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Weight Training

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning' started by A_Fletcher, Jun 24, 2006.

  1. A_Fletcher

    A_Fletcher Yardwork Ninja

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    Hey guys. I'm going to start weight training this week, and I wondered if any one knew of a step by step instructional website or some such publication. No, I'm not trolling and no I'm not trying to pick a fight. I just don't have anyone that already knows what they're doing to train with. Further, do supplements such as creatine and whey protein supplements really work? I know I probably sound like one of the dumbest people walking around, but it's not completely intentional. Thanks in advance for any help.
     
  2. Swattie

    Swattie Cry Havoc

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    Here is my suggestion. Skip the weights. I lift weights all the time and the other day ran an obstacle course and it wore me out. Meanwhile, the guys that just do push ups pull ups and all, smoked me on the course. I may be stronger but they had the stamina and endurance to go the distance.
     

  3. California Jack

    California Jack Millennium Member

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    What kind of suggestion is this? The dude said he wanted to lift weights not run an obstacle course.

    If he asked how should he go about running a good time on an obstacle course you wouldn't reply that you run them all the time and the other day in a Power Lifting meet all the Power Lifters out totaled you making obstacle courses stupid, telling him only to lift weights would you?

    The man wants to lift, give him advice about lifting, not about the best way to climb Mt. Everest or something completely irrelevant.

    Train for what you want to be good at. Don't assume obstacle running is everyones goals.

    Jack
     
  4. Glack

    Glack Millennium Member

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    One time, when I was deep into my training for the Tour de France, I entered a Bodybuilding Contest. Those Bodybuilders dominated me. Bike riding sucks.
     
  5. DBradD

    DBradD

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    You could have the best of both worlds by lifting weights and doing something like Furey's Combat Conditioning or Cosgrove's Bodyweight Training.

    I started doing some of these exercises over the last month or so (and temporarily stopped weight lifting so I could accurately know what's doing what), to see if the hype had anything to it, and I can definitely tell a difference in my endurance. I also noticed a strength increase, believe it or not.

    Two months ago, I had to manually stack 50 lb steel plates on a specimen (while climbing on a scaffold, lifting over my head--very awkward), for 1200 lbs total, and it just about completely wore me out. Last week, I had to do the same thing, but with three specimens over 4 hours with no break, and was less tired than I was previously for only one specimen.

    I also have a 250 lb, very awkwardly balanced and delicate piece of equipment that I have to lift and carry a short distance, every so often. Two months ago, I felt like I was going to strain every muscle in my back when I did this. I had to do this last week also, and it felt like about half the weight as before. I think these exercises, like back bridges, etc. work a lot of smaller back muscles that don't get hit very well by rows, deadlifts, pullups, etc.

    If I really cared about maximizing myself physically, I'd combine weight lifting with a program like this.
     
  6. DBradD

    DBradD

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    To actually answer the questions:

    A good place to start is:
    http://glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=514567
    Several have posted their idea of good routines--of course I like mine the best ;) and I think it's suitable for a beginner.

    I don't know if supplements are worth it. I've never been able to tell the difference when I used them and they are very expensive. For a beginner, I'd recommend just eating a very healthy, balanced diet and save the money for now anyway.

    There are lots of books on the market. When I was a kid, I learned a great deal from a Franco Columbo book, but that was 20 years ago. I also got a lot out of Arnold's Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding, or whatever it's called. I read Muscle and Fitness a lot also, but again, that was 20 years ago. I've picked up 2 or 3 of these over the last few years and I couldn't find anything helpful--just full of steroid-filled bodybuilders selling supplements. I picked up a few pretty good recipes from M&F, but that's about it.
     
  7. Glack

    Glack Millennium Member

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    Here is workout from Brooks Kubik posted on a different forum...Beginner's Workout by Brooks D. Kubik
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Here's a good strength and power program for a beginner. I'd suggest 3 times a week for 6 weeks, then a one week layoff, then repeat the program.

    M/W/F

    1. Light power clean and press to warmup...1 x 10-12
    2. Standing Press...5 x 5
    3. Parallel or Full Squats...5 x 5
    4. Barbell Bent-over Rowing...5 x 5
    5. Stiff-legged deadlifts...5 x 5
    6. Situps or leg-raises...one set until tired

    (use light weight on first set, add more weight for a medium heavy set, then do 3 sets of 5 reps with your "working weight")

    Good Luck!

    --------------------------------------------------------------

    For descriptions of the exercises go to www.exrx.net

    Good luck
     
  8. ateamer

    ateamer NRA4EVR

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    That Brooks Kubik workout is spot-on. Excellent advice.

    The Crossfit link is a good one, too. Crossfit is a great way to build strength and endurance at the same time. Many law enforcement, including SWAT-types, and military personnel use it. One of our guys is a Crossfit coach. At a bodyweight of 200, he can bench 335 and do 39 pullups. A nice thing about Crossfit is that it doesn't take much equipment to do, and is a different workout every time.
     
  9. Swattie

    Swattie Cry Havoc

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    OK Jack. I guess you are just one of those people that wants to look good. So be it. I want to be able to "go the distance." That is what wins fights. That is what matters. Not what the girls think. So before you go off on your next roid rage use your brain.

    An obstacle course was used for an example as that is a measure of not only strngth, but endurance and stamina.
     
