*Video*~ Review of Winchester 147gr. JHP (White Box)

Discussion in 'Caliber Corner' started by ULVER, Feb 15, 2010.

  1. ULVER

    ULVER Dixie Rebel

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    Seriously haven't seen it evolve like the other 147's. Seems like it was a semi-fave around here for a while.

    The "failure" reminds me of my testing with the late Joe Zambone, in the late 80's/early 90's~The 147's DID NOT WORK!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G45AQwzqaas&feature=related

    I think the latest offerings are a different story. 147gr. Gold Dots, Ranger T's: good stuff.

    Looking in the "bunker" :cool: I see a box of 147gr. SILVERTIPS~That's got to go back a while. :rofl:
     
  2. IndyGunFreak

    IndyGunFreak

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    We've kicked this around here a lot.... still think it was a fluke.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRSWZWDFeog&feature=related

    Use the search, Luke..

    IGF
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2010

  3. CanyonMan

    CanyonMan In The Saddle

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    I could not pass this up..

    This is a great round. What failure? This puppy (and I am loaded with it in the truck in the G19). This little round plows through stuff like a jack hammer, and that is what I want. Penetration. Plus for the all the folks worried about what will happen in court. It does say "JHP Personal Protection" on the box. No prosecutor can argue with that, and its name brand Winchester, no arguement there in court. Hey, I got it at wally world, and carried it sir.

    No thanks for the HST's and all the other rapid expansion rounds the Marketing boys have pushed on the public. I need something that gets where it needs to go. This little round, from all I have talked with at WW, out penetrates all the Ranger T offerings, even the 127gr P+P. I'm not pushing it. Just completely sold on it, and got a truck load of confidence with it. A really great test is to take a butchered steer rib cage, and solid and hollow organs packed in the back side, with a couple shirts and a coat thrown over the front. This makes for a test we can count on (more at least) and know what the bullet is more likely really doing, vs a water jug full of soda pop. ;)

    Personally. I really like this round. It has got a bad rap that it does not deserve. Most of the bad rap is.. "Well it penetrates waay to much." Man i'll take it then. Sounds good ! Next to this, I do like the 124gr +P Speer GD. Hey, I'm a 45acp guy, and do not even like the 9mil. But this little round sold me to at least throw the G19 in the truck for bobcats and whatever else on the ranch, and no worries in town with it either.

    Just the observations of a hayseed. ;)



    CanyonMan
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2010
  4. Dexters

    Dexters

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    How many rounds of Winchester 147gr. JHP (White Box) are manufactured each year and what is the failure rate?
    That is the key number.
    Now, if someone wants to say 'One failure is too many in a life and death situation' - that ends the discussion.
    Anyone know what the acceptable failure rate is for the US Army 9mm ammo issued?
     
  5. hotpig

    hotpig IAFF Local 4766 CLM

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    I was digging the guy until I saw the test medium. Since it was not calibrated jello it has no real scientific information. I stopped watching at that point since the testing was flawed .
     
  6. Thrillhouse700

    Thrillhouse700

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    Im pretty noob to handguns, so I apologize for the ignorance. What does bonded mean? Is it the lead bonded to the copper jacket? That would be my guess. Nice video BTW
     
  7. IndyGunFreak

    IndyGunFreak

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    That's exactly what it is... The copper jacket is bonded to the lead core. It typically aids in penetration, especially through barriers(auto glass, etc..)

    IGF
     
  8. TWS G26

    TWS G26

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    I realize that many people in the shooting community feel these results are not valid because this isn't ballistic gel. Foremost, my format is intended to be a supplement, not the definitive resource. It is interesting to note that I am usually in the ballpark regarding the results when compared to gel tests. I have a HUGE stash of the WWB 147, therefore a vested interest to see it work. How many professional gel tests are also flukes, you just never hear about it? The ammo makers can post all the charts at their disposal, I would really like to see more multi-media in support (or not) of their ballistics.

    I have encouraged folks, whether they are common rednecks like myself or industry professionals, to conduct ballistic gel tests and post videos of the process and their results. It's not happening. Why? Until it does, this "no real scientific information" format will have to serve as a resource for those curious. I received a message just yesterday from someone in law enforcement who greatly appreciates the effort, and that wasn't the first instance. Several of my ammo donations for testing have been submitted by folks working in law-enforcement ......interesting, isn't it?

    History proves that many long-standing hypotheses were written in stone long before modern technology further confirmed and enhanced a proven theory. The Earth was deemed to be round before we jumped into space to see it ourselves. Was man's belief in the formative theory flawed because of the process utilized for that deduction?

    Hotpig, I'm not picking on you at all or tryin to start crap, just suggesting that all of us, myself included, be open-minded to ANY method illustrating ballistic principles....and draw our conclusions based on a hybrid of collaborative information.
     
  9. hotpig

    hotpig IAFF Local 4766 CLM

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    The problem that I see in back yard tests is the new and ill informed may think that it is enough to choose their ammo from. People need to keep in mind that this testing is just as scientific as picking ammo by who has the coolest name or best box art.

