White bar owner is charged with manslaughter in James Scurlock (BLM) shooting

Discussion in 'Political Issues' started by DonGlock26, Sep 17, 2020.

  1. DonGlock26

    DonGlock26

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    Notice the media's use of race in the headline even though no hate crime charges have been filed? You'll never see a headline like "Black Man Charged With Raping and Murdering College Coed".

    " 'It's about justice': White bar owner is charged with manslaughter in James Scurlock shooting

    In a resounding indictment reflective of the twists and turmoil of 2020, a grand jury on Tuesday charged a white bar owner in the shooting death of a 22-year-old Black man during protests downtown on May 30.

    The grand jury rejected Jake Gardner’s claims that he acted in self-defense in the death of James Scurlock, charging him with four felonies: manslaughter, attempted first-degree assault, making terroristic threats and weapon use. If convicted, Gardner, 38, could face up to 95 years in prison.

    Whether that indictment restores a sense of order — or creates a chaotic court battle — remains to be seen. Special prosecutor Fred Franklin, who led the grand jury, was quick to note Tuesday that the indictment indicates probable cause, which is a much lower standard than the one needed to convict: proof beyond a reasonable doubt. And Gardner’s defense team is expected to mount a vigorous self-defense case.

    https://omaha.com/news/local/crime-...f9845c51b.html#tracking-source=home-top-story "
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2020
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  2. DonGlock26

    DonGlock26

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    Last edited: Sep 17, 2020
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  3. Scamp57

    Scamp57

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    Self defense. Not guilty.
     
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  4. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    No doubt he made the world a better place, but I wouldn't put his trial odds at better than 50/50. Less than that if he was farther northeast or on the west coast.

    Probably, his chances are not nearly as good as 50/50, unless the jury has some people who really hate the rioters.

    It is self-defense if we leave out those parts I put in bold, but with those parts it looks like he was the "initial aggressor" and he shot a guy who was using force against him in defense of a third party.
     
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  5. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    That's an important thing to get right. Can you explain?

    IMO, his self-defense problem is that he shot a person who was lawfully using force against him, in defense of another person. That makes him the bad guy.
     
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  6. DonGlock26

    DonGlock26

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    Be careful. The parts in bold are the media's account. I'd like to see the video slowed down with objective explanation.
     
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  7. Taz

    Taz

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    This one is going to be tough to prove self defense. It kind of looks like he initiated the physical altercation. Not sure how you can claim self defense when you started the physical stuff to begin with.

    Stupid decisions all around. Cost one guy his life and another will be screwed no matter how it turns out.
     
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  8. Scamp57

    Scamp57

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    The DA explained it in the video posted.
     
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  9. Quijibo

    Quijibo King Doofus.

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    Bowing to terrorists only makes them bolder. This is why we are where we are today.
     
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  10. DaleGribble

    DaleGribble Liberals 'R Bad!!!!

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    David Gardner is the shooter's father, he's the one who pushed the woman. Jake Gardner did the shooting, not the pushing.
     
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  11. nerr

    nerr

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    If I recall, Jake was also carrying with an expired permit, which came out after the original self-defense ruling.

    Lessons learned:
    1. Keep your paperwork current. (In Omaha, you also need a permit to open carry).
    2. Except to declare that you were attacked and feared great bodily harm and identify yourself to cops, keep your mouth shut until your lawyer tells you to talk: the special prosecutor said "... much of the evidence that “undermined” the self-defense assessment came from Gardner himself".

    Not sure how this will turn out. I fear nothing good will come out of it, no matter what.

    https://www.foxnews.com/us/nebraska...t-shooting-death-initially-ruled-self-defense
     
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  12. Will Rudy

    Will Rudy

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    "When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are safe." -- Luke 11:21
     
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  13. Scamp57

    Scamp57

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    This.
     
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  14. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    No, he didn't. He didn't mention the facts that they are saying caused him to be indicted - that the father and son from the bar started the fight, so he unlawfully shot someone who was defending a third party from an unlawful attack.
     
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  15. Scamp57

    Scamp57

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    "Gardner was released from police custody after the county attorney concluded that he had acted in self-defense against Scurlock, who was holding Gardner in a chokehold or a headlock at the time that the shot was fired."
     
  16. PrescottGlock

    PrescottGlock

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    Please keep in mind that a defendant's prior aggressive behavior may play a role in how the jury looks at the defendant's culpability, because we are humans and tend to judge people for actions having little or nothing to do with the criminal charge, but the relevant facts (according to the article) appear to be as follows:
    • Gardner's dad pushed a woman.
    • Gardner went over to help his dad.
    • Gardner showed his firearm but did not point it at the dead guy or the girl.
    • Gardner returned the gun to his waistband (jeez Louise, get a holster. You wanna shoot your dick off??).
    • After that, the woman tackled him from behind. Gardner is thereby put in harm's way.
    • Gardner pulls the pistol and fires two "warning shots," neither of which hit anybody.
    • Gardner puts the pistol back in his holst ... geez, his waistband.
    • He starts to get up from the ground.
    • Dead guy then jumps on his back and puts Gardner in a choke hold.
    • At that point, Gardner has not "initiated" the contact. He has his back to dead guy, the weapon is in his holst ... waistband and the dead guy jumps on his back and puts him in a chokehold.
    • At which point both Gardner and the father yell, "Get off me [or him]."
    • Chokeholds can kill you.
    • Gardner had at that point reasonable fear of his personal safety for reasons having nothing to do with any illegal action on his behalf.
    • Dead guy was not in fear of his personal safety that would authorize him to put Gardner in a choke hold.
    • Specifically, Gardner is on the ground, back to dead guy, weapon not out, weapon certainly not pointed at dead guy.
    • Finally, a lot of states provide that a person is not authorized to use force to defend third parties unless the third party is a spouse or immediate relative (parent, child).
    • That is to prevent third-parties from doing stupid things after misinterpreting who is the good guy and who is the bad guy in an altercation involving people he doesn't know.
    • Therefore, possible dead guy had no right to "protect" the woman who tackled Gardner.
    Oh, and you can damn well bet that the defense is going to play the tape of the DA saying originally it was self-defense. "Reasonable doubt?!? The DA had reasonable doubt!!"
     
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  17. Taz

    Taz

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    That's a detailed summary. Not a lawyer but if this sequence of events is accurate the Gardners are still the aggressors. Dad initiates a physical altercation making him the aggressor. No1 son then brandishes a gun where AFAWK no imminent threat is present requiring the use of a gun. Hope his lawyer can come up with a valid reason to pull gun. If not he will be the one who escalated the situation aka became the aggressor. He then gets tackled by folks who are going to argue they saw a guy flash a gun and thought he was going to start killing folks. Decent argument for using a gun against 2 attackers, but will still be questioned as he is the one that raised the stakes by flashing a gun for what folks will argue is not a good reason. He then squeezes off 2 rounds missing everything in sight (thankfully no injuring anyone else) and gets jumped by a guy whose lawyer will argue was just trying to stop an active shooter...

    ABSOLUTELY NOTHING good will come of this. 1 guy is dead, maybe not a loss to society, but ws this a situation where a gun was needed to begin with? For his sake, I hope he and his lawyer can articulate a good reason why the gun was introduced to begin with. IMO that will be the key to his defense. When he flashed the gun at the onset, better have damned good reason to justify that action. Without good justification he is the aggressor and everyone else can claim they were just reacting to a guy who pulled a gun where one wasn't needed.
     
  18. glockman66

    glockman66

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    redneck ron Displaced Hillbilly

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  20. Emily W Trott

    Emily W Trott "Gary" is now a part of my past

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