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usp .45 or glock 21?

Discussion in 'General Glocking' started by khaitran, Feb 13, 2005.

  1. khaitran

    khaitran

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    I am looking into buying a usp 45 or a glock 21, i have heard many different oppinions on both guns, please give me some input on what you think
     
  2. luke ford

    luke ford metalocalypse

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    i've handled and shot both and the glock has the bigger grip-almost too big,so if you have smaller hands you may want to consider that.
    also i felt the HK had slightly less recoil.
    this was almost a year ago and i ended up buying a usp 45c-it just fit my hand better.
     

  3. Lt. Stansfield

    Lt. Stansfield

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    USPc. Fit's hand great and very accurate.
     
  4. AaronH

    AaronH

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    Go with the USP.45

    Fully supported chamber.
    Metal sights
    Metal guide rod.
    Manual safety/decocker.
    Tougher slide stop/release.
    Ambi Mag release.
    Loaded chamber indicator.
    Hammer fired for second strike capabilites. (for hard primers).
    Double re-coil springs.
    Metal mags.
    Available in stainless :)
    Tighter tolerances.

    etc etc

    You get what you pay for.....
     
  5. khaitran

    khaitran

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    Thanks for the feedback. I am thinking about buying a usp online at gunsamerica.com. i was wondering, is this safe? and on the H&K website it says that to obtain warranty service the gun must be purchased from an authorized hk dealer. How do i find out if the store i purchase from is a certified hk dealer .
     
  6. khaitran

    khaitran

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  7. AaronH

    AaronH

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  8. epsylum

    epsylum Boolit Hoze

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    I would have put this in the "non-glock firearms" board. You will get alot of people voting for the USP since this is full of HK fans.

    Me personally. I have a G21 and a USPf 9mm. I love them both. I don't think one is any better than the other. On average I am more accurate with my Glock and think it is one of the softest shooting .45s on the market (I would say it recoils about the same as my USP 9mm). Dollar for dollar it is an awesome gun.

    HKs are sweet. They have more German engineering flash to it's look than the Glock. But I don't think they are THAT much better, like lots of HK fanboys would have you think.
    Lots of people like to list reasons as to why HK are SO much better. Some make sense, some don't.

    -Metal mag- so whats wrong with FML plastic ones (especially when they are only 20 bucks a piece). Mine have never failed to drop free or stick.

    -Tighter tolerances- As anyone with an AK knows, that may not be a good thing. Looser tolerances allow for less of a chance for debris and drit to bind things up.

    -abi-mag release- not a big deal for me. Especially since the HK's mag release is a little goofy. I have to use my middle finger, since my thumb can't reach with-out changing my grip. I can use my middle finger of my left hand when shooting off-handed to release the mag on my Glock, making the glock as easy to drop a mag off-handed as the HK is strong-handed.

    -metal sights- I don't get this one. Yes they are metal, so? WTF are you doing to break off a sight? Besides, most people get whatever nightsights on they like on thier carry piece. Making the stock sight thing a mute point.

    -steel guide rod- I do see the point of this, but only in extreme cases. The only broken factory Glock guide rod I have seen first hand is on my brother's G20 when he shot some hot 10mm loads in it the first day he got it. But, my 21 has had zero guide rod problems. Beisdes a stainless rod is only like 25 bucks for a Glock.

    I love my HK and would never sell it, but I carry my G21 daily and trust my life to it. I am not trying to say the Glock is in any way superior. I am just saying it is closer than some want you to believe.

    I vote try them both out, if you can, and get the one you like better. Either way you cannot lose, 2 awesome handguns.
     
  9. AaronH

    AaronH

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    Metal mag- so whats wrong with FML plastic ones (especially when they are only 20 bucks a piece). Mine have never failed to drop free or stick.

    -Tighter tolerances- As anyone with an AK knows, that may not be a good thing. Looser tolerances allow for less of a chance for debris and drit to bind things up.

    -abi-mag release- not a big deal for me. Especially since the HK's mag release is a little goofy. I have to use my middle finger, since my thumb can't reach with-out changing my grip. I can use my middle finger of my left hand when shooting off-handed to release the mag on my Glock, making the glock as easy to drop a mag off-handed as the HK is strong-handed.

