Glock Talk banner
Cancel
Create thread New Forums

10mm, 40 Super, & 45 Super?

Jump to Latest
  • Notice image

    Glocktalk is a forum community dedicated to Glock enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about Glock pistols and rifles, optics, hunting, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, and more!

21 - 37 of 37 Posts
#21 ·
thequintessentialman said:
Just curious, if the alpha wolf 6.6" barrel were used, would that require a stronger spring?
Click to expand...
With .40 Super, you're talking about power factors ranging upwards to 260, or more. That's a strong 10mm. The spring that comes in the 21 ejects rounds with a power factor of 195, with a bullet that comes out at half the speed, with no issues. I would definitely look at a stronger spring. Even if the Glock frame would take the punishment, why deal with unnecessary slide bottoming recoil. Once you feel and understand the difference in having recoil springs to match the loads you shoot, you'll NEVER NOT make the adjustment. You want your brass to get ejected, but it doesn't need to go 3 stalls down. Muzzle flip is bad enough. When the slide hits the frame with force, that's a whole other muzzle flip to deal with.
 
#24 ·
I started shooting 45super many years ago in a Smith and Wesson 4506 with a 24lb recoil spring. I thought for sure it was going to take off as the next evolution of the 45acp. Seriously what could be better than a high pressure 45acp for two and four legged predators? Much to my disappointment it remains as an also ran overshadowed by the 10mm, maybe some day it will get the recognition it deserves.
 
#26 ·
The original 45 SUPER developed in late 80's produced loads of 7-800 +ft.lbs .
As with all factory loads They are watered down to protect the not so careful shooter.
And as we all know someone would have shot these loads from a stock 45 acp without proper modifications hurting themselves and gun , suing the ammo manufacture no matter how big of letters used in the warnings on box!

Johnny Rowland capitalized on the original 45 Super idea by lengthening the case to keep hot loads out of unmodified firearms.

A properly set up 45 SUPER CAN achieve over 1000 ft lbs of mz. Energy pretty easily.
I have personally shot loads just shy of 1200 ft lbs from my guns.
Others have exceeded 1200 ft.lb. loads from 6.6" barrels.
 
#27 ·
If modern 45Super is scaled back to below 10mm to keep guns from blowing up then what purpose is the lower performing 45Super? I don't mean to sound snarky if it appears so, I'm generally curious as I thought G21s can shoot 45Super with a 22-24# RSA but I guess that is for the 650ftlb stuff.
 
#28 ·
nikolaz said:
If modern 45Super is scaled back to below 10mm to keep guns from blowing up then what purpose is the lower performing 45Super? I don't mean to sound snarky if it appears so, I'm generally curious as I thought G21s can shoot 45Super with a 22-24# RSA but I guess that is for the 650ftlb stuff.
Click to expand...
If you are fixated on ME, I think you will find that commercial loadings of 45 Super and 10mm fall almost exactly on top of each other when you compare similar bullet weights. Underwoods 180gr 10mm offering come in just shy of 700ft/lbs, almost identical (certainly within the ES of the two calibers) with their 185gr 45 Super offering. Both of these offerings will run in their respective Glock offerings.

When you compare ME, you always have to compare bullet weights as velocity has on outsized impact on the ME number.
 
#29 · (Edited)
1911's and other ACP chambered guns have pretty poor chamber support as the feed ramp is incorporated into chamber of barrel. Same for most all semi auto handguns. Some are worse than others.

The original 45 Super would not rupture a case unless fired in a severely unsupported chamber.
Factory 45 Super loads can be shot in unsupported chambers. If you look at ballistics by the inch data on 45 super they tested in a Glock 36 , one of the least supported chamber guns I have seen in awhile.
So I should have said damage of gun from frame battering instead of "blow up" gun.
I have shot loads from 36 as well as my GAP chambered Glocks into Rowland territory with their unsupported chambers. DO NOT TRY THIS UNLESS YOU ARE A EXPERIENCED HANLOADER AND KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING!
185 gr bullet @1420 fps (modified ACP brass) from a comped G39 baby Glock is a fistfull of power!

ME isn't the whole answer to effective handgun power. And I don't necessarily have anything against 10mm , more so against the 10 owners that think it is the "end all" in handgun stopping power!
Bullet design and bullet weight have ALOT to do with handgun performance .

