GlockTalk Forum banner

41 - 60 of 104 Posts

·
Anything that goes BANG or BOOM is just fine!
Joined
·
62 Posts
42 years before I hung it up. We still train and qual with shotguns, both slug and buck.
Have ran both auto and pump, do prefer auto over the pump. The young guys do seem to like the shotgun, as long as they also have the 223 option.

But there is no sound like the racking of a pump gun!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
57 Posts
I carried a Scattergun Tech 870 that I ordered after trying one out at a shotgun class. I called SGT in Brentwood, TN it got to me about a week later. Although I later had several different patrol rifles (a Springfield M1A, an early Colt AR Sporter, an AUG and later, a Noveske SBR) , Lamar was always in the passenger seat. I started in 1985, so the patrol rifle had not really been discovered yet. I never, ever felt undergunned with a Smith Model 19, 2 speedloaders and an 870. I finished up with a Glock 19, 2 extra mags, a G43 and Seecamp, my SBR and Lamar. My, how times change :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,735 Posts
You named your shotgun Lamar? HA! That's awesome! Mine is named grandpa. It's funny how most weapons don't receive names, but shotguns usually do.

Like you, I also started my LE career with a good ol' wheelgun (S&W 681) a pair of speed loaders, a model 60 on my ankle and ol' grandpa next to me. The state troopers had a patrol rifle (Ruger Mini 14) but us city boys did not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,502 Posts
Discussion Starter #44
You named your shotgun Lamar? HA! That's awesome! Mine is named grandpa. It's funny how most weapons don't receive names, but shotguns usually do.

Like you, I also started my LE career with a good ol' wheelgun (S&W 681) a pair of speed loaders, a model 60 on my ankle and ol' grandpa next to me. The state troopers had a patrol rifle (Ruger Mini 14) but us city boys did not.
I chuckled at Lamar also. Hilarious.

I’ve always called my 870 Bettie.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,502 Posts
Discussion Starter #45
I finally got approved for a two hour block of training with the shotgun.

Two hours! That’s it.

That’s not much time.

Any ideas what should be included. It’s going to be bare bones. Obviously the focus has to be on emergency loading and topping off.

I’d also like to do a quick pattern test at 50, 40, 25, 15 and 7 yards. I want them to see how effective the flite-control buckshot is past 25 yards.

And I’d like to cover pistol transitions as well.

Any other ideas? Time is short but I am open to ideas.

I’m hoping to use this as a refresher and if the results are good maybe they will give me another two hours at the next months training.

I did this little pattern test yesterday. The results are good but I was shooting a bead sight and my groups were high. Even though the patterns were good IMO, then being off center doesn’t have the same visual appeal. I need to use a ghost ring or rifle sight shotgun for the demonstration at the class to make sure it’s centered up.

69A00C0D-3997-4199-90D4-5CD78B7CBA34.jpeg
2633F3A9-7878-44CE-B218-56DD258CC28C.jpeg
A766EA40-C36A-48A8-9458-4C2CE600E305.jpeg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,173 Posts
You covered most of what I would recommend; combat reloading, transitioning to the handgun ( this highlights the importance of a sling) etc;

I would also do a visual aid for the overhead or other projector ( for pre-range classroom, you can even use a laptop screen if need be) with a shooters eye view photo showing the proper sight picture with the bead sight and the target in view ( you want the bead HERE ) .....

For qualification purposes I would do whatever the standard is on paper, quickly, and then I would run them on a short course (on steel) using reactive targets ( poppers work best) incorporating movement, cover usage ( a vehicle, simulated wall/ support columnns etc using plywood, folding tables,on their sides or stood on end, plastic barrels) with a pistol transition at the end; sounds like a lot, but it's maybe,a minute per person, and they will like it so much they will want to run it again....

