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Vista: the longest suicide note in history?

Discussion in 'Tech Talk' started by omnibus1967, Feb 4, 2007.

  1. omnibus1967

    omnibus1967

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    read these articles:

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/12/28/vista_drm_analysis///www.securityfocus.com/columnists/165

    http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.html]

    http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/165

    hello......can anyone say Ubuntu Linux or Mac?:supergrin:


    the 2nd article is by Gutmann....one of the worlds foremost programmers of encryption....he wrote PGP....the most secure encryption known in the world

    first link broken...heres a retype of it
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/12/28/vista_drm_analysis/
     
  2. Tennessee Slim

    Tennessee Slim Señor Member CLM

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    “Bill, why upgrade to Vista? What would be your elevator pitch?”

    Wow. That’s some rousing endorsement. :upeyes:

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16934083/site/newsweek/

    Now where did I put that SUSE DVD....
     

  3. stooxie

    stooxie NRA Life Member

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    All of this almost sounds like a desperate outcry from cheap hardware manufacturers to "de-commoditize" the market.

    Looks like MS is doing the HW vendors a favor by suddenly putting the difficulty back into making hardware that works they way you think it should.

    Doesn't surprise me, even though it's just a conspiracy theory. The PC vendors and content vendors probably feel the MS has been making money hand over fist at the expense of their markets and margins. Now they want some payback...

    So yes... MacOS, Solaris, Linux... lots of choices.

    -Stooxie
     
  4. BilltheCat

    BilltheCat Quieter Cat Millennium Member

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    Vista is a choice also. an insane choice in my opinion but still a choice.


    Very happy I went iMac instead.
     
  5. stooxie

    stooxie NRA Life Member

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    Yes, and thank goodness for that. In the Windows world, however, it's a choice for now until MS decides to desupport everything else but Vista.

    Scary stuff. The point is that pressure will be on all OS and device makers to help prevent the effortless copying of all the premium content. There's too much money at stake.

    -Stooxie
     
  6. Tennessee Slim

    Tennessee Slim Señor Member CLM

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    It’s not without precedent. Microsloth and Intel have played Ping-Pong for years, each taking its turn to obsolete the other’s product (and forcing its users to upgrade).

    Bill, you’re as incorrigible as a reformed smoker on an anti-tobacco crusade.









    Note that I didn’t say that was a bad thing.
     
  7. Wulfenite

    Wulfenite The King

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    Reading all that stuff about DRM and how integrated it is into Vista...I just cant figure out why MS would go to that much trouble to protect somebody else's "intellectual" property. Can anybody explain why Gates would give two cents about protecting Brittany Spears from getting ripped off by her fans.

    FWIW, I think the whole idea of intellectual property for things like music and movies is largely dead. A hundred years ago if you were a talented performer you could make a comfortable living performing. Then they came up with the ability to copy your performance so others could enjoy your work without you actually having to work. However, the means of producing the copies was expensive so, following economic law, the value of the copies was high. As a result the comfortable living of an ongoing performer became a extravagant lifestyle from a one time performance. Now the means of making copies is cheep and widely available. Economic law dictates that the value of the copy should drop accordingly and the extravagant life style resulting form a one time performance will return to the comfortable life style resulting from an ongoing performance career. The music and movie industry are trying to hold back the tide with copy protections, DRM, and legal means, but I don't think the fundamental economics of the situation will be denied forever...or even from very long. FWIW I think the abandonment of the musician or actor as royalty system will actually make for better product. I think all the money hurt more than it helped.
     
  8. stooxie

    stooxie NRA Life Member

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    Business, like politics, is all about back scratching.

    Why would Bill Gates care about DRM for someone else's industry? That's easy. The industry 1) has a lot of money and power. Far more than Microsoft. 2) As Apple has shown, the industry will cut deals with the companies that protect their intellectual properties. Those deals are worth boku bucks.

    Look at how Apple has done a careful job of making sure the iPod does not become a pirate's dream and how iTunes puts money in the pockets of the music producers. At the same time, Apple has made sure that the music is affordable and within reach of their target audience.

