close

Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.

Should Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGuire make baseball HOF?

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by czsmithGT, Nov 28, 2012.

  1. czsmithGT

    czsmithGT

    Messages:
    13,648
    Likes Received:
    4,799
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2004
    I would say no. However, I could be dissuaded from that opinion by a good argument.

    Without using steroids Sosa and McGuire wouldn't even be under consideration. But Bonds and Clemens would have been shoe-ins if they hadn't used them although their stats would not have been so gaudy.

    I bet many, many HOF players used some kind of performance enhancing drug during their career- cortisone shots to let them play with injury, amphetamines to keep them going through a grueling season.
     
  2. tous

    tous GET A ROPE!

    Messages:
    35,118
    Likes Received:
    40,036
    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2001
    Location:
    Plano, Texas, Republic of

  3. Walt_NC

    Walt_NC

    Messages:
    346
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2010
    No. But Pete Rose should.
     
  4. All Pro Sports Hero

    All Pro Sports Hero

    Messages:
    3,762
    Likes Received:
    4,266
    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2010
    Location:
    North Carolina
  5. ray9898

    ray9898

    Messages:
    15,073
    Likes Received:
    3,022
    Joined:
    May 29, 2001
    Location:
    Georgia
  6. 22rtf2

    22rtf2 Peaceful

    Messages:
    2,020
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2009
    Location:
    20 mins from Smyrna
    All of them. Capitalism made em do what they did, bigger paychecks.

    Do you hate capitalism? :p

    Sent from the Daedalus in the Pegasus Galaxy
     
  7. IndyGunFreak

    IndyGunFreak

    Messages:
    26,837
    Likes Received:
    2,201
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2001
    Location:
    Indiana
    I agree. A jury said Clemens did not lie when he said he did not use PED's. A jury said Bonds did.

    That says a lot to me.
     
  8. 9jeeps

    9jeeps

    Messages:
    7,233
    Likes Received:
    2,624
    Joined:
    May 22, 2004
    Location:
    PNW
    Nope! But they sure could use a Hall for Infamous Sports Jocks these days.
     
  9. czsmithGT

    czsmithGT

    Messages:
    13,648
    Likes Received:
    4,799
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2004
    Maybe he just had better lawyers than the government?

    "Prosecutors were forbidden to inform the jury that McNamee assisted other players, including Yankee pitcher Andy Pettitte and former Yankee second baseman Chuck Knoblauch, with doping and that the other players had corroborated his testimony. Lawyers for Clemens convinced U.S. District Court Judge Reggie Walton that such information would be prejudicial to Clemens — potentially leading to guilt by association."
     
  10. Henry's Dad

    Henry's Dad woof, woof

    Messages:
    820
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2011
    Location:
    Upriver of 3 Mile Island
    My argument has always been that if the testing regeime that is in place doesn't catch what you are doing while you are doing it, then the athlete should not be penalized.

    Sorry MLB, get better screening programs in place if you're so worried about it. I didn't hear any complaints in the summer of 1998 when you were counting all the cash generated by Sosa and McGuire.

    It was only after the golden geese stopped laying eggs that you "did the right thing." Ditto for Lance Armstrong and the Tour.
     
  11. TK-421

    TK-421

    Messages:
    10,527
    Likes Received:
    1,061
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Location:
    Pflugerville, TX
    If Lance got his Tour wins revoked due to allegations of using performance enhancers, why should guys be let into the baseball hall of fame if it's been actually proven they've used performance enhancers?

    If they've done really well and haven't used performance enhancers, and have earned a spot in the hall of fame, let them in. If they've used performance enhancers, don't let them in.

    If using performance enhancing drugs is against the rules, don't reward the people who use them, it makes people think you don't care about your own rules. And if you don't care about them, why should anybody else follow them?
     
  12. norton

    norton

    Messages:
    8,952
    Likes Received:
    4,053
    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2002
    Location:
    Land of Lincoln, the growing years
    None of them. Least of all this cheating s.o.b.
     
  13. PAGunner

    PAGunner

    Messages:
    6,035
    Likes Received:
    20
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2008
    Location:
    Sunny South Florida
    All should be in the hall, the fact they aren't is why I don't watch baseball anymore. We've come to a point in society where male hormones are so taboo you here "low T" commercials because TESTOSTERONE (I say it proudly with my prostate cancer awareness month mustache) has successfully been demonized in our nanny state culture... The same culture that will likely make Sandra Fluke Time magazine person of the year for pushing for FREE female hormones!

    Male hormones= Evil & Verbotten
    Female hormones=virtuous & given for free

    And for those of you who say it's "cheating", that's a joke. These men didn't magically grow muscles and athletic ability, they worked their arses off, the roids just helped them. Fact is we're not all born equal, some of us have 3-4x the testosterone of others, is that a "fair" advantage? Were Danny Devito & Shaq born equal? Same chance of being a pro athlete? As far as I'm concerned the roids jus help level the playing field.


    So as far as I'm concerned, PEDs should be fair game in professional athletics, amateur sports I believe it's fair to ban PEDs. Even if you disagree with all that, these guys (Clemens, Bonds, Sosa and McGuire) took the stuff BEFORE it was against the rules, just saying. They're the ones who got singled out, a great MANY (probably a majority) of players were also taking it but didn't get caught or have a light shined on them because they weren't as good, so IMO it's very unfair.

    Athletes are still using and always will use, only now it will be a select few who are willing to "cheat" who will get the advantage, instead of everyone.
     
  14. aplcr0331

    aplcr0331

    Messages:
    4,499
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2002
    You baseball guys should make your HOF like us basketball guys did. Lots of fun, anyone can get in, and everyone *wink* *wink* get's it.

    You old timer's take this baseball stuff too serious. Yes, let 'em in. Pete Rose too.

    Lighten up.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2012
  15. czsmithGT

    czsmithGT

    Messages:
    13,648
    Likes Received:
    4,799
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2004
    Pete Rose? What's next, Shoeless Joe Jackson, Chick Gandil, Eddie Cicotte, "Lefty" Williams, "Happy" Felsch, "Swede" Risberg and Arnold Rothstein?

    :supergrin:
     
  16. inthefrey

    inthefrey Moved on...

    Messages:
    6,991
    Likes Received:
    2,181
    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2009
    Location:
    Western Pennsylvania
    Nope! I was there when McGwire hit his BIG ONE, running the truck for CNN.
    I burned a souvenir copy I got of him on the cover of the local St. Louis paper a few years back - thew it in the burn can.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2012
  17. Detectorist

    Detectorist

    Messages:
    18,063
    Likes Received:
    7,359
    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2008
    Location:
    Missouri
    The sad thing is, McGwire had the natural athleticism to beat most baseball players in home runs.
     
  18. Glocksanity

    Glocksanity

    Messages:
    2,940
    Likes Received:
    27
    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2012
    Location:
    Los Angeles, Man, Los Angeles
    Yes. But they should be put in the PED wing. The Hall of Fame needs a whole wing for the steroid era. It was part of the game and to pretend it did not happen is a disservice to fans and reality.
     
  19. aplcr0331

    aplcr0331

    Messages:
    4,499
    Likes Received:
    1,150
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2002

    Well the only name I recognize on that list is Shoeless Joe Jackson and that is only because he brought back Ray's Dad so he could have a game of catch. That alone warrants the Hall, IMHO.
     
  20. Glocksanity

    Glocksanity

    Messages:
    2,940
    Likes Received:
    27
    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2012
    Location:
    Los Angeles, Man, Los Angeles
    I guess you would let your daughter date OJ then? I mean, the jury did acquit.