I have had alot of success over the years doing quals FIRST . it takes the job-related,stress off the student and makes them alot more receptive to the things you are teaching them; the course will have its own stress, which will have them focusing on tactics rather than the distractive apprehension associated with qualifying....

Just a couple of ideas....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,158 Posts
I used to carry a Remington 870 Police Marine Magnum. Folks tell me there's no such thing, but Davidson's did a run of them some years ago. Then our doofus chief declared, "shotguns have gone the way of the dodo bird for street law enforcement", and he made us stop carrying shotguns just like that.

He eventually got fired, and for my participation in that I'll never get promoted past sergeant which is another story. But, our current chief approved shotgun carry at the beginning of the year, and we still don't have them. We ditched slugs and buckshot for segmented slugs which the department has already purchased. We are supposed to receive an order of new Mossberg 590s in November and will have quals shortly thereafter.

Like it used to be, we will be allowed to carry our own shotguns which is what I'll be doing again. I still have the 870 Police Marine Magnum, but I'm leaning toward full old school. Not too long ago I bought a beat up trade in 870 at GT's for $190. I cleaned it up and refinished the horrible wood, and it is one great shooting shotgun. Not bad for $190.



And here's the shotgun folks have told me doesn't exist.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,173 Posts
I used to carry a Remington 870 Police Marine Magnum. Folks tell me there's no such thing, but Davidson's did a run of them some years ago. Then our doofus chief declared, "shotguns have gone the way of the dodo bird for street law enforcement", and he made us stop carrying shotguns just like that.

He eventually got fired, and for my participation in that I'll never get promoted past sergeant which is another story. But, our current chief approved shotgun carry at the beginning of the year, and we still don't have them. We ditched slugs and buckshot for segmented slugs which the department has already purchased. We are supposed to receive an order of new Mossberg 590s in November and will have quals shortly thereafter.

Like it used to be, we will be allowed to carry our own shotguns which is what I'll be doing again. I still have the 870 Police Marine Magnum, but I'm leaning toward full old school. Not too long ago I bought a beat up trade in 870 at GT's for $190. I cleaned it up and refinished the horrible wood, and it is one great shooting shotgun. Not bad for $190.



And here's the shotgun folks have told me doesn't exist.

I'm an 870 guy from way back; having said that, I think you will really like the 590, they are very nice, very solid guns....
 

·
Mr. Awesome
Joined
·
10,458 Posts
You covered most of what I would recommend; combat reloading, transitioning to the handgun ( this highlights the importance of a sling) etc;

I would also do a visual aid for the overhead or other projector ( for pre-range classroom, you can even use a laptop screen if need be) with a shooters eye view photo showing the proper sight picture with the bead sight and the target in view ( you want the bead HERE ) ...
I have had alot of success over the years doing quals FIRST .
Even with classroom beforehand, I disagree with having the first shot a person who never has held a shotgun take be with a slug or buck shot, in a qualification course. I’m more on board with crawl, walk, run. Some small ball bird shot is how I would start the live fire portion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,173 Posts
Even with classroom beforehand, I disagree with having the first shot a person who never has held a shotgun take be with a slug or buck shot, in a qualification course. I’m more on board with crawl, walk, run. Some small ball bird shot is how I would start the live fire portion.
Yeah, I was aiming more at people with some shotgun experience; for complete new students, I agree that some fam fire with birdshot/ trap loads is absolutely the way to go.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,475 Posts
My last department issued us 18" Mossberg 500 shotguns with the five-shot tube and bead sights. They were fine. But I carried my personally owned 20" Special Purpose 590 8+1 with ghost ring sights and a light and sidesaddle and correct two point sling. It was a pure slug gun.

It is riki-tick, and even has authentic old school wood police corncob wood stocks for the cool factor. Love that shotgun. An upgraded 1955 police pump shotgun.

