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Soft points or hollow points for rifle self defense?

  1. Edited the title to clarify this is for rifle defense.

    Which one and why?
     
  2. Prefer Speer Gold Dots hollow point as they are commonly used by LEOs. I try not to overthink/ over analyze that kind of thing.

    But that’s just me.

    ETA - please ignore. Didn’t see it was in the rifle forum. My apologies.
     
  3. Which one works best on biceps?
     
  4. As long as they are not varmint rounds that will fragment, I don't care. If they hold together they will tumble, so it doesn't matter.
     
  5. ........
     
  6. This topic has pretty much been discussed to Death here on GT...I maintain the smart move is to determine which round is being used by LE in your area of operations, and try to carry the same load...among the top-tier companies, there is actually little difference in performance...stick with the top 3-4 and you will be good to go.
    Personally, I believe most EDC folks should be more concerned about "Hitting" their target rather than what brand they carry
     
  7. What or which category are ballistic tips? I have some of those that are secondary to my M193 FMJs. I suppose that makes both ammo types that I keep not on the poll? :dunno:

    I really prefer reliability over anything in a semi-automatic firearm. I spent more time with rifles for a certain Uncle, I do less so now. An indoor, public 25 yard range gets old fairly quickly with a long gun. I vet their feeding and the occasional practice after. Even before the 'Rona, "premium" rifle ammo was just that cost wise. I decided to keep the very rare chance I'd need a rifle to the basics.

    In a rifle length barrel in 556, I'm comfortable with the tried and true M193 in an AR.
     
  8. 9mm:

    #1: Hornady Critical Duty 135gr +P
    #2: Hornady Critical Duty 125gr +P
    #3: Speer Gold Dot 124gr +P
    #4: Federal HST 124gr +P
     
  9. 9MM

    Federal 9BLE 115 JHP +P+

    Proven on the street.
     
  10. Speer never made a Gold Dot HP, in rifle ammunition. Their rifle is bonded soft point and performs well, from what I’ve seen.
     
  11. This is the “Black Rifle” subforum. I’m guessing he meant .223/5.56, .308/7.62, etc.
     
  12. I don’t think people know this is in the rifle forum. My guess is your responses are not accurate.

    I prefer soft point, in rifles, such as the Gold Dots or Federal Fusion/T3 or Ranger Bonded SP.
     
  13. What you want is controlled expansion for defensive purposes. Soft points are OK for hunting where you have enough velocity to make them expand. But expansion has always been a very "Iffy" proposition at pistol ammo velocities until the advent of the Speer Gold dot, the Federal HST, the Winchester Ranger,and the Hornady Flex-lock controlled expansion projectiles.

    The Hornady XTP has always worked well and a wide range ocf velocities but tend to expand less and penetrate more except at higher velocities. Remington Golden sabers should also be counted among modern controlled expansion designs.

    But soft points are really not much better than FMJ's when it comes to pistol ammo and some of the earlier cup-and-core JHP's did not work all that well either except for various 357 mag 125 grain JHP's and teh Federal Plus+P+Plus BPLE load where high velocity allowed the simple cup-and-core hollow point to work better.
     
  14. Whoops, didn`t see that. I`ll go pull my post. Thanks Nik
     
  15. FMJ or green tip if/when I can get my hands on some de-milled bullets.
     
  16. Both?

    Soft point for revolvers. HP for semis.
     
  17.  
  18. Perhaps, you can edit the thread title.
     
  19. This is what a typical wound looks like from cheap FMJ(not steel jacket). Why over think this?
    upload_2020-9-13_17-20-3.png
     
  20. great post. If you can’t find the info from local LE, carry what the FBI does which is Critical Duty 135 9mm +p. If you want a different path and follow international law of non expanding and non lead based, go with Black Hills Honeybadger. If those dont suit you. Buy what you can find locally from the trusted and proven brands like winchester, federal, remington, speer, etc and practice, practice, and practice some more.
     
  21. I would love to find a revolving AR!!! That would be cool as hell!
     
  22. I have both soft points, and some Gold Dot LE hollow points.

    Just wondering if things kick off which should be the go-to.
     
  23. Edited the title. Not going to judge. I always search by new posts, so sometimes miss the forum as well.

    Set it so everyone can change their vote if they want though.
     
  24. Just seems hard to believe that it actually works that way. On the handgun side we obsess over ammo.
     
  25. LOL! I didn't even know what forum I was posting in but I guess my answer is the same. I use both in AR's but currently my go-to SD AR's are the TBBC in one and Black Hills 50 grain TSX in the other.
     
