VA-ALERT: URGENT! GMU needs to hear from us NOW!

Discussion in 'Glockers of the Old Dominion' started by Dan0076, Aug 27, 2007.

  1. Dan0076

    Dan0076 Special Member

    Likes Received:
    Aug 15, 2004
    VCDL has just learned that George Mason University (GMU) is planning
    on putting in place a state *regulation* and not just a school
    *policy* to ban students, employees, and VISITORS from possessing
    firearms in "academic buildings, administrative office buildings,
    student residence buildings, and while attending sporting,
    entertainment or educational events."

    That is pretty much everywhere except the sidewalks, grass, and parking lots.

    According to a document obtained by VCDL, GMU has crafted it's gun
    ban regulation "to provide the broadest permissible prohibition
    against weapons on campus, to include holders of valid concealed
    handgun permits."

    In addition, GMU is expecting a legal challenge from VCDL (we are
    mentioned by name).

    It also says that using a regulation, CHP holders can be deprived of
    any bona fide right of entry!!! Yes, GMU wrote that they want to
    deprive CHP holders of any right to self-defense on GMU property!

    Regulations are a part of the Virginia Administrative Code and have
    the force of law, as opposed to a school rule or policy, so GMU is
    hoping to be able to charge ANYONE (student or non-student, faculty
    or non-faculty) with trespass on the spot once this regulation is
    posted using "ignorance of the law is no excuse" as their
    justification. (With a school rule or policy, the university needs
    to make sure that you know of the rule or policy. If you ignore the
    rule or policy once told about it, you can be charged with trespass.)

    However, to get a regulation put in place, the agency requesting it
    is supposed to have a public comment period.

    This proposed regulation was apparently slipped in very quietly, as
    we are just now learning about it!

    Not only that, this proposed regulation was submitted a full MONTH
    BEFORE GMU's Board of Visitors even officially APPROVED THE PROPOSED
    REGULATION!!! It was published on August 6th.

    That is NOT due process. Clearly GMU is trying to slip something by
    all of us and the General Assembly.

    The GMU document mentioned earlier also states, "With a regulation
    the University adopts a prohibition by law." GMU is intentionally
    bypassing the General Assembly in their attempt to enact their own

    The comment period ends on September 5th at 5 PM!

    No matter how you look at it, GMU is pushing this through fast. We
    can slow it down as we have the right to request the comment period
    by extended by another 30 days and to ask for a public hearing on the
    proposed regulation. ***If at least 25 of us request a 30-day
    extension of the comment period, they have to grant it!***

    WE NEED TO ACT NOW! Two action items follow - one for GMU and one to
    contact Delegates, Senators, and the Governor. After the action
    items, the text of the proposed regulation is included, along with
    candid comments from GMU on their legal strategy to ban guns using a
    regulation to target CHP holders.



    We need to flood the Agency Regulatory Coordinator for GMU, Kenneth
    W. Hubble, with emails and calls opposing this regulation and we need
    to ask him to extend the comment period by another 30 days and to
    have a public hearing.

    Kenneth W. Hubble
    Phone: 703-993-3091 **give him a call to object to the regulation!**
    Email: [email protected]

    Suggested email title: I OPPOSE 8VAC35-60! Extend comment period.

    Suggested email text:

    Dear Mr. Hubble,

    I am am OPPOSED to GMU's proposed regulation, 8VAC35-60.

    8VAC35-60 is both illegal, as GMU has NO statutory power to ban
    lawfully carried firearms, and dangerous, as it serves to protect the
    lives of criminals while leaving students, employees, and visitors
    helpless to criminal attack!

    The General Assembly has reserved control of firearms to itself, with
    the only exceptions being for local control of hunting and discharge
    of firearms. There is NO law that authorizes the University to
    regulate firearms, especially for students and visitors.

    Virginia Tech had a ban on firearms and we know how that turned out
    for 32 students and faculty members -- the innocent complied with the
    ban and died while the criminal wantonly violated the ban, ruining
    many, many lives.

    GMU students, employees, and guests would NOT fare any better if
    forcibly, and illegally, disarmed by the University.

    The University's low regard for the lives of innocent students,
    employees, and visitors shown by submitting 8VAC35-60 is shocking,
    leaving George Mason turning in his grave over such a breach of
    liberty and freedom. It is particularly despicable that GMU wants to
    attack Virginia's concealed handgun permit (CHP) holders with "A
    regulation [that] deprives the CHP holder of a claim to bona fide
    right of entry..."

    I am formally requesting that the comment period be extended by an
    additional 30 days (to October 5th) to solicit additional public

    I am also formally requesting a public hearing on the proposed regulation.

