I have a friend who double charged a load for his G30SF. It broke the frame, a bunch of small bits and his magazine. He called Glock and explained what happened and told them it was his reloads. They told him to send the gun in. They replaced everything was broken and shipped it back to him. I think he had to go through another DROS because of the new serial number, but can't recall for sure.

Just a few days ago, a guy in the reloading section doubled his (I think) G19, he did the same thing, owning up to it, and they told him to send it in and they would fix it up.

Both of those were honest mistakes, not sure how ethical it is to use the gun as a test bed and then ask them to fix it, because you stepped over the line, but I guess that is between you and your mother.

 

So did they fix your friends free of charge? I have no problem paying up, if it blows, just trying to figure out my options as far as cost. I can spend money and buy a useful gun, and if it goes kaboom, I would have an idea of the cost of fixing it. If nothing happens, then great, I have a Glock. If I buy a High Point, and it go kaboom, I'll throw it away; however, if it doesn't I still have a POS.

 

Sounds like an easy way to acquire the nickname Stumpy...

 

I won't be holding the gun.

 

Sorry double tap.

 

"Testing", for what purpose? To satisfy your own curiosity? As a test bed for handloaded ammunition? Because you like to blow $*** up? Or???

From the outside looking in, your intensions are as clear as mud, suspect, and as WeeWilly suggests above, possibly unethical.

An honest "test bed" would consist of firearms supplied by a manufacturer who was fully aware that the samples they provided would be subjected to testing, possibly to the extent of their distruction. Purchasing a firearm for the sole intent of personal testing, to the point of it's destruction, then innocently :innocent: or otherwise presenting it to the unsuspecting manufacturer for replacement, wreaks of dishonesty. Put yourself in the position of business owner, and perhaps the thinly veiled subterfuge may become clearer...

 

Unethical, really? Did I ever say I wanted Glock to fix it for free, or under warranty? Did I ever state that I was trying to be dishonest to Glock, or screw them over? I have already stated that I am willing to pay. I am simply asking for people that have blown up their Glocks, what did it cost to fix, so I can examine all of my options (with this being worst case). If your assumptions from my post is that I am trying to be unethical, maybe you should be looking into your own ethics.

 

Blew up my G21 with a double charge. Blew the bottom out of the magazine, split the trigger and broke the mag release. Replaced the trigger and mag release plus a new magazine. That was it.

 

Thank you for sharing.

Trying to get a handle of what a frame would cost, since some have had cracked frames.

 

OP-

"testing" higher pressure charges is an exercise in stupidity. and with stupid games come stupid prizes. the cost of the glock should be least of your concerns.

Read drewbone's post a few more times. he is spot on.

 

I bought a complete G19 frame from these folks a while back.

https://lucastactical.com/store/complete-lower-receivers/

 

I bought a complete G19 frame from these folks a while back.

https://lucastactical.com/store/complete-lower-receivers/

Thank you again for you help.

 

I tap, racked, banged on a squib load. Slight bulge in the barrel. (I could feel it, but not see it) $about 60 bucks for a new barrel.

 

Just to chime in, 'cause I'm insomniac, at times...I've been fortunate enough to never have a handgun kaboom on me. If one ever does, it will be land waste. Not going to bother to fix it.

 

When I bought my 23 in 08 I was assured it would blow up just shooting regular factory ammo.

 

Posted this several times so it is getting old, but you did ask.
I KB'd a nearly new Glock 35 in 2000 with a 1 1/2 times max charge which was probable compressed. A stupid reloading mistake.
Sent to Glock with a letter explaining what I had done. Only the barrel was salvaged. I now have a three serial number frankenGlock. They charged me $280.00 as I recall. There are several stories on the web of Glock repairing/replacing guns at no cost, even with admission of a reloading mistake.
I would never advise someone to buy a HiPoint but in this case you should.

 

Thank you for your post, and staying on topic.

 

I would call Glock and tell them what you want to do.I am sure they will answer your question.

 

Thank You for your kind and measured responses.
I don't know what the reason or theories that you wish to explore, but you might gather some insight from watching a YouTuber at iraqveteran8888. They did a video in which they tried/did destroy a HiPoint. Double charges, black powder and even driving a bolt in the muzzel. They are a couple of "good ole boys", but they do know guns and are generally entertaining.
Best of luck and let us know of your results, though this might not be right thread for some who are offended by someone who wants to try something out of the norm.

 

You continue to be of great help, thank you again. When/if I do move forward with testing, I will either post about it in the reloading forum, or shoot you a PM with my findings.

