[gjk5]

anyone ever used them?

I am looking for something to keep in the truck at all times and to use for low profile, relatively low round count shooting like big game or waterfowl/upland hunting.

open to other suggestions for the described use as well.

 

[ronin.45]

The sonic defenders will work well for you. They are not quite enough for big bores indoors, but are perfect for outdoors.

 

[pm666]

Would regulat ear protection muffs fit around them? so, double protection indoors?

 

[ArtCrafter]

The Surefire product is kind of pricey for what it is, and although not shown everywhere, it comes in sizes. I tried a Medium (which is all many places sell), and it was too small for me. Never did try a Large.

Instead, I found this alternative: Peltor Indoor-Outdoor Range E-A-R Ear Plugs @ MidwayUSA

It's about half the price of the Surefire, but I suppose it could be argued the yellow-colored end is not very low-profile. OTOH, the Surefire does have that little red-colored dot showing so it might be a tossup. Otherwise, I find these work great.

HTH

:wavey:

 

[schild]

I use them under my muffs indoors and use them on my riding lawnmower.
I think they are the best fitting plugs I've ever tried.

 

[GRT45]

Would regulat ear protection muffs fit around them? so, double protection indoors?

Absolutely, they work well together and are comfortable under muffs. However, don't assume the Noise Reduction Rating (NRR) in dB for the combination is the sum of both.

For ear plugs with ear muffs, take the higher of the two NRR dB ratings of the devices and add 5 dB to get the expected combined NRR.

For example, the Pro Mag Gold electronic ear muffs from Pro Ears, with a NRR of 33 dB, combined with SureFire EP3 Sonic Defenders, with a NRR of 24 dB, provides an expected NRR of 38 dB (33+5) for a combination of the two, at best.

Consider that a 45ACP pistol discharged indoors produces a short burst of noise in the range of 157-161 dB depending on acoustics. Even wearing ear plugs and muffs that's an exposure to 119+ dB for the shooter. That's not something you want to be exposed to for more than 1000 rounds or so in a range session (your shots and all the others nearby).

The source of my information is an excellent post on the subject of hearing protection and firearms here at Glock Talk by member Nemesis. My source for the upper range of noise from a 45ACP pistol (161 dB) came from testing conducted by SilencerCo with a 45 Springfield 1911 (starts at 0:55 of video).

 

[gjk5]

The Surefire product is kind of pricey for what it is, and although not shown everywhere, it comes in sizes. I tried a Medium (which is all many places sell), and it was too small for me. Never did try a Large.

Instead, I found this alternative: Peltor Indoor-Outdoor Range E-A-R Ear Plugs @ MidwayUSA

It's about half the price of the Surefire, but I suppose it could be argued the yellow-colored end is not very low-profile. OTOH, the Surefire does have that little red-colored dot showing so it might be a tossup. Otherwise, I find these work great.

HTH

:wavey:

ETA: nowhere to shoot indoors here, but I often use plugs and muffs for long high power rifle range sessions, these and muffs will probably be loads better.

looks to me like the surefires are about the same price as the Peltor?

I think for shotgunning birds and the few rounds fired at elk or deer in the field these should work fine. I used my Leight's for part of my elk hunt last fall and it was a pain in the ass.

 

[pm666]

schild and grt45, are you recommending the Peltor or the SureFire for protection under muffs?

 

[GRT45]

schild and grt45, are you recommending the Peltor or the SureFire for protection under muffs?

I prefer the SureFire EP3 Sonic Defenders while wearing muffs. The EP3 has selective noise reduction that helps filter out noise above 85 dB while allowing sounds at safe levels to pass through. Incidentally, that's why I selected electronic muffs instead of passive muffs. I feel safer on the range and in the field when I can hear clearly the voices of the range master and others around me while I'm shooting, while still being protected from exposure to the high dB noise of gun fire.

I always wear the EP3 ear plugs and Pro Ears muffs while at the indoor range. If I happen to forget or lose the EP3 plugs, I have some inexpensive, soft foam plugs (29 dB NRR) in my vehicle for spares.

 

[TSAX]

Absolutely, they work well together and are comfortable under muffs. However, don't assume the Noise Reduction Rating (NRR) in dB for the combination is the sum of both.

For ear plugs with ear muffs, take the higher of the two NRR dB ratings of the devices and add 5 dB to get the expected combined NRR.

For example, the Pro Mag Gold electronic ear muffs from Pro Ears, with a NRR of 33 dB, combined with SureFire EP-3 Sonic Defenders, with a NRR of 24 dB, yields an expected NRR of 38 dB (33+5) for a combination of the two at best.

Consider that a 45ACP pistol discharged indoors produces a short burst of noise in the range of 157-161 dB depending on acoustics. Even wearing ear plugs and muffs that's an exposure to 119+ dB for the shooter. That's not something you want to be exposed to for more than 1000 rounds or so in a range session (your shots and all the others nearby).

The source of my information is an excellent post on the subject of hearing protection and firearms here at Glock Talk by member Nemesis. My source for the upper range of noise from a 45ACP pistol (161 dB) came from testing conducted by SilencerCo with a 45 Springfield 1911.

Thanks for the links. Good info

 

[ArtCrafter]

...looks to me like the surefires are about the same price as the Peltor?...

Looks like it. I bought my one and only pair of Sonic Defenders when they first came out a few years ago. There was just one model at that time, and retail was about $20, but I see they now the have several models under $15.

I'd still probably go with the Peltor, though, especially if I was unsure which size Sonic Defenders I needed. (Assuming they still come in different sizes, that is. I didn't look today, because I'm not in the market.)

