Still Learning

Discussion in 'General Glocking' started by Fisherman, Mar 30, 2012.

  1. Fisherman

    Fisherman

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    Not only my first Glock but my first semi-auto. I have a 19 and love most things about it. However! It ejects almost exclusively to the rear and that's an annoyance but, for the moment, that's issue #2. Issue #1 is probably operator error.
    Along with so many other rookies, I tend to shoot low and left. I understand the likely reason for that and am trying to find a solution. I have gunsmith installed Ameriglo sights but I don't believe they are part of the problem. Several hundred rounds have shown me that at 10 yds if I aim a bit high and right I can consistently put 115 gr FMJs in a 6" group. For those who have encountered and overcome this problem, what would you suggest. I'm pretty much on my own here.:dunno:
     
  2. oldman11

    oldman11

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    2 possibilities. You're twisting the gun counter clockwise a little; or you are milking the grip with your little finger. Also try other guns and see if you do the same thing.
     

  3. voyager4520

    voyager4520

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    What I found helped me shoot more centered and more accurate is this:
    1. I twist my strong hand so that my thumb and trigger finger are pretty much parallel with my trigger finger extended.
    2. The part of the trigger finger pad that I use to pull the trigger is between the center of the pad and the joint.
    3. I focus on pulling the trigger straight back, and make sure that the lower portion of my trigger finger is not rubbing the frame behind the trigger guard as I pull the trigger.
    4. I use the trigger reset for all shots after the first. When you fire the first shot, hold the trigger to the rear. Once the gun has chambered another round, let the trigger out until you feel a click in the trigger, now you can pull the trigger again to fire another shot.

    With the erratic ejection thing, try a different ammo first, perhaps something in 124gr or 147gr. If you experience the same erratic ejection, the extractor may not move freely enough and replacing it may fix the problem. If a new extractor doesn't fix the problem, you'd need to get the 30274 ejector installed into the gun. It'd be best to find a local Glock Certified Armorer to do those things for you, or to call Glock and explain the problem to them, and ask that they install the new ejector to fix the ejection problem. If your G19 is a Gen3 or earlier, they may be reluctant to install the new ejector. They have done so in some cases and refused to do so in others, even recently.

    Is your G19 a Gen4? It should have "Gen4" stamped on the slide next to the "19" model number if it's a Gen4. If it is a Gen4, lock the slide back and see which ejector it has, in the following post you'll see the 30274 ejector on the left and the 336 ejector on the right:
    https://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=18458604&postcount=5
    (the bottom picture)
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2012
  4. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

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    (Can you guys predict what is to follow? :) )

    Try sitting down at a bench with sandbags, to steady the gun, while you work on sight alignment, sight picture, and trigger control. This will tighten your groups up a lot and let you know where on the target your gun is shooting for you.

    Then when you go back to standing up, you will better recognize what portions of your problems are operator error, because you will know based upon the bench what you and your Glock are capable of :)
     
  5. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

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    While at the bench, work on a slow trigger pull. Slow and steady, like a train going down the tracks through a small village. Slow, like 30 seconds for the whole trigger pull once you begin it.

    When will with the gun actually fire? You don't want to know. Keep the sights on target with one half of your brain, while the other half is slowly pulling the trigger. Eventually it goes BOOM! You want the BOOM! to be a surprise to you. If your mind doesn't know exactly when it is going to happen, you are not going to flinch in anticipation (one of the common causes of shooting low).

    You want to pull that trigger slowly back to the rear sight. Can you do that? Try it at the bench. If your sights are perfectly aligned, and held on target, and the trigger is pulled slow, and you are resting on a sandbag to keep everything steady, you can't possibly shoot bad :)

    Doing this at the bench allows you to practise those things. Then when you stand up, all you have to work on is your steady hold. You'll already know the other things. Easy as pie.

    Oh, note that all of this is easier learned with a .22. Lots of guys like to skip over the the little boom and go to the big BOOM! But it is smarter to learn on the little boom.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2012
  6. Arc Angel

    Arc Angel Deus Vult!

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    No matter which Glock generation you have, order another brand new extractor for your G-19. (You want one with a vertical angle on the claw. Polish the top and bottom, 'flats' too.)

    I had locally installed aftermarket sights on my new G-19, too. This pistol drove me crazy shooting to the left all of the time. I kept looking at the rear sight; and, as best I could tell, the rear sight was JUST A HAIR SLIGHTLY off to the left. So, on a hunch, I had the rear sight moved EVER SO SLIGHTLY to the right.