    Microsoft makes Zune, with wireless transfer (albeit time limited) and the music companies say F YOU! How can Microsoft make money with a music product if they can't legally put any content on it?

    So you see, all the computer companies are quickly realizing that the only way to add value any more is to become more of a media company. To provide a better way for you to enjoy your music/movies/entertainment/whatever (giving crack to the addicts). The OS and product vendors that do that the best will be the one that the music companies want to do business with.

    Microsoft, of course having to one up everyone, decides they'll just rewrite their entire OS to be nothing but an enabler for their money making schemes. Wait a second... Haven't they been doing that for 20 years?

    -Stooxie
     
  9. ERASER

    ERASER Nyuk,Nyuk,Nyuk!

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    Sorry to hijack the thread, but I run an old 866 PIII w/256 megs of RAM and with XP on it and have a lot of games (old games, of course---given the fact that the computer is pretty old and slow). If XP isn't supported much longer, my system can't handle Vista. Do I need to get a new computer with Vista to run my old (and, hopefully, new games) or would Linux let me run them?

    Thanks.
     
  10. Wulfenite

    Wulfenite The King

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    Yes, you need a new computer, but not cause they're not supporting xp any more. You could probably upgrade to a P4 for less than Vista costs. Given MS's track record with new releases, it will be a while before XP goes away. There are lots and lots of XP machines out there and lots of distrust of microsofts market beta testing practice. If you're not needing to run new programs (which obviously you're not) you could stick with XP for many years. If anything I expect hacker interest will shift over to Vista and XP will actually become a more secure due to lack of interest.
     
  11. ERASER

    ERASER Nyuk,Nyuk,Nyuk!

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    Thanks for the help! I guess I'll be looking at a new system if/when I get a tax refund this year.
     
  12. grokdesigns

    grokdesigns

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    Microsoft will support XP until 2014.
     
  13. Tennessee Slim

    Tennessee Slim Señor Member CLM

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    They're obviously more tolerant than I am. ;)
     
  14. Patrick Graham

    Patrick Graham Footlong Jr.

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    2014 sounds a little short for Microsoft's cutoff of XP support.

    The place I retired out of in 2004 is just now only half way through deploying XP. They've been working on this deployment since 2003. The people I know who still work there say they "may" start deployment of Vista in 2012.

    I'm betting that Microsoft will be bludgeoned by the corporate world to extend their support of XP to 2016 or 2018. Corporate license money speaks loudly when it come to software support.
     
  15. GlockX35

    GlockX35

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    I'm not entirely sure what your getting at but I know I am seeing the same $399 specials at Best Buy etc, with machines that now run Vista being sold with 512MB of ram. Nobody could stand to use Vista with that amount of memory. From what I've seen 2 GB is the usable minimum. Also the onboard video cards with Vista Basic make for a much less plasing expereince. it's prety shocking that Vista is around 14 Gigabytes and requires 2 Gig of memory to run decently. 2 Gig is what I use on XP and Mac because I do alot more than most people but 2 gig jsut to do the basics is nuts. Like everyone else I just can't believe it took MS 5 years with their army of programmers to come up with this. Its really pathetic. The interface is just awful and reeks of desing by committee. Why MIcrosoft is incapable of simplifying anything is beyond me. There are so many cases of 5 or 6 steps to do things that should take one or two. Don't even get me started on the awful Start menu.


     
  16. stooxie

    stooxie NRA Life Member

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    I think you have highlighted exactly my point.

    The OS vendor is in a position to steer hardware vendor revenue. MS has a very strong position here. As you have noted, the $399 PC is still there but useless with Vista. So the HW vendors get a break and a nice blip in revenues for a couple years as people are forced to buy higher end machines to accommodate. If anything else in the OP's article links is true, then only specific Microsoft approved hardware will work. That will be a whole new line of licensing revenue for Microsoft that the HW vendors will pass on. It could also hurt the OEM and DIY markets as they will all be labeled grey market HW and thus, not supported.

    The possibilities are endless for MS (or any monopoly) to screw with the industry.

    -Stooxie