  26. For my 6.8 SBR 115 OTMs or Fed. 110 Fusion.
    If I have the 5.56 barrel (10.5") in it is Black Hills 75's (Reds).
    Much prefer the 6.8 - I'm short of ammo so not a lot of practice.
    Also, the change (5.56 to 6.8) requires a big adjustment on the TA33.
    Unless things get really weird I'm going with 5.56 (lot's of ammo). :cool:
     
  27. Soft points for hunting and preferable for defensive use but I use Federal XM193 and don't have any concerns.
     
  28. Curse the "Latest Replies" box! It's gotten me into trouble more than once! Half the time I don't know what forum I'm replying in.
     
  29. I`m good with FMJ. Anything running above 3,000FPS, it will do some serious work.
    Why: Because penetration matters going through windshields and car doors.
     
  30. Yepppp, its bitten me a few times...lol.
     
  31. For a 5.56 rifle with a 14 inch barrel or longer my choice would be 5.56 55 gr FMJ. It's been proven to defeat level III armor and biceps.

    For a 5.56 rifle with a barrel less than 14 inches, I'd do Speer GoldDot 62 gr. JSP. Tends to open up reliably in shorter barrels.
     
  32. Having followed that advise , I bought a bunch of 55gr Winchester Ranger soft point ten 10 years ago.
    Regardless, soft point does make sense to me for an 'all around' performance.


     
  33. Speer Gold Dot LE Duty 223 Remington Ammo 62 Grain Soft Point
     
  34. It works that way for military style 5.56 and German 7.62 FMJ only as far as I know. The bullets start to tumble in flesh and then break at the cannelure. The rear half will often shatter and fragments spread out and cut the heck out of things. More velocity means more damage but even short barreled rifles will do this at short range.
     
  35. I have Hornady soft points meant for deer in the wife's hd ar. With two extra mags on the night stand of m193. Either will do I just keep soft points in it mainly for when I shoot a coyote with it as they are too light framed to get the ball round tumbling the soft point puts them down quicker. Quite frankly I'd hate to see what any of them would do to a human inside a house. I'd rather never find out.
     
  36. But a revolving AR would still be cool as hell. Imagine a swing-out cylinder where the mag well is for something like .50 AE, I'd buy that...
     
  37. Gatling Gun,,, more barrels=more fun...
     
  38. There’s GDHP in rifle?
     
  39. Not exactly an AR but how about a 40mm? LTL_02.jpg
     
  40. For close range defense ball is fine either M193 or M855
     
  41. Yep.

    Seemed to be the most well reviewed so I bought a bunch back when.
     
  42. Hornady 55 grain TAP have worked well for LE in 5.56.
     
  43. I'd choose Hornady 75 grain TAP if I wanted overall performance.
     
  44. Can you post a pic of the round and a part number? I’d like to see this. I can’t find anything online.
     
  45. 55 gr fmj M193. It yaws and fragments in tissue and causes massive trauma. No need for expensive HP or soft point ammo in an AR.
     
  46. It is often recommended to avoid soft point bullets in semi-auto's.
    The point can more easily deform when feeding, compared to a jacketed hollow point, or sometimes the soft point can break off and jam between the cartridge and the barrel chamber.
    Jacketed hollow points, loaded to the proper length, are usually recommended for expanding bullets in semi-auto's.
     
  47. M1 carbine is my self defense rifle.
    no problem with shooting soft points in my M1 carbine... doesn't know the diff between SP and Ball.
     
  48. Soft points for the AR-15. I have read that Hornady TAP, Federal Trophy Bonded Bear Claw (never saw any for sale), or 50 grain TSX would some of the best choices. I never felt like paying the price when they were available. Probably should have bought some Hornady TAP when I could have. I have 200 Gold Dot 62 grain, 200 Winchester Power Point 64 grain, and 500 Hornady Frontier 62 grain Spire Point. The Gold Dots are the only bonded round and I think they were ~$14 a box a few years ago. Bone Frog Club has some 62GR Federal Tactical Bonded.

    https://www.speer.com/ammunition/gold_dot/rifle/gold_dot_rifle_personal_protection/19-24461.html

    https://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/self_defense_ammo_FAQ/#mozTocId206397

    https://www.bonefroggunclub.com/col...actical-bonded-le223t1?variant=12168542748741
     
  49. That maybe true with some soft points. I have not had any problem with Speer Gold dots -

    The end isn’t really like many soft points as far as exposed lead is concerned.

    upload_2020-9-14_10-57-39.jpeg
     
  50. I will generally be OK with most any NATO approved 55 grain 5.56 load, but have about 200 of the premium 55 grain LE loads as they are nickel plated, which helps with ejection and corrosion.