    Voila! That did it. Sometimes a rear sight being off by no more than half the thickness of a razor blade is all that it takes to make a pistol shoot poorly. (It, still, looks centered too, just a little bit more so.)

    The other improvement I'd suggest is learning how to very very carefully watch the TOP of your front sight and, of course, use A-Zoom snap caps for, at least, 15 minutes each day.

    You should NOT have to aim, 'a bit high' and, 'to the right' - OK.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2012
  7. Fisherman

    Fisherman

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    Many thanks for the guidance. It is a Gen 4 and I'm aware that others have have the ejection problem. That will be fixable one way or another. As for the low and left, I'll have a go at the suggestions one at a time, starting with the bench and I'll watch the trigger pull at the same time. Gotta be something there and I'll look at the grip at the same time. It's been many a year since I shot a .22 but I'll the presence or absence of the problem with that gun will be interesting to compare.
     
  8. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

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    You may or may not already know, but keep sharp eye focus on the front sight the whole time you are actually making the shot. You can be aware of other things, but you eye is on that front sight, keeping it aligned with the rear sight, and centered on the target :)
     
  9. MikeG36

    MikeG36 Have Gun Will Travel

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    Along with the great advice above try focusing on the front sight. Let the rear sight and target blur. If you stay focused on the front sight and slowly pull the trigger such that it's a surprise when the gun fires, you should see a huge improvement. Grip stance and breathing are also key factors to work on. Good Luck and have fun!
     
  10. Fisherman

    Fisherman

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    I do, in fact, focus on the front sight; try to make it the size of a baseball in my head. Some range time next week, especially from the bench, should should be especially helpful. Later this afternoon, I'm going to see a guy who happens to be a professional and I'll ask him to fire a few rounds and see how that goes. That will rule any sight maladjustments in or out. I will work on the slow trigger pull. Thanks and I'll let you know what works as it progresses.
     
  11. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

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    If you are going to see a professional, then see if you can get a lesson while there, too. Offer to buy him lunch or something :)
     
  12. Fisherman

    Fisherman

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    Got some excellent instruction and groups tightened up nicely. Just a tiny bit of difference in the sights and a 3/4" group of the bench at 10 yds. I've got a long way to go but it's going to be fun.
     
  13. 67November

    67November

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    Glad to hear you're seeing some improvements. I too was shooting low and left and started asking about sights. Instead, I was given this link, which is all about trigger technique. It's actually a compilation from GlockTalk.

    http://www.glockfaq.com/content.aspx?ckey=glock_faq_trigger_technique_101

    Some items have been covered here, but it's a good read for a relative newcomer to shooting. I found it very helpful.

    I now practice trigger technique at home with a photo tripod. I use it as a standing rest (with an unloaded gun of course) and focus on an object about 10-15 yards away. I then do dry fire trigger practice to the point where the front sight doesn't move AT ALL from the target object when I pull the trigger. It's very easy to see the movement of the sight when your pull is off without a round leaving the barrel. I've seen significant improvement at the range as a result.

    YMMV
     
  14. Fisherman

    Fisherman

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    Just looked at that site and will give it a much more thorough read this evening. I'm open for any and all advice. Thanks and good luck, as well.
     
  15. Veedubklown

    Veedubklown

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    Old trick is balancing a penny on your front sight, when you practice trigger control (dry fire execises, no ammo!). Keep working at it, until you can pull the trigger, and keep that penny up there.

    It gets frustrating, but you can do it!
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2012
  16. got2hav1

    got2hav1

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    Another thing that might help your shooting is a laser. Mount it on the gun and practice dry firing it. Gives you some immediate feedback on how the gun is moving during your trigger squeeze. I know it has helped my groups!:supergrin:
     
  17. Fisherman

    Fisherman

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    The penny is new to me. I have another gun with a laser on it and you're right; it shows what's happening.
     
  18. Lindenwood

    Lindenwood

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    Dry-fire practice is absoluely the best training tool you can use. It allows you to 1) practice sight alignment and acquisition, and especially 2) to watch the sights while squeezing the trigger, WITHOUT the worry of an actual discharge. Get to where you can squeeze the trigger without moving the sights, and you're well on your way!!

    If you cant control the trigger, you can't control the gun. And the only way to know you can control the trigger is to practice without shots going off.

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