    Please let me know what the University is going to do.




    We need to ask our Delegates, Senators, and Governor to suspend the
    active date of the regulation until the END of the next General
    Assembly session, thus giving VCDL time to get the laws
    changed/clarified. The General Assembly and the Governor have the
    legal power to do this.

    To send a pre-written message (that you can edit) to your Delegate
    (the message will be sent to the correct Delegate automatically),
    click here:

    To send the same pre-written message (that you can edit) to your
    Senator (the message will be sent to the correct Senator
    automatically), click here:

    To send a message to the Governor via his web form, click here:

    Suggested text to the Governor:

    I urge you to OPPOSE George Mason University's attempt to rush
    through a sweeping gun ban regulation, 8VAC35-60!

    The ban, which would make it illegal for even concealed handgun
    permit holders to have a gun in "academic buildings, administrative
    office buildings, student residence buildings, and while attending
    sporting, entertainment or educational events" has no statutory
    authority behind it.

    Such a regulation is dangerous as Virginia Tech showed us. Everyone
    but the police are left totally helpless at the hands of a murderer!
    The government should NEVER interfere with the protection of innocent
    life through self-defense. Life that is valuable off-campus should
    be just as valuable on-campus.

    It is particularly despicable that GMU wants to attack Virginia's
    concealed handgun permit (CHP) holders with "A regulation [that]
    deprives the CHP holder of a claim to bona fide right of entry..."
    George Mason is turning in his grave!

    At a minimum, the regulation should be postponed until after the next
    General Assembly Session, so that the whole issue can be properly
    addressed and debated next year, not rushed through without time for
    debate or public comment.

    I also request a public hearing on the proposed regulation.

    -------- end of suggested text to the Governor -------

    Here is GMU's proposed regulation for those interested:



    Proposed Regulation

    REGISTRAR'S NOTICE: George Mason University is exempt from the
    Administrative Process Act in accordance with §2.2-4002 A 6 of the
    Code of Virginia, which exempts educational institutions operated by
    the Commonwealth.

    Title of Regulation: 8VAC35-60. Policy Prohibiting Weapons (adding
    8VAC35-60-10, 8VAC35-60-20, 8VAC35-60-30).

    Statutory Authority: §23-91.29 of the Code of Virginia.

    Public Comments: Public comments may be submitted until 5 p.m. on
    September 5, 2007.

    Agency Contact: Kenneth W. Hubble, Agency Regulatory Coordinator,
    George Mason University, 4400 University Drive, Fairfax, VA 22030,
    telephone (703) 993-3091, or email [email protected].

    The proposed regulation establishes the weapons prohibition policy at
    George Mason University.

    CHAPTER 60

    8VAC35-60-10. Definitions.

    The following words and terms when used in this chapter shall have
    the following meanings unless the context clearly indicates otherwise:

    "Police officer" means law-enforcement officials appointed pursuant
    to Article 3 (§15.2-1609 et seq.) of Chapter 16 and Chapter 17
    (§15.2-1700 et.seq.) of Title 15.2, Chapter 17 (§23-232 et seq.) of
    Title 23, Chapter 2 (§29.1-200 et seq.) of Title 29.1, and Chapter 1
    (§52-1 et seq.) of Title 52 of the Code of Virginia and sworn federal
    law-enforcement officers.

    "University property" means any property owned, leased or controlled
    by George Mason University.

    "Weapon" means any pistol, revolver, or other weapon designed or
    intended to propel a missile of any kind, or any dirk, bowie knife,
    switchblade knife, ballistic knife, razor slingshot, spring stick,
    metal knucks, blackjack, or any flailing instrument consisting of two
    or more rigid parts connected in such manner as to allow them to
    swing freely, which may be known as nun chahka, nun chuck, nunchaku,
    shuriken, or fighting chain, or any disc, of whatever configuration,
    having at least two points or pointed blades that is designed to be
    thrown or propelled and that may be known as throwing star or
    oriental dart.

    8VAC35-60-20. Possession of weapons prohibited.

    Possession or carrying of any weapon by any person, except a police
    officer, is prohibited on university property in academic buildings,
    administrative office buildings, student residence buildings, and
    while attending sporting, entertainment or educational events. Entry
    upon university property in violation of this prohibition is
    expressly forbidden.

    8VAC35-60-30. Person lawfully in charge.

    In addition to individuals authorized by university policy, George
    Mason University police officers are lawfully in charge for the
    purposes of forbidding entry upon or remaining upon university
    property while possessing or carrying weapons in violation of this
    VA.R. Doc. No. R07-815; Filed July 19, 2007, 11:19 a.m.


