[MarkCO]

Um, let's back up a step with the English language.

You say I will be lucky to get 19 grains of powder in a case with an 80 grain .223, I tell you I get 19 grains under a 220 grain slug and you think that proves your point?

I tell you I am pushing a 107 grain 6.5 bullet at 2620, which has a BC of .590 and SD of .259, but you are still claiming that your 117 (with a BC of .390 and SD of .253) 6.8 has a higher BC and better SD? What kind of math do you use Big Bird?

I have no problem discussing the relative merits and or demerits of calibers and platforms, but you can't pull stuff out of thin air and make it stick, especially when it is wrong. If you are invested in the 6.8, that is great, but do not claim facts based on your use of liberal math and logic patterns.

 

[Constructor]

Um, let's back up a step with the English language.

You say I will be lucky to get 19 grains of powder in a case with an 80 grain .223, I tell you I get 19 grains under a 220 grain slug and you think that proves your point?

I tell you I am pushing a 107 grain 6.5 bullet at 2620, which has a BC of .590 and SD of .259, but you are still claiming that your 117 (with a BC of .390 and SD of .253) 6.8 has a higher BC and better SD? What kind of math do you use Big Bird?

I have no problem discussing the relative merits and or demerits of calibers and platforms, but you can't pull stuff out of thin air and make it stick, especially when it is wrong. If you are invested in the 6.8, that is great, but do not claim facts based on your use of liberal math and logic patterns.

He's talking about sticking the longest high BC bullets in the case to shoot targets. Most are using hunting bullets so they can get more powder in the case with a short hunting bullet than he can with a long VLD. The numbers posted are no lie. The numbers they are getting is all that matters, who cares how much powder it takes to get it there. It's already been done and those are the numbers.

 

[Constructor]

No matter what bullet you stick in the thing about the most powder of any kind that you can stuff in a 5.56 case is around 20 grains.

A 6.8 case will hold 32-34 grains of powder. You can drive a 90 grain bullet in a 6.8 around 3000 fps in a 16 inch barrel without breaking a sweat.

Yeah. You need a new $68 bolt and different magazines.

This is a specialty round and I doubt you'll be bumping magazines full of the stuff.

The whole idea of a necked up round based on the 5.56 case has been around for 30 years

It was tried back in the 80s when handgun silhouette shooters started using rounds like the 7mm TCU with variations in nearly every caliber. They universally found the cartridges underperformed on metallic targets and game at ranges more than 150-200 yards

Looks like Jw has proved you wrong he has 23.4 gr in that case and I've been using 24.5gr RE15 behind 69gr SMks for about 20 years.

 

[vafish]

No matter what bullet you stick in the thing about the most powder of any kind that you can stuff in a 5.56 case is around 20 grains.

I load 26.2 grs of H335 with a 90 gr SGK bullet in my .25-223.



posted from my stupid smart phone, please excuse any spelling mistakes.

 

[fnfalman]

Sometimes you're wildcatting a cartridge just for the fun of it.

It's not for me because I'm not a reloader, but why the heck not? Back in the 1980s, there was a massive wildcatting movement and there were some really cool stuff happened like the cartridge which took the .45ACP case and necked it down to take the 5.56mm bullet. Can't remember what it's called, but it was pretty cool.

 

[MarkCO]

MOST of today's cartridges were discovered/developed, etc. by guys tinkering with loads. I have several that I have played with and some that while wildcat, had some data. The really fun ones are those with no data where no one else has been before. Granted, you almost have to search for obscurity anymore to find one, but still can be beneficial and or fun. Even those that have a big factory name on them, most came from a guy with a home shop, or a dream of something better...Exactly like the guy pushing the .277 Wolverine.

 

[Big Bird]

Um, let's back up a step with the English language.

You say I will be lucky to get 19 grains of powder in a case with an 80 grain .223, I tell you I get 19 grains under a 220 grain slug and you think that proves your point?

I tell you I am pushing a 107 grain 6.5 bullet at 2620, which has a BC of .590 and SD of .259, but you are still claiming that your 117 (with a BC of .390 and SD of .253) 6.8 has a higher BC and better SD? What kind of math do you use Big Bird?

I have no problem discussing the relative merits and or demerits of calibers and platforms, but you can't pull stuff out of thin air and make it stick, especially when it is wrong. If you are invested in the 6.8, that is great, but do not claim facts based on your use of liberal math and logic patterns.

Your original post made no reference to 6.5. I assumed you were talking about .300BLK

 

[Big Bird]

MOST of today's cartridges were discovered/developed, etc. by guys tinkering with loads. I have several that I have played with and some that while wildcat, had some data. The really fun ones are those with no data where no one else has been before. Granted, you almost have to search for obscurity anymore to find one, but still can be beneficial and or fun. Even those that have a big factory name on them, most came from a guy with a home shop, or a dream of something better...Exactly like the guy pushing the .277 Wolverine.

I have no problem with that. But even the guy who is developing the cartridge starts his notes by saying the obvious: "This cartridge was not developed to compete with the 6.8 SPC. It simply can not do that."