  10. California Jack

    California Jack Millennium Member

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    If you are refering to me as a bodybuilder you are way off base. I train for Weightlifting. It is a sport. I train for performance. Have you heard of Weightlifting? I find bodybuilding a waste of time.


    Those are fine goals. And if obstacle course performance is how you measure that than great, train for obstacle courses. BTW, that is what matters to YOU. It isn't necessarily what matters to everyone, understand?

    Huh? I think you are the one that is mis-understanding.

    If you want to train for endurance and going the distance that is great. I have no qualms with that. Understand so far? What my post was about is that because your weight training didn't do enough if anything to help you with your obstacle course, you advise a guy that wants to weight train to skip weight training. Your advise is irrelevant and makes no sense. Understand still? If he posted the question: How do I lift weights to improve obstacle course performance, than perhaps your advice would be relevant. Get it? But all we know about Fletcher's goal is that he wants to start lifting weights. He said nothing about strength endurnce, obstacle course, winning fights, etc. He needs help that is RELEVANT to his question. It isn't that hard, really.

    If Fletcher's long term goal is to qualify for a National Powerlifting meet, how could he do that on yor advise? See?

    We know nothing about his goals other than he wants to get started weight training. It's so obvious.

    My post was about your assumption that everyone's goals are similar to yours.

    Fletcher wants to lift weights, how is your advise helpful?

    As far as obstacle course performance and fight training go, the recommendations for crossfit.com are probably good for you.

    There are all kinds of reasons people lift weights. Not all of them are strength endurance. Get it?

    If Alexeev asked for weightlifting advise so he could get another 10 kilos on his 3 lift total, would you have advised him to stop lifting because your obstacle course performance suffered? Well, yeah, you probably would have.

    Jack
     
  11. Glack

    Glack Millennium Member

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    One time, I was deep into my training for the 5000 meter Feestyle for the Olympic Trials. I took a weekend off training and entered the World Strongman competition. Those big strong dudes whipped me. Swimming is stupid.
     
  12. Glack

    Glack Millennium Member

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    Oh,oh wait...the rest of the story is that since the strongman whipped me at strongman stuff, I switched to strongman type training for my upcoming Olympic Trial. Well dig this crap, I didn't do well in the pool either. Strongman training sucks too.
     
  13. Glack

    Glack Millennium Member

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    The moral of the story is that if you want to train for fight endurance, train like Evander Holyfield. I would be stupid to tell you to train like Janet Evans.

    If you want peak strength like Paul Anderson, train like Paul Anderson. Wouldn't it seem silly if for maximal strength I told you to train like Bill Rodgers?

    If you want to be able to high jump 7'-7" would you follow my recommendation to train like a Sumo?

    There is a proper protocol for specific goals. Advising against weight training isn't appropriate for all goals. It has it's place.
     
  14. ateamer

    ateamer NRA4EVR

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    Again, CrossFit. It combines strength, endurance and agility. I will bet any intermediate-level CrossFitter could destroy that obstacle course and still bench 1.5 times bodyweight, and do it again two or three times.
     
  15. DBradD

    DBradD

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    The CrossFit stuff looks awesome, but it's a bit overwhelming to my pitiful mind anyway. My initial impression is that it would take quite a lot to get all that equipment together. I don't know where one is supposed to find a set of rings, climbing rope, and kettlebells for three examples. I've never seen a gym that had those. I did see that they have some substitutions that probably help. I really don't like how they have a different surprise workout every day because I'd have to have ALL the equipment and preparations done for all possible workouts before I could even start.

    It is a cool concept, though. I'm going to spend a lot more time reading about it.
     
  16. TurboRocket

    TurboRocket

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    I just started CrossFit yesterday. While two days of a new program is not much of a testimonial, I am nonetheless beat up from the two days of work outs, particularly today's.

    I am in good shape (or so I thought), and have been lifting for years. Several months ago, I was looking to shake up my routine, and CalJack was nice enough to make some suggestions, and even suggested CrossFit I believe. CalJack gave me a few pointers and since then, CrossFit has been on the back burner.

    This thread made me look at CrossFit again. A few days ago, I spent 4 hours and read just about everything on that web site. So, I decided to give it a go. So far, I am very pleased. The great thing is the variety, and that it builds strength and endurance at the same time. Endurance was what I was missing.

    Thanks JohnnyBravo for mentioning it here. Seeing it again was what I needed to make the switch in my routine.
     
  17. California Jack

    California Jack Millennium Member

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    Turbo (Michael, right?),

    I'm glad you are enjoying crossfit, and I hope it works well for you. I'll probably do stint on theat program sometime. When I made those suggestions to you, I was thinking crossfit may be your thing.

    But I'm curious, how did my other suggestions work for you? You may not have gotten more than a couple cykcles in though.

    Jack
     
  18. DBradD

    DBradD

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    So what did you do about all that relatively obscure equipment? Do you go to a gym that already has that stuff? Did you create your own garage gym like I read about on their website? I'd like to give the program a try too, but my gym doesn't have most of the required equipment and I don't own a chinup/dip station, rings, 20 lb medicine ball with target, kettlebells, etc. It would cost a fair amount (few hundred bucks, I suppose) to purchase all of that stuff. I realize that's not a tremendous amount when compared to a gym membership or other fancy machines.
     
  19. mossy500camo

    mossy500camo ammo found

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    http://bodybuilding.com