 

I have reloaded and shot thousands of rounds through my Glocks. Thankfully I have never had a kaboom of any sorts. The cost if you fix it yourself would depend on the amount of damage. The most expensive parts to replace will be the slide and frame. You can price Glock uppers and lowers on gunbroker. They are pricey, pushing the pressure limits in a Glock is not something I have on my agenda. And not to mention I value the digits on my hands. If I want power, I have big bore revolvers that can deliver it safely.

 

A handful of years ago a customer called me from the range.
A quick drive and there's a three month old G21 that had gone kaboom.

Hand load, yes.
But case head failure on once fired brass. Six more cases of the 50 were as thin or thinner upon inspection. Bad case not loading issue.

A call to Glock CS and off it went.

A week and a half later, a complete new lower under his upper, everything was still in spec with it.

Total of $65 for the frame and whatever shipping was.

And before that happened, a local Sheriff brought his early G2 19 in for sights (and cleaning).
As I wiped it down and inspected it, I pulled out a spare gun for him, informing him I was keeping his for a bit.
The gun still ran but had age cracks around the locking block and front rails.
@18 years old but barely broken in, he'd take a shot or two a week at coyotes but never shot it and it looked new inside.

A quick call and letter, the gun was on his desk a week later, no charge except the original shipping.

My aging G23, an early 90's gun, I keep a sharp eye on.
When it starts to crack, I will check with Glock, they may or may not warranty the gun as its been stippled, but when Gen 3 frames are $150-200 from outside sources, I'm not overly concerned.

As to your testing, good luck.

As an aside, years ago I made a case gauge. Sized to differentiate between the thin and thicker headed cases (internally) it allowed me to sort my brass into that I would keep and that I'd sell at gun shows.
Something like to consider in your experiment, case head thickness.

 

A handful of years ago a customer called me from the range.
A quick drive and there's a three month old G21 that had gone kaboom.

Hand load, yes.
But case head failure on once fired brass. Six more cases of the 50 were as thin or thinner upon inspection. Bad case not loading issue.

A call to Glock CS and off it went.

A week and a half later, a complete new lower under his upper, everything was still in spec with it.

Total of $65 for the frame and whatever shipping was.

And before that happened, a local Sheriff brought his early G2 19 in for sights (and cleaning).
As I wiped it down and inspected it, I pulled out a spare gun for him, informing him I was keeping his for a bit.
The gun still ran but had age cracks around the locking block and front rails.
@18 years old but barely broken in, he'd take a shot or two a week at coyotes but never shot it and it looked new inside.

A quick call and letter, the gun was on his desk a week later, no charge except the original shipping.

My aging G23, an early 90's gun, I keep a sharp eye on.
When it starts to crack, I will check with Glock, they may or may not warranty the gun as its been stippled, but when Gen 3 frames are $150-200 from outside sources, I'm not overly concerned.

As to your testing, good luck.

As an aside, years ago I made a case gauge. Sized to differentiate between the thin and thicker headed cases (internally) it allowed me to sort my brass into that I would keep and that I'd sell at gun shows.
Something like to consider in your experiment, case head thickness.

Thank you for sharing, as this is more along the lines of what I am testing for, case issues. Most assume that I am going to try for some insane pressures, which is not at all what I am shooting for. I have no interest in loading a case full of Tite Group, and then sticking a bullet on top. My concern is case issues. What is interesting to me that some can reload successfully for years, and thousands if not tens of thousands of rounds, and then kaboom. It seems that it is always blamed on a squib load or a double charge, and maybe so. Yet some can load standard 45ACP cases to Rowland levels and don't have any issues. Some will use brass "x" amount of times then trash them, but yet some will run them until they crack or until the lose them. Better yet, some do both depending on the pressure of the load.

Do you happen to have a list of the different case head thickness that you will be willing to share?

 

I was gonna say, the price of a Glock is approximate:

30% frame
40% slide
20% barrel

The remainder are the other parts, trigger, mag etc.

 

If a Glock frame cracks from ""normal use"", Glock will replace it free. Only problem is your left with a non-matching serialed number pistol. I have a early 19, the frame, at the mag well bottom has a chip on it. They said they would replace it, but, I'm choosing to leave it that way since it's a early model (D*xxxUS).

 

I kaboomed a G27. Frame and barrel were toast. Glock replaced the entire gun with a new one, if I remember correct, it was $365. They also swapped my night sites from the old to new and sent it back. Not really a deal because I paid to send it to them. I might have even lost money. A new one was $398 back then, plus tax in my state.