You look at cased cartridge development and there's not much new that hasn't been tried before. There's also no real significant development in nitrocellulose gunpowder. Yeah, they can redesign burn rates and coatings but at the end of the day the old standby powders already cover that spectrum pretty well and all you end up doing is tinkering around the edges.

 

[Big Bird]

I load 26.2 grs of H335 with a 90 gr SGK bullet in my .25-223.



posted from my stupid smart phone, please excuse any spelling mistakes.

What kind of gun are you shooting that in?

 

[Big Bird]

Looks like Jw has proved you wrong he has 23.4 gr in that case and I've been using 24.5gr RE15 behind 69gr SMks for about 20 years.

I wasn't clear enough...I meant no matter what kind of 6.8 bullet you stick in THAT (meaning the 6.8 Wolverine) case.

Go look at the diagram with the four different cartridges compared S x S and come back and tell me I'm wrong. Look at how far back the case shoulder is set and how much more neck length is required for a 6.8 wolverine compared to a 5.56

 

[Constructor]

I wasn't clear enough...I meant no matter what kind of 6.8 bullet you stick in THAT (meaning the 6.8 Wolverine) case.

Go look at the diagram with the four different cartridges compared S x S and come back and tell me I'm wrong. Look at how far back the case shoulder is set and how much more neck length is required for a 6.8 wolverine compared to a 5.56

You're still not clear. What exactly are you trying to say?
It wont be as fast as the 6.8? well duh, I think Mark said that in the first statement. So what are you trying to say?

This is the data- see 23.2 gr of 1680...95TTSX...2620fps
Later last night they posted a 100 Nosler Accubond was hitting 2650fps. That is the performance possible, it doesn't matter how many grains of powder it takes to do it. Doesn't matter that you can only get 19gr behind a 80gr .224 VLD. Or 20gr behind a 7TCU.
Those numbers (95@2600)are very close to the factory 6.8 velocities. Of course we can handload the 6.8 up and get much faster velocities but the factory 6.8 loads have killed a lot of deer and hogs so this little Wolverine can too. The 110gr loads are apx 100fps faster than the 300blk.



String:,2,95TTSX,23.2gr.,1680
Accuracy:,1.3"
Date:,3/15/2014
Time:,5:36:11 PM
Grains:,95
Hi Vel:,2624
Low Vel:,2614
Ave Vel:,2620
Ext Spread:,10
Std Dev:,4
Velocity,Power Factor,Ft/Lbs
2619, 248.805,1446.759
2624, 249.280,1452.288
2619, 248.805,1446.759
2614, 248.330,1441.240
2624, 249.280,1452.288

 

[vikingsoftpaw]

Isn't the Chineese military using something similar.

 

[vafish]

What kind of gun are you shooting that in?

AR15

 

[MDWS]

We hit 2650 with a 100 grain AccuBond the other day. So far here are the basic results, no pressure signs, consistent ES/SD and MOA or better:

90TNT - 2675+
95TTSX - 2600+
100AB - 2625+
110SPH - 2475+

Best powders so far have been 1680 and 1200R. We launched some 85MPG's out there yesterday at around 2725 but we think a different powder will do better.

Any questions just let me know, thanks!

 

[MarkCO]

I think if you try 2200, you might find a tad more velocity.

 

[MDWS]

I think if you try 2200, you might find a tad more velocity.

We're working on it... Powders are hard to come by conveniently as you know. So is good weather! AA2200 and 1200R are quite similar, and we had 1200R. Once I get this into more peoples' hands there will be a lot more data. So far so good, though. We're very happy with the initial results.

 

[glockrod]

Hey everyone who is not in the know or forgot about this here on GT, but this cartridge is for real now!!

I have been in on the original barrels/dies that were shipped out and have been doing testing on 100-120 grn loads.

Looks like 100 grn bullets are getting in excess of 2500 fps (w/24 grn 1200R) and I have been getting over 2300 out of 120 gr SSTs. All of this is providing greater than 1,000 ft/lbs of energy at 150 yards and over 800 ft/lbs at 250 with no more than a 1.5" line if sight over and 10" or less drop below LOS at 250 yards.

There is more info out there and lots of data on the 68forum website. If you thought you might be interested 6 months ago, you can make it happen now with only a barrel change and some .223 brass.

I am quite satisfied with its performance and plan on deer hunting with it this weekend. Just so you(mods) know, I have no affiliation with the developer or financial interest, I am just happy with the round and wanted to share the news with like-minded shooters.

 

[rainman33]

This round definitely intrigues me, but I'm not in reloading, so I guess I'll just have to wait to see if it catches on.

A 6.5 is interesting too.

 

[MDWS]

Not to worry... loaded factory ammunition is now available from JB's Firearms out of Grantsburg, Wisconsin and Mid-South Munitions out of Mississippi.

We also have our own forum now, just go to our website and click on forum. Maddogweapons.com

We have about 125 shooters out there now and we're out of barrels, more coming in a few weeks and a lot of them are claimed. We have a ton of deer and hog kill pics posted on our forum and on our Facebook page.

Any questions just let me know but this thing is full steam ahead. We have 150 grain bullets running subsonic already and will have 180 grain subs running shortly as well.