. Now if you could find you and old Grizzle 45 Mag and necked it down to 357?

How much case length do you lose when you neck down 45 ACP brass? If you do you could make the length by use rife brass such as 308 and cutting it as long as you can and get it to fit pistol.

You did say you like to experiment:supergrin:

This reminds me how gunsmiths would take a big N frame Smith & Wesson revolver in 357 Magnum. Find an extra 357 cylinder and bore it out to the 357/44 Bains Davis. The reason I remember these old gun magazine articles? They were getting 1800+ fps with 158 jacketed bullets.

 

Nice work guys! Be curious to see what she'll do with the 158 and 180gr XTP. With BC's of .206 and .230 respectively and great sectional density could be the ultimate handgun hunting round. I can easily get 1200fps out of the sig with 180 so maybe 1300-1350 with the 38 weatherby?

Subscribed!

 

Wyoming:
I'll have to measure the cases when I get home but I know last time I measured the 38s they weren't much shorter than the standard 45 case.

CT:
Loading the 357sig long to 1.270" with 180gr cast wfn bullets I've surpassed 1450fps in a 6" g20 barrel with 800x. The 38wby should be very impressive but I believe 800x will be too fast with it so ill have to step to the slower powders to wring out what's possible.

 

It looks like you’ve pretty much duplicated .30 carbine ballistics in a pistol. [emoji3]

 

subed!

 

The 38/45 auto has been done years ago. Now if you could find you and old Grizzle 45 Mag and necked it down to 357?

How much case length do you lose when you neck down 45 ACP brass? If you do you could make the length by use rife brass such as 308 and cutting it as long as you can and get it to fit pistol.

You did say you like to experiment:supergrin:

This reminds me how gunsmiths would take a big N frame Smith & Wesson revolver in 357 Magnum. Find an extra 357 cylinder and bore it out to the 357/44 Bains Davis. The reason I remember these old gun magazine articles? They were getting 1800+ fps with 158 jacketed bullets.

"Now if you could find you and old Grizzly 45 Mag and necked it down to 357?"

That would be the L.A.R .357/.45 GWM (Grizzly Wildey Magnum). It is very similar to the 40 super except that the smaller lighter 357 bullets will register higher numbers on the chronograph which impresses a lot of people. It would be much more usefull with heavier bullets. However, th case would have to be shortened to be able to fit in a G21 magazine.

I was interested in the 40 super for a while until I heard they had feeding problems with G21 magazines because the bottleneck cases tend to do a nose dive. the 40 super us the 45 win mag case shortened and necked down to 10mm. Dies are available but they are expensive, but not as expensive as custom dies for a wildcat cartridge

LAR Grizzly Win Mag - Wikipedia

 

Nothing is new anymore.:fred:

 

Forty years ago I had a 44 auto mag with a 6.5'' barrel
and an extra upper in 357 Auto mag with a 8.5'' barrel,
did not have a chronograph then.

This is what it looked like, had different grips though,

https://picturearchive.gunauction.c...gunauction.com/504669/8048843/001a_auto_mag_357-44_wbox_left.jpg_thumbnail1.jpg

The 357 auto mag brass was made from 308 winchester or 30-06 brass,
same as the 44 amp brass.

This was what the 44 AMP looked like

 

Just measured the length of the 38/45 compared to the standard 45. Both federal cases, 45 measured .888" and the 38/45 was .882"

 

Very interested to see how these feed in the 13rnd G21 mags. I have a .40 Super that is a bit of a nightmare with standard magazines.

 

I have not shot this set up very much ( not enough hrs in a day) and have not loaded more than 3-4 in mag at a time during load development. But has fed every time without problems ... so far...

On your 40 Super, what kind of distance are your emptied being ejected from gun?

Have not played with 40 Super at all but have dabled with 400 Corbon in a 30.
Feeding was fine with Corbon running a 23 lb rsa.
Nose down jam is normally a sign of weak mag spring or slide speed to fast.
Heavy for caliber (should not be an issue in 40 Super) bullets make this worse... like 255 + in 45 SUPER.

 

The only bottleneck round I've extensively tested has been the Sig in a g20 conversion barrel in my longslide. I use the stock g20 10mm mags and haven't had any issues thus far but I'm using a heavy slide and spring which may help with the nose diving.

 

Nice project! I'll keep my eye on this.

I wonder if anybody with a 9x25 Dillon has used actual .357" bullets? Surely they have. I know using actual .357" bullets in the 357 SIG has got me some pretty good results. From 5" and 6" KKM barrels:
5" KKM .357 SIG
125gr XTP, 10.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,618 AVG - 37.42 ES - 26.17 SD
140gr XTP, 9.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,456 AVG - 30.84 ES - 21.93 SD
158gr XTP, 9.0gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,388 AVG - 8.12 ES - 5.65 SD

6" KKM .357 SIG
125gr XTP, 10.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,693 AVG - 13.02 ES - 9.21 SD
140gr XTP, 9.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,541 AVG - 12.76 ES - 9.21 SD
158gr XTP, 9.0gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,442 AVG - 11.69 ES - 8.48 SD

If someone could play around with 10mm brass and improve on the initial design of the 9x25, maybe a sharper shoulder to increase case capacity or something like that, it might help out some, of course you'd have to cut out the chamber to accommodate different brass. But if so, you should be able to top the above numbers by at least another 100 -150fps, plus feeding should be good from stock 10mm mags, not to mention the slight bump in capacity vs. using a fatter .45 bottom end.

I like the idea of sticking with actual .357" bullets because for the most part, they're tough enough to handle a good bit of speed.

 

Nice project! I'll keep my eye on this.

I wonder if anybody with a 9x25 Dillon has used actual .357" bullets? Surely they have. I know using actual .357" bullets in the 357 SIG has got me some pretty good results. From 5" and 6" KKM barrels:
5" KKM .357 SIG
125gr XTP, 10.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,618 AVG - 37.42 ES - 26.17 SD
140gr XTP, 9.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,456 AVG - 30.84 ES - 21.93 SD
158gr XTP, 9.0gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,388 AVG - 8.12 ES - 5.65 SD

6" KKM .357 SIG
125gr XTP, 10.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,693 AVG - 13.02 ES - 9.21 SD
140gr XTP, 9.5gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,541 AVG - 12.76 ES - 9.21 SD
158gr XTP, 9.0gr 800x @ 1.140": 1,442 AVG - 11.69 ES - 8.48 SD

If someone could play around with 10mm brass and improve on the initial design of the 9x25, maybe a sharper shoulder to increase case capacity or something like that, it might help out some, of course you'd have to cut out the chamber to accommodate different brass. But if so, you should be able to top the above numbers by at least another 100 -150fps, plus feeding should be good from stock 10mm mags, not to mention the slight bump in capacity vs. using a fatter .45 bottom end.

I like the idea of sticking with actual .357" bullets because for the most part, they're tough enough to handle a good bit of speed.

I'd call that a 9x25 Dillon Ackley improved

 

Not a great illustration, but perhaps a bit shorter neck to increase case capacity, although I'm not sure how much it'll effect bullet setback due to having somewhat less neck tension, but it would look roughly like:

Std. 9x25 on the right, my poor rendition on the left