 

Thank you for sharing, reloads or factory if you don't mind me asking.

 

I think you should do all the testing you want to without worrying about the safety police and ethics police chastising you on this thread. I have tested all kinds of things to the point of failure.

You already said you were paying for this up front, but they still cry. I am amazed how sensitive some people on Glock Talk are. It's turning into the liberal gun owners forum.

I just purchased a brand new complete gen 3 Glock 23 frame on Gun Broker for $210 including shipping. For some reason compact models are more expensive. Full size frames are cheaper.

The Glock Store just had a sale on stripped full size frames for $75.

Lone Wolf distributors sells new stripped frames for $209.

Oh yeah, you also told these whinny crybaby's you weren't going to be holding the gun in hand, but that wasn't good enough for them.

You are not crazy, not unethical. DO WHAT YOU WANT, This is still America. However, liberals are trying to destroy it.

Test on, brother.

 

AMEN:cheers:

 

Without knowing the engineering specs for the Glock or High Point, my question is do they have different pressure thresholds for a kaboom and would that affect your research?

Are the weak spots different leading to different kabom outcomes from the same load in the two guns?

 

You are spot on. Since I pretty much only shoot Glocks, I would like it to be and apples to apples comparison, instead of apples to oranges. I was using high point as an example, because it is one of the cheapest 9mm semi auto's that I know of, giving me little upfront investment for the project.

 

Using my big Ruger revolvers, I can get all the big bangs I can stand these days without requiring gun repairs. In my younger years I worked in an Emergency Room the SOP advice is: Make sure you have cover from flying debris; that way all who are observing your experiments can have fun and a few laughs.

 

Double charges don't kaboom guns, bullet setback does. When Irv Stone of BarSto barrel was still in CA, we loaded up 3x a charge on a test barrel of TiteGroup, nothing. Then set a bullet back .100" and blew it. And there is a difference between a case head rupture and a kaboom. Case ruptures generally do no damage to the gun, but blow out the mag and mag catch. KaBooms split the barrel, slide and crack the frame.

case head rupture in an STI Open gun, blew out the mag, no other damage. Speer article on setback.

 

Double charges don't kaboom guns, bullet setback does. When Irv Stone of BarSto barrel was still in CA, we loaded up 3x a charge on a test barrel of TiteGroup, nothing. Then set a bullet back .100" and blew it. And there is a difference between a case head rupture and a kaboom. Case ruptures generally do no damage to the gun, but blow out the mag and mag catch. KaBooms split the barrel, slide and crack the frame.

case head rupture in an STI Open gun, blew out the mag, no other damage. Speer article on setback.

Thank you - Also, am I interpreting it correctly when you set the bullet back .100" you were still running a triple charge when it blew?

 

Hello 9x45, I was hoping that you would see this thread and relate your experience at BarSto.
I would like more info on the test barrel that withstood a triple charge. Was it larger. of stronger metal [than found in production guns. in a fixture without reciprocating slide or a bolt locking mechanism?
A double charge seems to be the most common denominator of exploded guns from those that will acknowledge their culpability and certainly for those that blame the weak case, unsupported barrels and firing out of battery fallacy.
I find it hard to understand how bullet set back of a few thousandths of an inch could be responsible for so many destroyed firearms that are not at least accompanied by an over charge.
Thanks for your input. DannC

 

Also interested in more details.

 

Here is a chart from Speer about bullet setback and pressure changes.

http://le.vistaoutdoor.com/downloads/technical_bulletins/357_SIG_Setback_Length-vs-Pressure.pdf

 

No, sorry, it's misleading, the KaBoom was a standard charge with setback. Same as when I blew up my G34. 15 of the 200 rounds left were setback between .060" and .090" and had the charge weight the press was set at, not double. Was using plated bullets, have not used them since.

 

Your answers lead to more questions on my part. My first is in regards to straight walled pistol vs bottleneck pistol cartridges. It appears of the link that provided by Richard that 357 SIG shows a more linear pressure state, but the Speer manual that you posted shows exponential pressure on a straight walled 9x19. This would seem to conclude that bottleneck cartridges are more forgiving (any experience with the 357sig). My next would be, is there any data on what volume is ideal for bullet seating. Since different bullets have different shapes and weights, is there any info on how much of the bullet base can be in a case before we realize unsafe pressures. OAL would be useless here IMO, since we are actually concerned with the volume the bullet takes up in the case.