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Discussion in 'Political Issues' started by teeceetx, Nov 21, 2019.
So much wrong with your 'Takeaways" above;
How can anyone see this as getting to the truth? Its a controlled partisan witch hunt...which most common sense folks can see. We have multiple witnesses saying , "Quid pro quo"...but then in Testimony they say that Trump specifically told them, "No quid pro quo"
No there is no doubt in my mind the inference was to have the Ukraine leader look into this...just as there ARE ALWAYS strings attached to every dollar of aide from the US..or any country really. I see this as a case where Trump was asking for facts on any corruption in the US....in other words...rooting out the swamp creatures.
You don't think its Quid pro quo Bidens son gets a cushy million dollar position on a Ukraine gas company? What about after Joes trip to China Hunter magically get billions thrown at him by the Chinese? Coincidence? You think Hunter is some genius Hedge fund guy? Ugh No.
Its quid pro quo bro....but when Trumps asks for facts/clarification....the Democrats come unglued. Well of course...because there will be much more dirty laundry to come out unless they go on the offensive.
Biden Stopped their AG from investigating his son...and used the US Gov and its resources to do it. And he did it on national TV....admitting to it.
Whistleblower; so anyone can say anything....and be shielded by the whistleblower rules. Can you not see the potential for horrible partisanship here?
This is the reason why our courts insist that you can confront your accuser....so that someone cannot lie without repercussion. The whistle blower statue takes this away.
I cannot stand the way Trump behaves...and hate some of the stupid comments he makes but it is becoming abundantly clear that there is no politician that is going to uncover the corruption that he is nibbling at....and the whole system is fighting him tooth and nail along the way.
Sure the FBI lost all of the relevant emails on the Russia gate, Mueller investigation and partisan corruption of their top brass......look at what Trump is fighting...its insane how much corruption there is.
I rarely post in the political form as any criticism of Trump somehow means you’re a commie loving liberal that hates America.
That being said, having watched a lot of the testimony it seems pretty clear that Trump wanted a Ukraine Biden investigation (or even just the announcement of one) in exchange for the military aid.
Secondly, why would that surprise any of us? Trump has been a con man and grifter his entire adult life. He would never make a deal that did not personally benefit him somehow, especially if he has the leverage. It’s just his nature.
Why do we think he would stop simply because he was elected president?
It probably does not matter and could very well back fire on the Democrats. Trump certainly won’t be convicted by the senate if impeached. Trump will beat the democrats over the head with this all the way to the election.
It will be an interesting election season. Trump will basically need a repeat of the 2016 election. I doubt he will turn any blue states red. He won’t be able let any red states turn blue. If he does he loses.
the best thing for him would be a Warren or Sanders opponent. Their far left lunacy would practically guarantee his re-election.
Biden is his biggest threat. He is just moderate enough to turn some red states blue.
win or lose Trump will lose the popular vote by an even larger margin than he did last time
Another good post!
So -- we have it on record that, for some people, "I heard it from someone who overheard someone in a phone conversation with someone else" is compelling evidence...
Note to self: Please do not get involved in any courtroom proceedings that require a judgment by my "peers"...
I'd agree with you here except that nothing I have read offers any shred of fact based evidence to support that POTUS ever communicated that intent to folks. This is why it becomes a he said she said I thought that's what he wanted game. Those games play well in Hollywood, but not in real life, especially not in a Presidential impeachment. Show some facts and I will lock the door to his cell personally.
I know I haven't read every transcript available, but I have not seen any fact based evidence Call transcripts, missing transcripts, recordings... that show POTUS communicate any request that aid be withheld until Biden is investigated.
Seriously, the fact that his son (and the sons of other prominent politicians) "working" as board member for Burisma was not investigated and risked being tossed in jail was not a personal benefit to Biden. You made good points with 1 and 2, but this one is faulty to say the least. Basically, what you are saying is that when a democrat demands that corruption be investigated before aid is rendered is cool, even if said investigation has a HUGE personal interest and conflict, but when a different person does its personal crap. Sorry, but its either within US foreign policy goals to seek out corruption before we give them $$ or its not. Cant have it both ways.
There is no whistle blower. Who ever filed the forms is by legal definition not a whistle blower. Unless things have changed, they were not present during the call and are spouting info they were given. AFAIK that not whistle blowing, but being used as cover. There is also no protection for whistleblowers from providing evidence and testimony. Lhe law prevent anyone from retaliation, (unless you're an ATF guy who burns a DNC cabinet member that is). Constitution also sates that one has a right to face their accuser in court. Not that many on either side of the political aisle give much of a hoot about that anymore.
Both sides of the aisle are political hacks. Its the type of person that the media and intellectually challenged electorate reward with jobs.
On paper you're correct. Hasn't been like that foe generations. Sorry to bring a dose of reality here.
No idea what part of TX you are in, but neither the pledge and any religious thing is mandatory. Kids are allowed to sit out and not participate in all of those. Ive lived through indoctrination and can tell you if you can sit out you aint being indoctrinated into squat. What is indoctrination is the incessant leftist crap they are fed and cant remove themselves from. Climate change essays, illegals not being referred to as illegals but migrants and god help you if you dont,...and the like. Thats indoctrination.
Intersting point. Normalcy must have a relationship to good, right, moral or we are in deep doo doo. I agree that most folks are just trying to get through their day, but if they are going about that task with no ties to good, right, moral... WTF??
Biden= juiced in DemoCRAP. Can do no wrong.
Trump= swamp draining elected president.
DemoCRAPS= out to unseat Trump @ day one.
Do the math.
They will not stop.
I enjoyed reading your thoughtful replies.
Your replies to points to 3, 5, and 6 are spot on but because they are now so accepted and commonplace, it is the new normal and in the WTF category.
With respect to 4, whistle blowers can face consequences. The references below apply to government fraud but I would expect similar concepts to apply to the impeachment's whistle blower.
https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=(title:31 section:3729 edition:prelim)
As shown throughout the hearing and Trump's administration, there is a price to pay for not vetting or hiring qualified personnel. I suspect the information came from those within the WH. Trump has been plagued by leaks from day 1.
I cannot imagine what type of situation caused you to undergo your indoctrination but am glad you overcame it. I say this based on your ability to reason. Those that I consider to have been indoctrinated, by politics or religion, tend to be dogmatic and immigrated to the U.S. as adults. I have to wonder why they bothered coming in the first place.
Thanks and have a good weekend!
I'm flabbergasted that seemingly rational adults fail to grasp the concept that a group of ideologues got together to commit to the same lie. What kind of ridiculously immature, childish worldview does one have to have where they say "a bunch of people claimed the same thing, therefore it must be true."
And not just people, but leftists, cultists devoted to an ideology that glorifies lying and criminal activity for the sake of the agenda. Yeah, really a stretch that they would lie.