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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I want to load a light 124gr load for regular target practice. Anyone have a feel for what velocity you need to reliably cycle the action? Today I loaded 4.3gr W231 behind a 124gr RMR jacketed flat point (i've got 1,000 of them) for an average velocity of 1060fps. It was my first 9mm reloading attempt. Cycled perfect but don't know how much lower I can go. 4.7gr of Unique was 1120fps. COL was 1.105". I must confess I'm shooting a Walther PDP but there isn't much relevant chatter on the Walther forum so here I am.
 

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It might be kinda hard to give you an exact number. Just depends how stiffly sprung it is.
It does sound like to me you are wanting something like a minor power factor load.
I dont compete but i do load a minor power factor for my czs2. With the factory spring in it the cases drible out the slide. It cycles with the factory spring but iam sure its not super reliable i put a lighter spring in it so it will toss the cases 3-4 feet.
That same load i have serious doubts that it would cycle my g17.5.

Let me add .
My experiance the starting loads in manuals are normaly pretty dang low I would start there or very close to there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
My gun is 100% factory. I'll probably just start dropping .2gr at a time until it doesn't cycle any more and then go back up by .2gr. Also, not 100% sure of my COL. Think it's good, cycled well, did "plunk test" but spinning the case did produce marks all the way to 1.060" which I think must be me imparting some angle on the case when I pinch the base of the brass to spin it.
 

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Every gun is diff. Loads that will cycle inmy g17 wont inmy g26. Skide mass/speed, recoil spriing rate, all matters when shooting low end loads. If you want stupid soft recoil with good functioning, go heavier bullet moving slower. A 147gr bullet at 800-825fps will be really soft & most likely function. You couod probably knock another 50fps & still be gtg, just drop it another 2/10 & give it a go.
 

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124 grainers will run both my G17’s, my G26 and a G34 at about 950 fps.
 

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my standard load for any 9 mm handgun or AR9 for the last decade or so has been 4.0 gr, of Win 231 under any 120/125 gr TC/RN, cast and lubed, cast and coated, plated or jacketed.

I did try to go lower but got cycling issues, if I remember correctly, with steel framed handguns. all the Glocks I have owned in 9mm or with a 9mm conversion barrel and stock RSA worked without issue.

when 231 became "unatainium" I tried AA No. 2, Ramshot Silhouette and WSF. No. 2 and Silhouette are very fine and I had leaking issues with my Lee Auto Disk powder measure and lower charges of WSF gave bigger groups and unburn powder residue.

I managed to get a couple of pounds of 231 and as once I've ran out of WSF I'll start back with 231 but will be going to a heavier bullet to develop a load for suppressor use.
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Thank you all very much, that was the info I was looking for. Sounds like I should try 4.0gr of 231. I believe I read that Unique works better in the upper half of the power range rather than in the lower half, please correct me if I'm wrong.
 

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I load my 124 fmj PD with 4.1 N320 @ 1.145 for 130pf. Cycles every 9mm that I own. My preference for competition is either 147 or 165s. It shoots flat and recoils like a pellet gun.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
This morning I tried 4.0-4.1gr (accepted either amount on digital scale) W231 with mixed brass and the RMR 124gr FP's. It cycled just fine though a couple didn't get thrown very far. Guessing that's about as low I can go and still cycle 100%. 4 of the 5 rounds went into 1.6" at 25 yards. 5th would open group to 2.9". Wish I knew which case threw the stinker. Didn't have time to set up the chrono but guessing 1000-1025fps. Think I'll call this load a winner.
 

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I want to load a light 124gr load for regular target practice. Anyone have a feel for what velocity you need to reliably cycle the action? Today I loaded 4.3gr W231 behind a 124gr RMR jacketed flat point (i've got 1,000 of them) for an average velocity of 1060fps. It was my first 9mm reloading attempt. Cycled perfect but don't know how much lower I can go. 4.7gr of Unique was 1120fps. COL was 1.105". I must confess I'm shooting a Walther PDP but there isn't much relevant chatter on the Walther forum so here I am.
You'd be better off practicing with ammo that yas a similar recoil impulse and that shoots to the same point of aim as the ammo you carry and even Plus+P 9mm ammo doesn't have all that much recoil in even the compact version of the 24 ounce PDP with a 4 inch barrel which is almost identical to a Glock 19 which weighs 23.6 ounces.

Instead of shooting powder puff loads, you're better of practicing with full power loads and possibly getting some formal instruction to learn how to grip the gun correctly to be able to deal with t recoil. even if this isn't the gun you carry for defensive purposes, one never knows when it might be called upon for that purpose, but if it is to be carried, it's absolutely critical that you learn to shoot it with the most effective ammo available and it's fortunate that you already know how to reload to make a sufficient amount of practice ammo so that you can become proficient with the gun.
 

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You'd be better off practicing with ammo that yas a similar recoil impulse and that shoots to the same point of aim as the ammo you carry and even Plus+P 9mm ammo doesn't have all that much recoil in even the compact version of the 24 ounce PDP with a 4 inch barrel which is almost identical to a Glock 19 which weighs 23.6 ounces.

Instead of shooting powder puff loads, you're better of practicing with full power loads and possibly getting some formal instruction to learn how to grip the gun correctly to be able to deal with t recoil. even if this isn't the gun you carry for defensive purposes, one never knows when it might be called upon for that purpose, but if it is to be carried, it's absolutely critical that you learn to shoot it with the most effective ammo available and it's fortunate that you already know how to reload to make a sufficient amount of practice ammo so that you can become proficient with the gun.
Shooting (for example) Production Steel Challenge with 145 PF ammo is just as dumb as doing all your defensive practice and testing with 110 PF ammo.

From a developmental standpoint, using a direct regression of the desired outcome is one of the best approaches. If you can bench 135 for 5 reps and want to be able to single 315, you don't just 'get some formal instruction' and throw 6 wheels on the bar. You take calculated progressive steps with steadily increasing loads.

Same holds true for pistol shooting. Keeping the gun and caliber constant and just lowering the PF is way more effective than going to rimfire or struggling to drop time or build technique with a fixed higher PF.

It can also be a lot of fun to mix and match PF's for different applications - like shooting SCSA from concealment with your carry gear. Maybe even throw in reloads to the stop plate. That's a great way to get subconscious reps in on draws and reloads, and a good example of where it's nice to have your gun dialed in to a wider PF range.

Sure, you could up the ante by setting an SCSA par goal for shooting with carry-power ammo. But that's kind of a party trick.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
4.0gr W231 with RMR 124 Flat Points will not cycle reliably in my Walther PDP, multiple failures today. Yesterday I ran 4.1gr and had 1 failure out of 25. Granted my gun isn't even broken in yet but it looks like 4.2 grains of W231 would be the minimum load to cycle reliably and that's gonna be between 1025 and 1050FPS.
 

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4.0gr W231 with RMR 124 Flat Points will not cycle reliably in my Walther PDP, multiple failures today. Yesterday I ran 4.1gr and had 1 failure out of 25. Granted my gun isn't even broken in yet but it looks like 4.2 grains of W231 would be the minimum load to cycle reliably and that's gonna be between 1025 and 1050FPS.
4.2g W231/HP38 with 124g Hitek coated LRN bullets run all my 9mms reliably.
 
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