When I joined the Sheriffs Department I was issued a Special Purpose 590 18" with bead sights. A good shotgun. But they have all been pulled back and are in the armory for some unexplained reason.
Riki-Tick, haven't seen someone use that term since the Army days.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,502 Posts
Discussion Starter #54
Even with classroom beforehand, I disagree with having the first shot a person who never has held a shotgun take be with a slug or buck shot, in a qualification course. I’m more on board with crawl, walk, run. Some small ball bird shot is how I would start the live fire portion.
Yeah, I was aiming more at people with some shotgun experience; for complete new students, I agree that some fam fire with birdshot/ trap loads is absolutely the way to go.
These are all experienced officers with little to know shotgun experience. No formal training, just handed a shotgun years ago. I have seen some very poor shotgun handling and a lack of basic operation. That’s why I have been pushing the shotgun class so much.

I am a firearms instructor and I am proficient with my shotgun, and practice often. But I do not consider my lately qualified for any “advanced” level instruction.
 

·
Farmer, House Sitter and Cook
Joined
·
5,759 Posts
I wish you luck Brother that you can get the funding to implement shotgun training that is beyond just familiarization. Shotguns are still an incredibly effective tool.

Stay Safe,

Dave (nitesite)
 

·
Farmer, House Sitter and Cook
Joined
·
5,759 Posts
I finally got approved for a two hour block of training with the shotgun.

Two hours! That’s it.

That’s not much time..... I need to use a ghost ring or rifle sight shotgun for the demonstration at the class to make sure it’s centered up.
I will loan you my 590 with ghost rings if it would help you in your instruction. You can keep it as long as you need. It shoots spot on.

Work-Guns.jpg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,502 Posts
Discussion Starter #57
I wish you luck Brother that you can get the funding to implement shotgun training that is beyond just familiarization. Shotguns are still an incredibly effective tool.

Stay Safe,

Dave (nitesite)
They really do not get the respect they deserve. I still carry mine and grab it more often than a rifle.

We have about 80 shotguns and most of them are no longer in patrol. Th Rey haven’t been issued in quite a few years and the majority of officers with shotguns are in detectives, schools, admin etc.....

I’m about to check the last years’ qualifications and if you haven’t qualified with it I am taking it back to be reissued to some of these younger guys with no long guns.

I have a feeling most are in lockers or closets at home collecting dust.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,502 Posts
Discussion Starter #58
I will loan you my 590 with ghost rings if it would help you in your instruction. You can keep it as long as you need. It shoots spot on.

View attachment 836384
I appreciate the offer.

I have XS low profile rifle sights or a bead sight on all of my shotguns, but I’m sure I can round up a gun with rifle sights. They issue them with the Remington factory rifle sights. Which I despise. I think they’re lousy, but will work fine for centering my pattern up.

I just grabbed an old Winchester 1300 Defender the other day because I wouldn’t feel the need to clean it before I returned to work.

The guns we have issued are bare bones. They come with a carry strap, like hunting style sling. About 2/3 of them have Tac-Star side saddles, the rest do not. That’s it.

No light. 4 shot tubes. No proper sling.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
544 Posts
Sorry, the lesson plan I wrote for our Basic Academy was three days - I could barely cover shotgun safety and nomenclature in two hours.

The Remington rifle sights are breakage waiting to happen. I changed all ours out for bead sites, for commonality, and the fact that Ghost Rings weren't very common at that time, and the fact budget.

I carried a shotgun in addition to an AR on up to and on my last watch.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,502 Posts
Discussion Starter #60
Sorry, the lesson plan I wrote for our Basic Academy was three days - I could barely cover shotgun safety and nomenclature in two hours.

The Remington rifle sights are breakage waiting to happen. I changed all ours out for bead sites, for commonality, and the fact that Ghost Rings weren't very common at that time, and the fact budget.

I carried a shotgun in addition to an AR on up to and on my last watch.
Yea, two hours is a joke. But it’s all I got.

Hoping to Atleast get some repetitions in.
 
41 - 60 of 104 Posts
Top