    -metal sights- I don't get this one. Yes they are metal, so? WTF are you doing to break off a sight? Besides, most people get whatever nightsights on they like on thier carry piece. Making the stock sight thing a mute point.

    -steel guide rod- I do see the point of this, but only in extreme cases. The only broken factory Glock guide rod I have seen first hand is on my brother's G20 when he shot some hot 10mm loads in it the first day he got it. But, my 21 has had zero guide rod problems. Beisdes a stainless rod is only like 25 bucks for a Glock."""" end quote"


    The point of the matter is he wanted to know what our opinions were.

    Ambi mag release may be goofy for you (don't know why unless you are challenged in some sort of way), but it is just as easy to release and a lot more versital than the Glock.

    Metal mags RELEASE easier. You should know this anyway.

    AK Vs. AR = Mute point, both have their quirks and strong points. Also, what does the best military in the world carry? Not an AK. Tolerances must not be a big deal for them.

    Like I said, you get what you pay for. Glocks are good guns, I never said any different. With HK, you don't have to upgrade much on them if you don't want to. From a machinery standpoint, the HK is superior. We all know this.
     
  10. khaitran

    khaitran

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    Hey thanks everyone for your input. i really do like the glocks but im going to go with the usp. i agree with many, that both are great weapons and i do undersatnd that putting this in a hk forum has been bias, you do get what you pay for as far as performance goes
     
  11. Lt. Stansfield

    Lt. Stansfield

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    With metal sites if you are wounded you can cycle the slide off your belt.
     
  12. True Punisher

    True Punisher Light 'em up!

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    True to that!! I can't even remember how many times I have had to do that!!

    `l
     
  13. litework

    litework

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    How many times have you pulled your gun out to defend yourself? It doesn't mean it can't happen, it just means it's unlikely. Metal sights are more durable and are the first thing I replace on my Glocks. The stock plastic sights are pure garbage and do not belong on any gun that doesn't shoot water. I have seen the front sight on a Glock break while unholstering.
     
  14. WRIG777

    WRIG777

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    Speaking of "moot" and "mute" points....

    H&K machinery is not always superior. I have sad stories of my PSG-1's, USP 45 + 9mm's, VP70Z, 91, etc., etc, etc. misbehaving. And, remember, H&K says the USP slides are good for 20,000 rounds. That axiomatically makes the Glock slide superior, doesn't it. And make sure you don't break your H&K firing pin by dry firing....It will cost you dearly. I have dry fired my Glocks for many 10's of thousands of rounds without breaking anything. And I have shot numerous Glocks with match ammo over the past 10 years and taken people's $$ that erroneously believed they are not really accurate. And no USP has a fully supported factory barrel. It's a misnomer. If I had $10 everytime I heard people getting corrected on that one at the SHOT shows, even by Gaston....

    We have over 110,000 rounds on average run through out 17's for our concealed carry classes.

    I don't recall every changing the plastic sights and we went long, long intervals before we changed recoil springs on the original OEM recoil spring and guide. And metal sights can get knocked off kilter during a confrontation.

    Enjoy H&K's and shoot what you like but don't fall for the marketing hype as some have. That's the dumbest reason to choose a self defense weapon. The folks that work at H&K roll their eyes at you when you quote their marketing stuff to them. Just like "Glock Perfection". That should speak volumes :)

    Stay safe
     
  15. AaronH

    AaronH

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    Look, there are tons of USP's out there that have had 100,000 rounds or more shot out of them. You say 20,000 is the claim by the factory....you are exactly right. But what you fail to mention is that H&K has a LIFETIME warranty against such issues and so-forth. Glock only has 1 year. I know, I know I can hear you now, "Glock will replace anything that you need. My question is " Why the claim of X number of round if you cannot offer a better warranty"? The sheer fact that HK offers a better warranty should negate the fact of the claim of the barrel life or gun life itself. Point being, there are zero claims that Glock will back up what they say as far as, warranty. With HK, you know what you are getting. Machinery quality has been tested and tested. For anyone who doesn;t know what to expect, do a Google.com search about the 2 weapons. Look for fully supported chamber, look for KB's, etc. The previous poster had me all wrong though, I think Glocks are great weapons...I however think that HK's are better. Do some research please.
     
