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Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Carolina Drifter, Oct 27, 2010.
WTF are we fighting in a country that is having talks with Iran and the Midget?
Karzai's administration knows that we'll leave him high and dry with no second thoughts, and the idea of Obama/NATO pulling our troops out and leaving Karzai to fend for himself against Iran has him shaking in his boots.
Can't blame him. If the DOD, NATO, and our politicians would let our soldiers do their jobs and defeat the enemy instead of tying our soldiers' hands behind their backs the government of Afghanistan would be able to stand on its own two feet right now. But the three parties I mentioned WANT Afghanistan and the surrounding area to remain unstable so that they can do as they please with it.
Wait, was the enemy terrorism, Islam, practitioners of one or both within the geographic confines of Afghanistan, or...?
They're not just talking.
We have learned very litte from the Vietnam war........
And with that comment, ladies and gentlemen, we have a winner.
throughout history no one has been able to win afghanistan. We don't have a chance of doing anything constructive in that country, especially with the restrictions are troops have.
I'd say our best bet of keeping that country from going back to complete hell is to funnel money in there to reconstruct the country, and hope they can stand on their own and defend themselves.
America invaded Iraq and Afghanistan on China's dime and ultimately for the benefit of Iran. Before we stepped in Iran had a history of aideing Shiite Afghans (mostly Tajik and Hazara) during the Iranian civil war and had a very, very bad relationship with the Taliban. There was actually an incident where the Taliban (big T taliban since they were the governing body at the time) murdered a bunch of Iranian diplomats as spys and Iran damn near invaded back then. Not only that but most of the warlord supporting the Taliban were big in the opium trade and they often use Iran as a transshipment point into Turkey and onto the west.
H. W. Bush screwed the pooch when he left the Pashtuns high and dry after the Soviets left. They have now come to see America just as they see Britain and Russia, foreign powers who will use you till they are done and then leave. Honestly though, there are not many other palatable options. We have been there longer than we fought WWII and we simply can not afford to stay there much longer.
The upside to all of this is that if Iran does end up pulling the strings when we leave, you can pretty much count on a lot more effective anti-narcotics operations as well as anti-Taliban pograms. The IRGC doesn't have the same ROE that we do and they make our CIA secret prisons look like Chucky Cheeses.
Amen. Afghanistan today looks a hell of a lot like Vietnam did. We have forces garrisoned in cities and are finally bringing them in from remote FOBs out in the sticks. I read Sebastian Junger's book and could have sworn it was about Vietnam.
We had the same attitude the Soviets had, "all those other empires have failed but we have all kinds of tanks and planes, we can stomp these goat effers into the ground".
When I was in Iraq in 2004/2005 I was rotated to Qatar for a 4 day pass since I didn't take leave. While there, I met a Lt. Col. who was rotating in from Afghanistan. At that time we had about 30k troops there. He said we were losing momentum then and needed 300,000 troops, not 30,000 to get ahead again. I know the dynamics are different in Iraq and Afghanistan but after the initial routing of the Taliban, the following couple years left a vacuum to which the center of gravity in the GWOT has now shifted to.
A lot of the problem is that Bush and his cabinet never intended to occupy Afghanistan like we are. The big concern in the first days of the war was to limit the number of forces inside the country to avoid becoming the Soviets ("we are here to help comrade!!!"). Dubya was sold on the idea that we could defeat the taliban using CIA, SOF, air power and local warlords we had bought off. At the onset it worked really well at destroying Taliban infrastructure (they actually had an air force, believe it or not) and ever stopping attacks but at the end of the day we realize it was going to be tough to accomplish our goals without boots on the ground.
From there we sent in enough forces to hold the capital and shortly after that the focus shifted from Afghanistan to prepping for the invasion of Iraq. We took JSOC teams that were hunting HVTs out to start training to hunt Saddam and pointed the geosync birds watching the south to Iraq. This gave the recently crushed Taliban a huge area to regroup and rearm without having to worry about being targeted. They also had TONS of support from the Pakistani ISI at the time, bringing them food, fuel, ammo and medical supplies.
the bags of money from Iran could have had something to do with tankers of oil going to Iran and breaking the embargo due to the nuclear program.
Influence peddling likely part of it as well -- influence also buys illegal oil
More amazing is that the Russians are going to return to "help" NATO !!
We've already told them we're bailing and when. Iran isn't going anywhere and will soon, or already does, have nuclear weapons.
....perhaps you should present it to the moonbats in the GTPI forum!!
Because that's where our Commander-in Chief, Obama wants to focus our war efforts.
that would have worked as well for us as it did for the USSR
What is the alternative? Tell Afghanistan we are willing to bankrupt our nation (not to mention sacrificing our military) to make sure Iran doesn't have any influence?
Interesting insight. Thanks!