Virginia Now Has A $500 Fine For Not Wearing A Mask

Discussion in 'Covid-19 News/Info' started by M&P15T, Oct 24, 2020.

  1. Deanster

    Deanster Cheese? Millennium Member CLM

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    Sigh. Why do you guys keep posting things that are factually incorrect, and easily disproven?

    That's not at all what that paper from 2008 said. It said that after the virus destroyed the lining of the lungs, bacterial pneumonia set into the damaged areas and was in most cases the final straw that killed Flu victims, suggesting that deep stocks of antibiotics might be an important part of fighting deaths in future lung-damaging flu epidemics. Masks aren't mentioned in the paper at all.

    https://www.nih.gov/news-events/new...ia-caused-most-deaths-1918-influenza-pandemic

    Tuesday, August 19, 2008

    Bacterial Pneumonia Caused Most Deaths in 1918 Influenza Pandemic
    Implications for Future Pandemic Planning

    The majority of deaths during the influenza pandemic of 1918-1919 were not caused by the influenza virus acting alone, report researchers from the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), part of the National Institutes of Health. Instead, most victims succumbed to bacterial pneumonia following influenza virus infection. The pneumonia was caused when bacteria that normally inhabit the nose and throat invaded the lungs along a pathway created when the virus destroyed the cells that line the bronchial tubes and lungs.

    A future influenza pandemic may unfold in a similar manner, say the NIAID authors, whose paper in the Oct. 1 issue of The Journal of Infectious Diseases is now available online. Therefore, the authors conclude, comprehensive pandemic preparations should include not only efforts to produce new or improved influenza vaccines and antiviral drugs but also provisions to stockpile antibiotics and bacterial vaccines as well.

    The work presents complementary lines of evidence from the fields of pathology and history of medicine to support this conclusion. "The weight of evidence we examined from both historical and modern analyses of the 1918 influenza pandemic favors a scenario in which viral damage followed by bacterial pneumonia led to the vast majority of deaths," says co-author NIAID Director Anthony S. Fauci, M.D. "In essence, the virus landed the first blow while bacteria delivered the knockout punch."

    NIAID co-author and pathologist Jeffery Taubenberger, M.D., Ph.D., examined lung tissue samples from 58 soldiers who died of influenza at various U. S. military bases in 1918 and 1919. The samples, preserved in paraffin blocks, were re-cut and stained to allow microscopic evaluation. Examination revealed a spectrum of tissue damage "ranging from changes characteristic of the primary viral pneumonia and evidence of tissue repair to evidence of severe, acute, secondary bacterial pneumonia," says Dr. Taubenberger. In most cases, he adds, the predominant disease at the time of death appeared to have been bacterial pneumonia. There also was evidence that the virus destroyed the cells lining the bronchial tubes, including cells with protective hair-like projections, or cilia. This loss made other kinds of cells throughout the entire respiratory tract — including cells deep in the lungs — vulnerable to attack by bacteria that migrated down the newly created pathway from the nose and throat.

    In a quest to obtain all scientific publications reporting on the pathology and bacteriology of the 1918-1919 influenza pandemic, Dr. Taubenberger and NIAID co-author David Morens, M.D., searched bibliography sources for papers in any language. They also reviewed scientific and medical journals published in English, French and German, and located all papers reporting on autopsies conducted on influenza victims. From a pool of more than 2,000 publications that appeared between 1919 and 1929, the researchers identified 118 key autopsy series reports. In total, the autopsy series they reviewed represented 8,398 individual autopsies conducted in 15 countries.

    The published reports "clearly and consistently implicated secondary bacterial pneumonia caused by common upper respiratory flora in most influenza fatalities," says Dr. Morens. Pathologists of the time, he adds, were nearly unanimous in the conviction that deaths were not caused directly by the then-unidentified influenza virus, but rather resulted from severe secondary pneumonia caused by various bacteria. Absent the secondary bacterial infections, many patients might have survived, experts at the time believed. Indeed, the availability of antibiotics during the other influenza pandemics of the 20th century, specifically those of 1957 and 1968, was probably a key factor in the lower number of worldwide deaths during those outbreaks, notes Dr. Morens.

    The cause and timing of the next influenza pandemic cannot be predicted with certainty, the authors acknowledge, nor can the virulence of the pandemic influenza virus strain. However, it is possible that — as in 1918 — a similar pattern of viral damage followed by bacterial invasion could unfold, say the authors. Preparations for diagnosing, treating and preventing bacterial pneumonia should be among highest priorities in influenza pandemic planning, they write. "We are encouraged by the fact that pandemic planners are already considering and implementing some of these actions," says Dr. Fauci.​
     
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  2. Westexas

    Westexas

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    Gas masks such as the Israeli 4A1 have a drinking water tube that goes into the mask. With a little modification, oxygen could be run through this tube.
    A person with emphysema could be protected and get oxygen at the same time.