As I mentioned above, MEDIUM didn't fit me. The 'plug' seemed OK for my ear canal, but the hoop thingy was too small in 'diameter' to engage the adjacent surfaces of my ear and hold the assembly in place. They simply would not stay put in my ears well enough to do their job. In other words, the Sonic Defenders 'leaked,' and badly at that.

In contrast, the Peltor is closer to one-size-fits all, and I've not had any problem with leakage.

In the debit column, the Peltor is not as comfortable as, say, foam ear plugs, and I do find them irritating if left in too long.

ETA: nowhere to shoot indoors here, but I often use plugs and muffs for long high power rifle range sessions, these and muffs will probably be loads better.

I would guess so. I've doubled-up on ear muffs and plugs before, and it was a lot quiter than just one or the other.

HTH

:wavey:

 

[WiskyT]

I am able to help myself to lots of free earplugs and have been for a long time. I have tried many different types, but I haven't tried any thing complex like the Sonic Defenders. What I have found is nothing works better, or is more comfortable than plane foam plugs. Unless you work in a library or monestary, they are usually somewhere in a wall dispenser where you work. Open any of my glove compartments, range bags, dresser drawers, tool chests, and you will find a handful of them. Regardless of what you end up getting, I would keep a bunch of these around because you have to have access to hearing protection for it to work.

I wear them under plain old Peltor muffs. Also, muffs are supposed to degrade over time. They may just be a sales ploy from the muff companies, but since mine are the $20.00 kind, I get new ones every few years.

 

[GRT45]

As I mentioned above, MEDIUM didn't fit me. The 'plug' seemed OK for my ear canal, but the hoop thingy was too small in 'diameter' to engage the adjacent surfaces of my ear and hold the assembly in place. They simply would not stay put in my ear well enough to do their job. In other words, the Sonic Defenders 'leaked,' and badly at that.

ArtCrafter, you're absolutely right that proper fit is essential if the Sonic Defender is to be effective. They have a sizing chart now to help customers select the best size (Small, Medium, Large). I first thought surely I must be a "Medium" size; my ear looked average size to me. Then I used the chart and discovered I was definitely a "Small" for the purpose of wearing an EP3 plug. Note that the part of the EP3 that enters the ear canal is the same size for all sizes of the EP3. They sell the EP4 model for customers with larger ear canals.

 

[gjk5]

I am able to help myself to lots of free earplugs and have been for a long time. I have tried many different types, but I haven't tried any thing complex like the Sonic Defenders. What I have found is nothing works better, or is more comfortable than plane foam plugs. Unless you work in a library or monestary, they are usually somewhere in a wall dispenser where you work. Open any of my glove compartments, range bags, dresser drawers, tool chests, and you will find a handful of them. Regardless of what you end up getting, I would keep a bunch of these around because you have to have access to hearing protection for it to work.

I wear them under plain old Peltor muffs. Also, muffs are supposed to degrade over time. They may just be a sales ploy from the muff companies, but since mine are the $20.00 kind, I get new ones every few years.

I have foam plugs everywhere, they are useless when hunting with a group and trying to communicate, but good in a pinch (or even just trying to use your ears hunting, listening for flapping wings etc). You just can't leave them in all day like it seems you could with these.

 

[ArtCrafter]

I've also found foam ear plugs the most comfortable, but some are better than others in this regard.

To some extent, it's the materials involved. Some plugs are quite 'stiff' and do not conform well to the ear canal. Softer, more 'flexible' material generally yields a more forgiving plug that better fits the ear.

Form factor also matters. Some plugs are cylindrical, others more ergonomic in shape.

In addition, 'size' can also play a roll here. Some plugs are too large to stuff in there no matter how much you squeeze or roll them in your fingers. Others are too small to expand to fill the ear canal, and consequently they leak.

Even ambient conditions can play a role: At cold temperatures, some foam plugs lose their ability to 'spring back' and fill the canal, again causing leakage. Of course, you can warm them up in situ, so to speak - or at least try to - but this doesn't always produce the desired outcome, and sometimes when it does, it takes a while.

The good news is all types of foam plugs can usually be had for next to nothing - or, as implied elsewhere herein, for "free"... - so it doesn't cost much to experiment with them and find those that best suit you.

HTH

:wavey:

 

[JRS]

I have some ep4's, and while they aren't bad in a pinch, and I use them when grinding etc in the garage, they just don't block out enough for gunfire or similar. They barely even block out enough for garage work.

They are comfortable, and you can hear all the usual convos etc, but don't think they will save your hearing.

 

[MrMurphy]

I've used EP3s and EP4s considerably.

For range use and surprise bursts of firing (like combat) they work well. If you're around loud noises constantly get real plugs or electronic hearing pro.

I shot a 5,000 round M240 qual in a semi-indoor range with them, heard everything fine except the shooting. Same with being next to a squadron of running F16s during an alarm response. What needed blocking was blocked.

 

[schild]

schild and grt45, are you recommending the Peltor or the SureFire for protection under muffs?

SureFire.

 

[gjk5]

I've used EP3s and EP4s considerably.

For range use and surprise bursts of firing (like combat) (OR HUNTING?) they work well. If you're around loud noises constantly get real plugs or electronic hearing pro.

I shot a 5,000 round M240 qual in a semi-indoor range with them, heard everything fine except the shooting. (with the Surefires?)Same with being next to a squadron of running F16s during an alarm response. What needed blocking was blocked.

sounds like they will fit the bill for my needs.

 

[Search]

SureFire EP4 size medium are all I wear to the range.

When shooting M16 and M4s we can hear the buffer spring while shooting

At the indoor range I've only used them around handguns but they work wonderfully up to 44 magnum. Never heard a .50 AE fired.