I'm ready to order my Glock, but I have one thing I'm not at peace with yet. If I machine the slide, am I married to one footprint, one brand of red dot? What if 3 years down the road a new piece of technology appears and I want to run something different? I'm sure if a company wants to market a new red dot, there will be a mounting plate made so Glock owners can easily mount said optic?
MOS vs Machining the Slide
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Raylan Givens
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I'm ready to order my Glock, but I have one thing I'm not at peace with yet. If I machine the slide, am I married to one footprint, one brand of red dot? What if 3 years down the road a new piece of technology appears and I want to run something different? I'm sure if a company wants to market a new red dot, there will be a mounting plate made so Glock owners can easily mount said optic?
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If you machine the slide with a specific MRDS footprint, then yes. If you machine the slide with a modular optic system footprint such as Agency Arms AOS, then no.
No. Even a specific MRDS footprint accepts many brands. I've included a (partial) list of MRDS's compatible with the Trijicon RMR footprint below.
If you are talking about a modular optic system such as Glock MOS or Agency Arms AOS, then yes. You'd expect a new adapter plate. However, if you're talking about a slide milled with a specific MRDS footprint, then the "new piece of technology" would need to be compatible with that footprint.
ADE Advanced Optics Stingray
ADE Advanced Optics Raptor
ADE Advanced Optics Valkyrie
Atibal CRD
Holosun HS407C Series
Holosun HS507C Series
Holosun HS508T Series
NcStar VISM FlipDot
Riton X3 Tactix PRD
Swampfox Justice
Swampfox Liberty
Swampox Kingslayer
Trijicon RMR Series
Trijicon SRO Series
Vector Optics Frenzy 1x22x26
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2,956 Posts
with current trends moving towards a more universal applications regardless of product, I would expect that the major players in the optics world would adapt to any changes in technology within their product line. that being said, the latest and greatest gotta have would eventually be standardized based on popularity to the masses. the bottom line is the bottom line, any manufacturer not adapting to current trends, is in essence producing an obsolete product that won't sell.
case in point, look at the slim line Glock, with the popularity of RDS handguns, a RDS was developed to fit on a slim line slide, Glock adapted by adding a RDS ready option to their product line with a foot print for a particular RDS, C&H developed an adapter plate to provide greater option for different manufacturers RDS, but all of them have the same bolt pattern.
its one thing for a manufacturer to fallow trends, it another thing for a manufacturer to produce a product following those trends, you may see a niche market for an option but it will be more expensive, if its a popular option that consumers want, it will become more wide spread and more affordable to the masses which will have a positive effect on the bottom line.
thus endeth the economics 101 lesson.
case in point, look at the slim line Glock, with the popularity of RDS handguns, a RDS was developed to fit on a slim line slide, Glock adapted by adding a RDS ready option to their product line with a foot print for a particular RDS, C&H developed an adapter plate to provide greater option for different manufacturers RDS, but all of them have the same bolt pattern.
its one thing for a manufacturer to fallow trends, it another thing for a manufacturer to produce a product following those trends, you may see a niche market for an option but it will be more expensive, if its a popular option that consumers want, it will become more wide spread and more affordable to the masses which will have a positive effect on the bottom line.
thus endeth the economics 101 lesson.
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Some will pick a path and forge their own just to negate the competition (each one considers themselves as the "standard").
Apple
Google
RMR, Doctor, Shield -- if you want to wait a few MORE years for them to "standardize", good luck.
optics-info.com
MOS = jack of all trades, master of none - but you have option to try different optics with different footprints-- not that you will since each one costs >$300, and you are likely to stick with the first one attached. Higher float point because of adapter mounting plate.
Milled = pick your poison and likely endure it as you train with it. Lower float point.
Apple
RMR, Doctor, Shield -- if you want to wait a few MORE years for them to "standardize", good luck.
Footprints/Mounting Standards on Red Dot Sights - Optics info
In this article, the most common footprints/mounting standards used on red dot sights are listed. Each standard is described and an image of it is added.
optics-info.com
MOS = jack of all trades, master of none - but you have option to try different optics with different footprints-- not that you will since each one costs >$300, and you are likely to stick with the first one attached. Higher float point because of adapter mounting plate.
Milled = pick your poison and likely endure it as you train with it. Lower float point.
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If you're unsure if you even want an optic you could opt for the adapter plate that slides into the rear sight dovetail and the optic mounts to it. That way you're not committed to any particular footprint.
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For milling your slides, quality, cost and, time are considerations. Shipping and processing of the slide (milling then finishing after the mill) are all considerations and possible headaches along the way. My recent milling experience was a August-January timeframe with damage to my original slide that I shipped in.
To me the easiest (actually cheap and fast, too) option is to buy a slide pre- milled and finished for that optic (usually a RMR footprint) - then switch out the innards into that new slide, then sell your original slide.