Another advantage of 45 cal is bullet design , 45 Colt bullets can be loaded in Super taking advantage of the extra velocity . Most ACP bullets and 40 cal bullets are pretty fragile design for lower velocities.
Colt bullets also allow for a wide range of bullet weights , I have shot 335 gr cast bullets from my G21 @1100 fps , properly set up with heavy RSA and GOOD muzzle brake.
 
#31 ·
E1320 said:
Don't forget the 45super brass is more robust (thicker) than 45acp brass.
Click to expand...
Interestingly, I sectioned a Starline 45 Super case and its web is not a great deal thicker than their normal 45 Auto case and less than their +P 45 Auto. Somewhere in their information they explain the Super case is stronger due to improved metallurgy.
 
#32 ·
duncan said:
The Glock 20 is cheaper. Love mine and have a couple of barrels for 40SW, 357 sig and a 6" hunting barrel.

I did not find any converion barrle for the G40?
Click to expand...
They tried the 460 Rowland in the G40/41, but the ramp angle is different and feeding isn't reliable. It's in my article here at GT about the Rowland.
 
#33 ·
Overkill338 said:
They tried the 460 Rowland in the G40/41, but the ramp angle is different and feeding isn't reliable. It's in my article here at GT about the Rowland.
Click to expand...
Thank you, I will read your article.

I have been in love with the hot 45 autos
before I went to gunsmith school, 1987.

Here is some more articles on them, some have good
pictures on case support and sectioned brass.

460 Rowland

http://www.realguns.com/archives/106.htm

http://www.realguns.com/archives/107.htm

http://www.realguns.com/loads/460Rowland.htm

=====================================

45 Super

http://www.realguns.com/archives/020.htm

http://www.realguns.com/archives/021.htm

http://www.realguns.com/archives/022.htm

http://www.realguns.com/loads/45Super.htm

=====================================

More good info on the hot 45 autos,,,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.45_Super

http://www.handgunsandammunition.com/ammo-discussion/6013-45-super-what-can-you-tell-me-about.html
 
#34 ·
Something to think about when you are reloading over max.

Some things that cause bad things to happen.

Not enough case support and thickness of barrel, will not
go into heat treating.

The thickness of the 45 barrel in the Glock21 and the AM barrels
can blow at around 60 to 65000 PSI, that's what one of the barrel
makers told me and I believe him from other projects I have done
and reading about it.

It is good to stay well below that breaking point, like 50 to 60 %,
some guns are made with a 100% + safety margin, will not tell the
ones that are because many would really run the pressures up
and may get into trouble.

There are good reasons to keep your pressures under 40000 PSI
in the 460 Rowland, like the boolit being pushed back in the case
and raising the pressure and blowing your gun up. I know one
guy that did just that. I like a big safety margin for my fingers.
 
#35 ·
WeeWilly said:
If you are fixated on ME, I think you will find that commercial loadings of 45 Super and 10mm fall almost exactly on top of each other when you compare similar bullet weights. Underwoods 180gr 10mm offering come in just shy of 700ft/lbs, almost identical (certainly within the ES of the two calibers) with their 185gr 45 Super offering. Both of these offerings will run in their respective Glock offerings.

When you compare ME, you always have to compare bullet weights as velocity has on outsized impact on the ME number.
Click to expand...
I'll just stick with the 10mm,my new love.
 
#36 ·
Overkill338 said:
I'll just stick with the 10mm,my new love.
Click to expand...
The 10mm Glocks might be the most flexible caliber gun out there. You can load it down to 40 levels and have a genuine man stopper that shoots like a gamer load, you can step on the gas and have a street caliber capable of stout barrier penetration, go farther with a wide flat point bullet that will work for any game in NA. Hard to beat in a such an approachable package.

The funny thing is none of the above is about Muzzle Energy. ;)
 
21 - 37 of 37 Posts
About this Discussion
36 Replies
11 Participants
Last post:
Overkill338
Glock Talk
posts
22M
members
203K
Since
1999
A forum community dedicated to Glock firearm owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about optics, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, troubleshooting, accessories, classifieds, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
General Glocking General Firearms Forum Sold/Expired Cop Talk GSSF