    It’d also look great for Halloween.
     
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  3. Westexas

    Westexas

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    Interesting report. For a number of years the fatal damage was blamed on Cytokine Release Syndrome caused by the H1N1 virus.

    Autopsy reports at the time stated that the victim’s lungs appeared to have been “burned.” This was similar to autopsy reports of soldiers being gassed during WW1. Inhaled chlorine and mustard agents seemed to have the same effect.

    Looks like it may have been a combination of bacterial infections and the Cytokine Release Syndrome.
     
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  4. Westexas

    Westexas

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    Emphysema comes to mind, however, there is a possible work around. Many gas masks (Israeli 4A1) come with a drinking tube. Should be fairly easy to route the tube from
    an oxygen generator into the drinking tube. This set up would allow someone with emphysema to go out in public.
     
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  5. racerford

    racerford

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    So you are against transgenders.

    The difference between you and me, is that you are assuming he is lying, I don’t. He has not once said that he actually has no medical condition, that I have seen. He has said he has a medical condition that precludes him from wearing a mask. He has not not answered what it is. Just as you have not acknowledge being against transgenders, even that is exactly what your “line” says your position is. If you are not against transgenders then your “line” is not a “line” or your morals and ethics are just as flexible as you claim his to be.

    So do you have proof he is lying? If so, present it.

    Do you have “line” on lying about all medical conditions, or not?
     
  6. OttoLoader

    OttoLoader

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    I was thinking of emphysema patients with very restricted air flow too.

    Likely those patients already restrict their exposure to public places with out governor orders.
    Also would the emphysema paicient in public far away from others and struggling to breath with out a mask be subject to the $500 civil fine?

    What about faucis proposed mask mandate while driving in their car?

    No masks are not political at all.

    I can think of many patient profiles that could rarely need to were mask yet still be protected.
     
  7. scattershot

    scattershot

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    Gettin’ kinda long winded here. To me, it’s pretty simple. If you’re sick, stay home. If you think you might get sick, wear a mask. Just leave the rest of us alone.
     
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  8. Westexas

    Westexas

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    I just wear a P100. I’m high risk because of my age. I don’t have to be concerned whether or not someone else wears a mask. Problem solved.

    Great for allergies too.
     
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  9. Deanster

    Deanster Cheese? Millennium Member CLM

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    Not even close, you’ll have to do way better, amigo.

    Keep doing those mental gymnastics to excuse his lies. It’d be cute how hard you’re spinning, if it weren’t so pathetic.
     
  10. racerford

    racerford

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    So you have no proof he is lying, is that correct? Simple yes or no. If yes, present it.
     
  11. Deanster

    Deanster Cheese? Millennium Member CLM

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    He hasn’t refuted it, he has instead embraced it and attempted to justify his actions.

    You are the only one claiming he has a legitimate medical issue, if you’d like to offer proof, go right ahead, otherwise you’re just making excuses for dirtbag behavior from a guy you’ve never met.

    I don’t take homework assignments from you, skippy.

    Keep on spinning, spin spin spin, but going nowhere fast.
     
  12. racerford

    racerford

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    You can’t even answer a simple yes or no question.

    So you are saying you have no proof for you assertion he is lying, so you are just making stuff up. Doesn’t that make you the liar, Mr. Ethical?

    Just keep spinning.

    Edit: He has refuted it. He has repeatedly said he has a medical condition that precludes him from wearing a mask.
     
  13. Deanster

    Deanster Cheese? Millennium Member CLM

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    not a single correct thing in that post.

    You’re spinning so so SO hard to try to flip this so that somehow I’m in the wrong for calling out a guy claiming a fake medical condition that he doesn’t have.

    You can White Knight and attempt to distract and shill and make up things for M&P allllll day, but nothing changes the facts.

    He intentionally lies, claiming a medical condition he does not have.

    You support that.

    We all know exactly what that makes both of you.

    Back in your hole, Troll...
     
  14. racerford

    racerford

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    You are making statements with no support. I am only supporting you providing evidence he is lying about having no medical condition. You have provided nothing.

    I don’t know whether he his lying or not. He says he has a medical condition that precludes him wearing a mask. He knows better than you.
    It sounds like you keep making false assertions that you cannot support.
    I am no troll, I am just looking for you to support you position.

    if you can’t just admit it.

    you still can’t answer a simple yes or no question.

    Maybe you are trolling him.
     
  15. ThatGuyYouKnow

    ThatGuyYouKnow Custom Title Goes Here

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    Or he's trolling you.
     
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