The popularity of 80% ghost guns has made these pre-milled slides a easy bargain option.
To me the easiest (actually cheap and fast, too) option is to buy a slide pre- milled and finished for that optic (usually a RMR footprint) - then switch out the innards into that new slide, then sell your original slide.
The popularity of 80% ghost guns has made these pre-milled slides a easy bargain option.
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Yuckiest option, since the the floating dot is the highest (and gives the worst approximation of red dot ownership), and risk of damaging the dovetail on install or removal.
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Yes the popularity of the 80% frames along with the abundance of Gen 3 Glocks produced has made finding aftermarket optic ready Gen 3 slides easier and cheaper.
The one brand I will warn people to stay far away from is anything made/sold by Rock Slide USA and their eBay seller by the name of ammogas.
Owning both milled slides and MOS slides, I prefer milled slides since the optic is lower/closer to the bore axis. The most popular optic footprint for aftermarket slides is the Trijicon RMR footprint. And the Shield RMSc footprint has become the most common for slim line pistols.
EGW
I have no idea why someone would buy a new pistol, then send the slide off to a machine shop to be cut on. Not to mention the sometimes month(s) long wait to get your slide back. As to sitting lower, who cares? Holding the pistol at arms length makes that tiny difference between it and an MOS a non-issue. Another consideration no one talks about, is when the red dot is lower, the suppressor sights (if you want backup iron sights that is) now cover more of the sight window, although AmeriGlo suppressor sights are not as tall as Trijicon. The red dot also will sit in a different location on the slide when milled vs the MOS.
Myself, I would not consider having the slide hacked on. MOS is my only choice.
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Myself, I would not consider having the slide hacked on. MOS is my only choice.
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To each their own man. Buy what you like and don't worry bout what others like.
Actually that can be an issue, though you will see it more with optics mounted using a dove tail mount vs the MOS plates. Depending on the optic and individual pistol, one can run out of adjustment when tying to zero the sight in.
Plus the closer the optic is to the bore centerline, the less adjustments you have to make when shooting at different distances whether you are dialing in a scope or using hold overs with a red dot. The higher the sight is above the bore, the worse it gets.
One positive about the MOS system is that you are not stuck with just one option when it comes to optic footprints. The disadvantage is you have yet one more piece that can break or be out of spec causing problems.
The positive on milled slides is that the optic mounts directly to it. You don't have to worry if the factory adapter plate is good or not, or spending more money for an aftermarket adapter plate. The negative is that you are stuck using 1 single optic footprint.
I have not seen any issue trying to zero the RMR with the MOS plate, have done 3 with no problems. No idea on other brands of MRDS but have not read anything of that so far. The dovetail plate would no doubt be an issue. A milled slide on a Glock could negate all or part of the warranty, if that is a consideration.
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Yes I have read Glock's warranty policy many times. But they have to prove that it was in fact an aftermarket part that caused a failure before they can void your warranty. This is covered by the Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act.
Glock's warranty policy clearly states that they will remove all aftermarket parts and you will likely not get them back (except for aftermarket sights). And in that policy they even state that the warranty is void IF they prove that it was an aftermarket part that caused the failure.
And when it comes to going with a milled slide, it is pretty easy to find a quality aftermarket slide that is optics ready so that you do not have to mill your OEM slide if that is what you want.
In the end it is all about having choices. Some prefer the MOS system while others prefer a milled slide. Neither option is wrong and there is no reason to be negative towards one or the other. I have both and if the OEM adapter plate breaks, I'll contact Glock. And then go back to using milled slides only.
Glock's warranty policy clearly states that they will remove all aftermarket parts and you will likely not get them back (except for aftermarket sights). And in that policy they even state that the warranty is void IF they prove that it was an aftermarket part that caused the failure.
And when it comes to going with a milled slide, it is pretty easy to find a quality aftermarket slide that is optics ready so that you do not have to mill your OEM slide if that is what you want.
In the end it is all about having choices. Some prefer the MOS system while others prefer a milled slide. Neither option is wrong and there is no reason to be negative towards one or the other. I have both and if the OEM adapter plate breaks, I'll contact Glock. And then go back to using milled slides only.
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I have 5 different handguns with RDS mounted in different ways.
1. AR9 pistol with a Holosun 510 mounted on the rail co-witnessed to the folding BUIS.
2. An aftermarket optics slide from Swenson for a Gen 3-17 with a Vortex Venom mounted, direct attachment so as low as possible.
3. Gen 4-23 milled by Jagurwerks, optics in front of rear sight with a Holosun 507C-X2, direct attachment so mounted as low as possible.
4. 43X MOS with a C&H adapter plate with a Holosun 507K-X2 mounted, plate is .070 thick.
