Soft points or hollow points for rifle self defense?

Discussion in 'Black Rifle Forum' started by TheDreadnought, Sep 13, 2020.

  1. Soft points

  2. Hollow points

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  1. BigBluefish

    BigBluefish

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    Well, the only CF rifles I have are deer guns, and unless I need to shoot through 3 or 4 perps all lined up, I’ll go with soft points in 6.5 Swede & .350, as I believe my only other option is FMJ. I expect either will get the job done rather decisively.

    Now for the little 9mm carbine, hollowpoints of the 147 grain variety are the current choice.
     
  2. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    I picked softpoints because hollowpoints in rifles have a tendency to break into small fragments when they have to penetrate things. I recall a guy in eastern Kentucky, back in the '80s, ambushed with .223 hollowpoints through the top of his truck - he was peppered with fragments but not seriously hurt. On the other hand, I have killed deer with no problem, using .223 softpoints.
     
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  3. Master Guns

    Master Guns

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    I know about these rounds. I worked there for many years. Just left. I have to correct you on some of this info you passed. The LE223E is a Sierra GameKing and not match king. 2 different bullets. Gameking is an LE bullet that frags and still penetrate good. Not even close to M262. Different kind of bullet. Made for hunting and LE.


    M318 is not a true match bullet. Won’t even hold 1 MOA. It is a HPBT that is made to frag and penetrate deep. It has a solid copper shank so it’s known as a barrier blind round. they call it a OTM but isn’t a true OTM. Open tip match rounds don’t give to barrier blind performance. That’s why for example a 168/175 308 GMM don’t do well on glass. Not made for that. It doesn’t have barrier blind performance. Mk318 does this well. Just a little more in-depth info for you. I don’t tell you to be a smarty pants. Just to pass on knowledge.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2020
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  4. AK_Stick

    AK_Stick AAAMAD

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    You have your nomenclature mixed up.

    Federal LE223E is a 55 grain BTHP Sierra Matchking.

    Federal Tactical TRU (Tactical Rifle Urban) T223E is the loading with the game king.

    You can argue that 318 is or isn’t actually an OTM round with ATK. They call it OTMRP. It’s a reverse drawn OTM projectile, manufactured backwards specifically to not be a “hollow point” as even ATK acknowledges.
     
  5. Master Guns

    Master Guns

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    You are wrong bro. LE223E is GameKing and only GameKing.
     
  6. Master Guns

    Master Guns

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    Nomenclature is LE223E is an LE/Hunting bullet. It uses a Sierra GameKing bullet. There is not other round but this one that goes by LE223E. You are wrong 100%. Let’s not pass disinformation
     
  7. AK_Stick

    AK_Stick AAAMAD

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  8. Master Guns

    Master Guns

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    Actually you confirmed what I said. Again, I worked there for years in Mn. I know a lot about the rounds. What I’m saying is spot on when it comes to these rounds. Mk318 Mod1 is still being made. 223E is as well on the LE side. Take care
     
  9. AK_Stick

    AK_Stick AAAMAD

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    Lol. Ok sure.
     
  10. Master Guns

    Master Guns

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    Why be prideful? If you had knowledge from the inside I would appreciate and welcome it. I am just sharing info I have. That’s all. That a great thing for people on the threads. Don’t be the guy that can’t be wrong or open to something. Grow up.
     
  11. AK_Stick

    AK_Stick AAAMAD

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    That would be great if your “inside knowledge” was accurate. But as I showed, what you claimed is flat out incorrect.


    I don’t understand why you’re trying to be so combative with incorrect information, but it doesn’t make what you’re trying to say correct.
     
  12. GunsNweights87

    GunsNweights87

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    Very bad choice they get 7-8 inches of penetration in calibrated ordinance gel


    Sent from my iPhone using Glock Talk
     
  13. knoxrocks222

    knoxrocks222

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    Lucky for me I don’t have any gel people living out here around me but I have shot coyotes with them and get a complete pass through at 25 yards
     
  14. GunsNweights87

    GunsNweights87

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    Not to be smug but I hope you understand the point of the 12-18 inch gel depth and what it means in people. 7-8 inches from a varmint round won’t reach vitals especially when having to go through hard barriers like sternum, ribs or even an arm bone. But all the best of luck I still wouldn’t want to get hit buy one. But If I had to choose between getting shot with a varmint round or a bonded softpoint I’d take the varmint round all day!


    Sent from my iPhone using Glock Talk
     
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  15. rogn

    rogn real dogs

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    The military uses the 77gr .224 BTHP with cannelure for a reason.
     
  16. cowboy1964

    cowboy1964

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  17. AK_Stick

    AK_Stick AAAMAD

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    And that reason was they wanted a projectile that performed at extended ranges from the SPR.
     
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  18. rogn

    rogn real dogs

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    I would lso fracture at the cannelure and the pieces would tumble. It was legal within the Geneva Convention.
     
  19. AK_Stick

    AK_Stick AAAMAD

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    It’s not the Geneva convention, it was the Hague accords.

    And the cannelure is for crimping the bullet in the case and preventing setback. It doesn’t affect the terminal performance. The original Mk 262 did not feature a cannelure, and performed wonderfully as well, but we found that setback was a problem with the long bullets.

    Long bullets that tumble often break apart, this is not something unique to the Mk262 Mod1 or 5.56.

    5.45 is well known to tumble and fragment.
     
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  20. megawatt

    megawatt Electron maker

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    Self defense on a black rifle? I say just hit your target. The bullet type isn’t gonna matter since self defense is gonna be close range. Not like self defense is a shot at 300 yards.