  16. offeror

    offeror

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    I can't imagine a .45 lover who wouldn't enjoy owning one of each. Well, yes I can, but not for "professional reasons." Both are first rate guns used by pros here and around the world. Both are big, beefy guns, but if you like full sized .45s, these would both be part of a "complete collection" of pro guns. (And, for me, it's nice that both are leftie friendly.)
     
  17. WRIG777

    WRIG777

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    AaronH,


    I almost didn't post a reply since there is so much emotion and unsupported claims in your reply. For example, the " I know, I know I can hear you now.." statement. As someone who has been in private practice for over 25 years now, when a person claims that they know what someone is going to say (mind reading), that's an issue that needs to be addressed, and that's a professional opinion. When people state absolutes (H&K=NO BS), I'm concerned about that, too. Not a flame, but keep your thoughts grounded in reality. :)

    Now, a point by point analysis of your claims.

    1. "Look, there are tons of USP's out there that have had 100,000 rounds or more shot out of them." State your direct source please.
    I have a few, but who else? And, in my direct experience, the H&K's don't age as gracefully. Only an issue if you run lots of rounds through them.

    2. "The sheer fact that HK offers a better warranty should negate the fact of the claim of the barrel life or gun life itself." As one who has plenty of H&K stuff and had to deal with the factory for a long,long time, one might conclude that you do not have the same experience level as I do on this matter. Lifetime warranty perhaps, yet do they have the part? What actual service is delivered to the customer counts, what is promised to the customer, rarely does (H&K parts availability!). As anyone that has a substantial business background can tell you, a lifetime warranty is usually a sales gimmick, even on a great product like H&K. It has to do with the relative "kill rate" of the product and particular parts, and nothing else. That's also how rebates work, BTW. Please, don't believe me, go ask someone who knows of such things. And go check out the www.hkpro.com site. Plenty of complaints there. :)

    3. "Look for fully supported chamber..". Go ask Mr. Schuemann or Mr. Jarvis what a real, fully supported barrel looks like. USP's don't have them. Real barrel makers opinions, not Google.

    Both are great guns, but, lighten up! I have actually treated 2 people with the dreaded "H&K compulsive disorder".
     
  18. AaronH

    AaronH

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    Both are great guns, but, lighten up! I have actually treated 2 people with the dreaded "H&K compulsive disorder".


    Wow, so creative you are. I think all the years of your private practice has distorted your mind a little. You kind of remind me of the guy from the movie "Hide and Seek." Look, I am not even going to go into this anymore with you. It seems like all you can do is try and insult people.
     
  19. WRIG777

    WRIG777

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    Sorry if I hurt your feelings. I was attempting to keep it light.

    I said it with a smile, yet your post tells much. I have no vague notion as to what you do for a living, but I have helped hundreds of people, oftentimes leading them out of a living hell. And you?

    And now, in an attempt to save face and return an insult that was not even sent your way, you compare me to a fictional character from a movie and make more negative assumptions based on your ignorance of my profession. Why would an adult make comparisons of someone they don't know with a fictional character? Why compare in the first place?

    If what I said is pushing your buttons ( and it appears to be ), then you might want to see someone about it. Nothing you have said is pushing mine.

    Healthy adults shouldn't get "wrapped-around-the-axel" over such trivial matters, Yes?

    Peace ;) :) :) :) :)
     
  20. AaronH

    AaronH

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    Ah the superficial one are we? Well since you like to bring up careers so often, I can tell you what I have done as well....since you kind of asked. I used to be in the United States Coast Guard as a LT. I went to the Coast Guard Academy, I graduated with a BSBA. I am now a Pharmaceutical Sales Representative for a large cooperation. You refer to helping people...well, my time in the CG speaks for itself. Have you ever interdicted drugs before? Have you ever put your life on the line for someone you don't even know? Ever rescued innocent children from a sinking vessel? Please don't come at me like you are anything special.

    You said that you are pushing my buttons, well, you kind of did with your ignorance of my background. I hope you can learn from your assumptions and move on with your life. BTW, it sounds like I pushed your buttons. . . ;)