    Here is part of a document outlining GMUs plans to disarm everyone
    but the police, robbing us of our right to self-defense. Notice how
    they are planning on VCDL suing them! They don't care - it's just
    the public's money that will be wasted fighting VCDL's legal

    GMU's Board of Scoundrels, er, Visitors salivating over finding a way
    to arrest CHP holders is a disgrace: "A regulation deprives the CHP
    holder of a claim to bona fide right of entry..."

    This document shows GMU's contempt for law-abiding citizens and VCDL
    will make sure that quotes like that are presented to the General
    Assembly in January!

    The original document is located at:

  2. Dan0076

    Dan0076 Special Member

    Likes Received:
    Aug 15, 2004
    Proposed Weapons Regulation

    The proposed weapons regulation (Tab A) is crafted to provide the
    broadest permissible prohibition against weapons on campus, to
    include holders of valid concealed handgun permits. A challenge to
    this University's weapons prohibitions by the Virginia Citizen's
    Defense League (VCDL) is anticipated. The leadership and membership
    of VCDL appears concentrated in the Fairfax area (their mailing
    address is a Post Office Box in Newington). We have received queries
    regarding our weapons policy from identified members of VCDL. There
    is also an on campus group - George Mason University Students for
    Concealed Carry - which may work in concert with VCDL.

    The ultimate remedy for violation of the proposed weapons regulation
    - assuming all other conduct is lawful - is a successful prosecution
    under the trespass statute. That statute, §18.2-119, makes it a crime
    for one who "without authority of law" goes upon or remains upon the
    property of another "after having been forbidden to do so." Notice
    that one is forbidden is communicated in one of three manners 1)
    "either orally or in writing, by the owner, lessee, custodian or
    other person lawfully in charge thereof," 2) by posting, or 3) court

    The Courts of this Commonwealth have imposed two other elements, in
    addition to the statutory language, in order to obtain a trespass
    conviction. First, no conviction will lie where one enters or stays
    "under bona fide claim of right" which is a "sincere, although
    perhaps mistaken, good faith belief that one has some legal right to
    be on the property." Reed v. Commonwealth, 6 Va. App. 65, 71 (1988).
    Second, though "silent as to intent, the case law in Virginia has
    uniformly construed the statutory offense of criminal trespass to
    require a will trespass." O'Banion v. Commonwealth, 33 Va. App. 47,
    56 (2006).

    University policies are binding on persons with whom there is some
    type of contractual relationship, i.e., faculty, staff and students.
    Adherence to policy is a condition of employment or admission. I am
    aware of no authority that binds outside unrelated third parties,
    i.e., the general public, to University policies; or, even that a
    University policy provides some type of constructive notice for
    purposes of implied conditions for entry. University policy can be
    the basis for ordering one to leave the premises, but becomes
    problematic for a trespass conviction.

    A Concealed Handgun Permit (CHP) is a statutory privilege granted by
    Circuit Court Order allowing the individual to carry anywhere unless
    "such possession is otherwise prohibited by law or the owner of
    private property" §18.2-308.O. As George Mason University is not a
    private property owner, the holder of a CHP has both a reasonable and
    good faith belief absent a regulation that armed entry on campus is
    lawful. With a regulation the University adopts a prohibition by law.

    Regulation, having the force of law, invokes the traditional rule
    that ignorance is no excuse. A regulation deprives the CHP holder of
    a claim to bona fide right of entry, as armed entry is then "without
    authority of law." A regulation arguably makes armed entry
    intentional and willful, willful being characterized as "a thing done
    without ground for believing it is lawful." Richardson v.
    Commonwealth, 21 Va. App. 93, 99 (1995). The two case law elements
    essential to a trespass conviction are satisfied to the greatest
    degree by a regulation.

    The Attorney General has opined that Universities "may not impose a
    general prohibition on carrying of concealed weapons by permitted
    individuals" but may limit "persons attending events on campus,
    visiting dormitories or classroom buildings, attending specific
    events as invitees." Opinion to The Honorable R. Creigh Deeds of
    January 4, 2006. The language in §2 of the proposed regulation is
    adopted from Virginia Tech and represents the broadest scope of
    prohibition permissible under the Deeds opinion. While the language
    encompasses most University activity, possession of weapons outside
    of the specified buildings and events would not be prohibited.

  3. rwrjr


    Likes Received:
    May 25, 2007
    Northern VA
    Thanks for the heads up and I have crafted and sent my emails.

    Should we post a link to this thread in Carry Issues? I don't want to annoy the non-VA members of GT but we might get a better turnout of VA members if we point people to this thread.


    P.S. When with the VCDL site be updated with this info?