5. S&W Victory with a Tandemkross mount with a Holosun 507C-X2, between the S&W receiver, bull barrel and TK mount the HS507C is close to or more than .375 high off the bore
If you take the AR9 out of the mix because it isn't fired with a standard two hand hold used with a conventional pistol, I can't say that I can notice any difference when using one or the other.
I did an experiment to see if the red dot height had any impact on getting on target and practical accuracy with the three handguns I have with HS507s. I set up a target with 3 dots at 7 yards and fired a mag from one, set it down and immediately picked up another one and fire a mag, set it down and immediately picked up the third one and fire a mag, all with the same results I get when firing multiple mags with any one of them, didn't matter which one I picked up first, got the results I expected from having fired each handgun in the past.
I took the experiment a set further, I had a friends wife who just got her first pistol a few months ago and had never fired, let alone handled a RDS pistol run the same drill, with a little instruction on finding the red dot as she extended to the target she was making solid hits with each of the handguns.
the only problem was the dirty look I got from my buddy because his wife immediately turned to him saying "I want one".
1. AR9 pistol with a Holosun 510 mounted on the rail co-witnessed to the folding BUIS.
2. An aftermarket optics slide from Swenson for a Gen 3-17 with a Vortex Venom mounted, direct attachment so as low as possible.
3. Gen 4-23 milled by Jagurwerks, optics in front of rear sight with a Holosun 507C-X2, direct attachment so mounted as low as possible.
4. 43X MOS with a C&H adapter plate with a Holosun 507K-X2 mounted, plate is .070 thick.
5. S&W Victory with a Tandemkross mount with a Holosun 507C-X2, between the S&W receiver, bull barrel and TK mount the HS507C is close to or more than .375 high off the bore
If you take the AR9 out of the mix because it isn't fired with a standard two hand hold used with a conventional pistol, I can't say that I can notice any difference when using one or the other.
I did an experiment to see if the red dot height had any impact on getting on target and practical accuracy with the three handguns I have with HS507s. I set up a target with 3 dots at 7 yards and fired a mag from one, set it down and immediately picked up another one and fire a mag, set it down and immediately picked up the third one and fire a mag, all with the same results I get when firing multiple mags with any one of them, didn't matter which one I picked up first, got the results I expected from having fired each handgun in the past.
I took the experiment a set further, I had a friends wife who just got her first pistol a few months ago and had never fired, let alone handled a RDS pistol run the same drill, with a little instruction on finding the red dot as she extended to the target she was making solid hits with each of the handguns.
the only problem was the dirty look I got from my buddy because his wife immediately turned to him saying "I want one".
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So every optic on this list uses the Trijicon RMR footprint?
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I think most of us are assuming we are talking a slides for double stack Glocks. i have a G43x MOS and it and the G48 MOS allow you to mount a number of micro red dots directly on the slide without an adapter plate and the ability to co-witness with OEM sights. My G43x has a Swampfox Sentinel mounted directly and factory sights for co-witnessing.
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What is the attraction of buying a Glock and then having your slide milled, rather than either buying a stock MOS (oh, look, the milled area is finished to prevent rust) or just spending the same money or less to buy a spare slide? I almost never make an irreversible modification to a gun. With the exception of one bullseye pistol, every factory built gun I own can easily be returned to 100% original.
Right now I can order an RMR cut slide for $228 from Brownell's and I would expect that sending the stock one out to get milled would cost that much or more, not even counting the reduction in value of my gun.
Heck, Glock even sells the MOS slide separately, so you can have a MOS and Non-MOS gun that is all Glock.
Right now I can order an RMR cut slide for $228 from Brownell's and I would expect that sending the stock one out to get milled would cost that much or more, not even counting the reduction in value of my gun.
Heck, Glock even sells the MOS slide separately, so you can have a MOS and Non-MOS gun that is all Glock.
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I switched to red dots in 2018 due to eyesight. After getting quite proficient and moving up a classification, I confidently had my new blue label 17 custom milled at my LGS for $150 because at 56, my eyes aren’t going to suddenly reverse aging.
Related article: An Official Journal Of The NRA | How to Improve Pistol Accuracy and Speed with Handgun Red Dots Red-dot sights are allowing shooters with aging eyes to shoot better, too. A loss of visual acuity is a natural part of the aging process, and at some point it becomes difficult for most people to use iron sights efficiently. Sometimes even corrective lenses don’t help the problem. However, a reflex sight can help those shooters produce tight groups.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Related article: An Official Journal Of The NRA | How to Improve Pistol Accuracy and Speed with Handgun Red Dots Red-dot sights are allowing shooters with aging eyes to shoot better, too. A loss of visual acuity is a natural part of the aging process, and at some point it becomes difficult for most people to use iron sights efficiently. Sometimes even corrective lenses don’t help the problem. However, a reflex sight can help those shooters produce tight groups.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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