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Discussion in 'General Glocking' started by huntersdog, Sep 18, 2019.
I carried one for a while.
Lots of firepower in a small package
If I were going to get a conversion barrel for my G20SF, I'd go with 9mm Dillon rather than 357 Sig.
I have considered it. That's why my "nightstand gun" isn't a 357 SIG. But, when I'm out and about I will carry a 357 SIG at times. I live in a rural area, pistol calibers that shoot flat have advantages.
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So, since the muzzle velocity and kinetic energy obtainable from handguns is somewhat irrelevant in terms of terminal ballistics, how is it that a hot high tech 230gr 45acp projectile not superior to a hot, high tech 125gr 357sig projectile assuming equally accurate hits on the bad guy? As I carry both calibers from time to time, the question has crossed my mind. I'd like to know the answer.
Both have roughly the same power when commercial ammo is used and the 357 Sig has a much greater ammo selection.
As I have noted before the G33 when loaded with one of the three 125gr rounds offered by Underwood has a velocity and energy equal to the classic 357 Magnum 125gr round. BOTH the 357 Sig G33 and 4" barrel 357 Mag loaded with 125gr rounds get velocities in the 1450 fps neighborhood and 580 ft/lbs of energy. This makes the G33 fully adequate for SD,HD, car gun, woods gun, hunting and it's easily concealed. That's why it's called versatile!
There isn't much commercial ammo for the 9X25 Dillon but there's Underwood.
And comparing Underwood's 9X25 ammo to their 357 sig ammo you get significantly more power with the 9x25 to the tune of 225 more FPS and 200 more FPE. And with standard commercial ammo, the difference is even greater between most commercial 357 Sig ammo and the only available ammo for the 9X25.
And as far as ammo selection, if you reload, the 9X25 has unlimited ammo selection.
Cartridge 9x25mm Dillon
Grain Weight 124 Grains
Quantity 20 Round
Muzzle Velocity 1700 Feet Per Second
Muzzle Energy 802 Foot Pounds
Bullet Style Jacketed Hollow Point
Bullet Brand And Model: Hornady XTP
Cartridge 357 Sig
Grain Weight 124 Grains
Quantity 20 Round
Muzzle Velocity 1475 Feet Per Second
Muzzle Energy 604 Foot Pounds
Bullet Style Jacketed Hollow Point
Bullet Brand And Model: Nosler Jacketed Hollow Point
The Underwood 357 Sig velocity is established using a 4 inch barrel, the UA 9X25 Dillon velocity is established using a 6 inch barrel (common for the Dillon). The 357 Sig 125gr velocity out of a 5 inch barrel is 1620 fps out of a 6 inch barrel it would no doubt approach the 1700 fps Dillon velocity. UA also offers three times more ammo choices than Dillon choices.
Reloads of course are whatever you make them.
Too freakin loud indoors
Use hearing protection as with any guns indoors.
I do use hearing protection during my regular (indoors) shooting sessions, however, the thread is about "carry gun" which implies a shooter most likely wont have time to put on hearing protection when shooting in a self defense situation.
Any gun fired indoors without protection can cause hearing loss. I have shot the 357 Sig indoors and outdoors without protection with only marginal effect on my hearing. Certainly nothing to give even a second thought to in a serious SD situation.
Your welcome to disagree, however, in terms of terminal ballistics on human beings, there is virtually no difference in effectiveness amoung the service calibers. Everyone likes to justify their choice of manufacturer, caliber and ammo. And that's all fine and often fun to chat about. But at some point it all goes back to how effective is a service caliber on a bad guy and the simple fact of the matter is that they are all about the same. The rest is just folks trying to justify their choices.
Now, in some situations a .357sig might make sense. Such as a rural/desert/wide open spaces situation where you may be called on for a longer than normal shot and want a little more pepper on the round at the far end of the distance. For typical 10 feet or less SD it just isn't going to matter....at all...in any way, shape or form. As someone that has been in multiple surgeries, where rounds of various calibers are taken from real bodies, and talking with real surgeons about it, they don't know the caliber until they pull out the bullet. Modern calibers, with modern bullets do pretty much the same damage inside a real body.
Velocity for handguns is a moot point and pretty meaningless. Yes, I did say it...it is pretty meaningless. Jump it up to a rifle and now we have a different discussion. But a bad guy isn't going to know the difference between being shot with a .357sig 125 grain at 1450fps and a 9mm 124 grain going 1200fps given equal depths of penetration and same shot placement. That 250 fps of extra velocity means nothing. Depth of penetration is the primary factor equal with shot placement. Having grown up on magnums I am pretty proficient with them and not recoil shy. But I'm also honest enough to say that as well as I shoot the higher velocity pistols, which is really well, I can shoot lower velocity pistols even better in terms of faster and more accurate follow up shots. In the time it takes me to quickly and accurately put two 357 rounds on target I can pump in five or six 9mm rounds. I'd rather have the five or six vs. the two given sufficient penetration depths. The bigger bang and flash doesn't impress me and it won't impress the bad guy.
Top that off with ammo costing 2X or 3X as much for no real return in terminal ballistics and I have to say 'thanks but no thanks to the .357 sig for SD carry'. Not disrespecting anyone who chooses the .357sig, not my intention. Simply stating the obvious. I've had several .357sigs in various platforms and eventually got rid of all of them. They simply don't check any boxes for me.
The 357 Sig is more impressive at knocking down steel, but I'd like to bring up this little excerpt:
"The maximum momentum transferred from different small arms projectiles, including large caliber rifles and shotguns, to an 80 kg body is only 0.01 to 0.18 m/s, negligible compared to the 1 to 2 m/s velocity of a pedestrian."
So it is good at knocking down steel, but is equally ineffective as 9mm for transferring momentum into a person. You'd transfer more momentum just bumping into them on the street.
My thoughts are it's an awesome carry gun. Just be prepared to have to hold it with a little more authority than, say, a G26. This isn't saying it's bad. It's saying for those recoil sensitive, there may be a better option in a gun the same size.
Or those that wish to put more rounds, accurately on target in the same amount of time there are better options.
Lol, the reality is the 9mm is a 50 yard gun on head shots, the .357 sig a 60 yard gun. About 3 years ago I had a plethora of ground hogs, my hold with open sights found me having to hold about 2” higher @65 yards with the 9mm. Both 9mm and .357 sig start the journey of following the rainbow after that.
Personally Ive had the 33 and 31.....they are now gifted to my sons. I still have (3) 26’s and (3) 17’s. I have (2) dillion 650’s and roll my own as well.
Nothing wrong will the .357 sig on paper. Your issues will be mechanical with weapon and cartridge configuration. Sorry but stuff happens and I prefer not to be as fastidious in the operation. THERE is a reason some of the rounds are $1.50 each......I prefer the simplicity of the straight wall case.
If I want more I can load long in a 44 mag. faster and with a heavier projectile.
I shot my G27 yesterday with a 357 Sig barrel that I just bought.... awesome.
That's what most people think when they shoot it!