    Shooting stuff is fun and most of us do it. There is nothing that I can do in my back yard to match what they do.

    I know Winchester spends millions on testing ammo. Everything is done so precise that working in the R@D department getting paid very good union wages for shooting stuff is not considered a desirable job by many people in my area. Some guys are attracted to it because they think it is all fun and games. They end up bidding out to mind numbing jobs in production or shipping after a while.

    I'm not know on this board as a jello junkie either. One very obvious fault in jello shooting is the old school MM 115 +P+ ammo. By standard this ammo should be a failure. However in real world shoots even through barriers this ammo is a man stopper.

    IMHO the best way to chose ammo is by keeping your ears open for what works in the real world. Even then ultimately your gun itself may end up deciding what round is best for you.
     
  10. 481

    481

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    CM,

    You sound like me. Penetration, penetration, then expansion.

    Lookin' forward to your pending tests. Oughtta be a real 'hoot'.

    Find any of that elusive WWB 147 yet?
     
  11. happyguy

    happyguy Man, I'm Pretty

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    Nobody pushed anything on anyone. The manufactures simply responded to the demands of their customers.

    From one hayseed to another. ;)

    Regards,
    Happyguy :)
     
  12. CanyonMan

    CanyonMan In The Saddle

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    P and P and P then E. You got it amigo.

    NO ! You are causing a shortage of this stuff in America man.. Dang you. :faint:

    You are driving me to start rolling my own for carry !

    I bought a box of 147gr XTP's over the weekend, (to reload), and will see what I can squeeze out of them in the 9mil. If I don't stop this obsession I have had lately with the 9mil, my 45 is going to run away. (never). ;)


    Good to hear from ya bud.


    CanyonMan (on the trail of the WWB 147gr JHP)
     
  13. CanyonMan

    CanyonMan In The Saddle

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    Fellow hayseed.

    Before the public "demands," the marketing/promotion boys "push the product". Then when the fish or on the line, they are easy to real in. And I thought I was way out in the mountains. ;)



    CanyonMan
     
  14. N/Apower

    N/Apower

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    My .02
     
  15. CanyonMan

    CanyonMan In The Saddle

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    :thumbsup:




    CM
     
  16. 481

    481

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    CM,

    I'll hold off until you get some. :whistling: That oughtta help, huh?

    Be interested in hearing what you can get outta the 147 gr. XTPs (the 147 gr. TAP "CQ" (XTP) JHP is my primary carry load) as I've never bothered to reload and hotrod them.

    I'll be happy to give that .45 of yours a new home if it becomes too angry with you and your new found love. :supergrin:
     
  17. CanyonMan

    CanyonMan In The Saddle

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    Man thats right nice of ya Hoss! And I really believe that too ! :whistling:


    Yea on the 147gr XTP loads. Looks like even if I go by the Hornady manual here, I will max this out at 1,000 fps with 5.7grs of Blue Dot.

    That is fine. Our little WWB frined is only 990fps, so this XTP will I think, be really a good round @ 1,000fps. I will load some up, and shoot some water jugs.. YEEEEEHAAAW, Just Kidding ! Could not resist. :supergrin:

    I will load some up and truly believe they will be fine. I have fired plenty enough XTP's over the years to know that in game, they penetrate like crazy usually. I have every reason to believe that these 147's will @ 1,000fps +/- be just the ticket for me in the little G19.

    "My new found love, you say...?" Uh, my new found TOY you mean !

    Now as for the 45acp 1911. Those are fighting words you uttered there Pard. Selling my 45's. :tongueout:



    Stay safe
    Good shooting amigo




    CanyonMan
     
  18. bambikilr

    bambikilr

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    i second that 481...heck CanyonMan, i'll even take your Taurus...good posts
     
  19. TWS G26

    TWS G26

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    There is some concern on my part that the noobs are selecting ammo solely based on what they see in tests such as this.....which is why I added that disclaimer. The disclaimer was also a suggestion by someone here on GT. I'm hoping that the noobs, anyone for that matter, are using every resource available. If they can search Google for the latest video posted by Carrie Underwood, they should be able to research ammo choices.

    Agreed that people need to try loads themselves, and research what happens in the real world. Agreed that backyard tests are not going to be as explicit as what a real R&D department can create. I do understand the monotony of the effort in a corporate setting compared to more glamorous tasks, but the public is looking for something.

    When I have LEO's asking for wet newspaper tests, I have to think there is interest to some degree in this perspective. I don't have the storage for ballistic gel. Even if I went that route, a sizable % of people would still discredit the process because it wasn't endorsed by "agency name here". It's a damned if you, damned if you don't situation.
     
  20. CanyonMan

    CanyonMan In The Saddle

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    Well, no offence to you amigo or anyone else on GT. But IF I had a Taurus I would pay you to take it ! :whistling:


    Colts. Occasional Kimber (only after removing the Swartz FPS), a custom job from Ken Crawley built from the ground up, and Wilson Combat.

    I do appreciate the heart you and 481 seem to have towards me though !
    Real Sincere and genuine for my interest.. :poke: Not trying to take advantage. Whew.




    CanyonMan