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Semi-automatic thinking on gun control

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Paul Barrett, Aug 7, 2012.

  1. Paul Barrett

    Paul Barrett

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  2. OctoberRust

    OctoberRust Anti-Federalist

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    Hey Paul, haven't seen you around in a while. Many of us would argue against background checks. It sort of makes the 2nd amendment counter-productive since ultimately the 2nd amendment is a check and balance to the gov't, in which you're letting decide who gets to keep and bear arms?

    Your article gave me the gist of gun control advocates shouldn't go for banning of certain items per se, but tightening background checks since we seen to be open to that loophole the gun control advocates use to get passed the 2nd amendment.

    Interesting read nonetheless, take care. :wavey:
     

  3. countrygun

    countrygun

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    Good read, but the conclusion that the shooters membership or participation in a "Hate group" should have been taken iinto consideration in his ability to purchase a gun is a lubricated incline that shouldn't be approached.

    What is a "hate group" and who gets to decide? I am sure Bloomberg himself would call the NRA a "Hate Group" if it served his purpose. How in the world can we use membership in a legal group a reason to deny rights and how do we outlaw groups who say unpopular things?

    Way too complicated to be an effective, efficient, or Constitutional qualifier/disqualifier

    Just my .02
     
  4. DustyJacket

    DustyJacket Directiv 10-289

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    Had to ignore the simplification (FA firearms are not illegal, just very highly regulated) and some other thing, but it is a good article overall.
     
  5. smokin762

    smokin762

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    In my opinion, stating that there is no reason for anybody outside of the Military to own 100 round magazines is no different than saying nobody needs over a 10 gallon gas tank outside of Law Enforcement. :upeyes:

    Its narrow minded. I want less control not more. I should never be punished for other people’s actions. Punish those who commit crimes and leave me the heck alone. :steamed:
     
  6. smokin762

    smokin762

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    I noticed the F/A thing too. It should be explained better or just left out.
     
  7. ancient_serpent

    ancient_serpent

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    Mr. Barrett, I enjoyed the article and have recommended it to several friends. I believe that it had enough factual information to educate, but not overwhelm the general public. Thanks for posting the link here.
     
  8. PettyOfficer

    PettyOfficer

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    I think we leave it in. Let the uneducated leftists who read this think full auto is already illegal and they begin to understand that our firearms are semi automatic: one round at a time.

    Perhaps a clarification at AR does not stand for Assault Rifle, but Armalite Rifle, and that these rifles are legal variants of the original. This clarification could be added in the paragraph that notes hunting rifles are based on old military rifles.

    Additionally, say nothing of low weight trigger pulls, short trigger resets and nothing of bump stocks or you'll just add fuel to their fire.
     
  9. Bilbo Bagins

    Bilbo Bagins Slacked jawed

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    Like you said it seems everyone is focused on the guns, but when you look at the most recent spree shootings it all comes down to mental health and Law enforcement.

    This recent sikh temple shooter was on an FBI watch list as a known domestic terrorist.
    http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/...-sikh-temple-shooter-20120806,0,2390104.story

    The Batman movie shooter Psychiatrist contacted University Police weeks before regarding his behavior and potential for violence.
    http://abcnews.go.com/US/james-holm...iversity-police-weeks-movie/story?id=16943858

    Same thing with the Fort Hood shooter, and the VT Tech shooter. Its less about the guns and more about Law Enforcement and healthcare administrators dropping the ball when red flags go up.
     
  10. Just_plinking

    Just_plinking

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    This is obviously the heart of the issue. Either you believe the 2nd amendment is there to protect our society as the end check and balance of the government, or you don't.

    And this little detail is going to put you on one side of the fence or the other.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012
  11. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    I agree with you. Many on the left, including politicians, use the term "hate group" for everybody they don't like, including the NRA.

    An even bigger issue is how do you define the "group" and prove who is a member. There is no process for having a due processs determination that you are a "hate group member" and the membership is so hard to prove that even in prisons people who are under 24/7 supervision often can't be proven to be gang members.

    An illustration:
    What would be the Milwaukeee shooter's "hate group"? Skinheads?

    The first problem is, who is a skinhead and how are they a group? One doesn't join "skinheads" - it's a subculture that one simply decides he or she is part of. Calling them a "group" and trying to indentify members is like calling hippies or punk rockers or metal heads a "group." In fact, skinheads, in the modern form, are mainly a subdivision of the punk rock subculture (with a lot more heavy metal involved in the last 20 years)

    Next, there are all sorts of Skinheads - the oldest variety, who call themselves "traditional" started as the 1960's English version of those white gangsta rap kids down at the mall - they went to black clubs and listened to reggae music and hung out with black kids, long before white power skinheads showed up in England in the late 70's and early 80's. The traditional skinheads include members of all sorts of minorities. Then there are anti-racist skinheads, who are anti-racism activists, called by names like "SHARP" (SkinHeads Against Racial Prejudice) - there is even some history of racist and anti-racist skinheads killing each other. Then there are everything from gay skinheads to straight edge skinheads (don't like alcohol, drugs, etc.) to communist/anarchist skinheads (allegedly).

    Even if you narrow them to the white power skinheads, there are a wide variety of groups and movements, from the very large Hammerskins to small local neighborhood gangs or "crews" to disorganized individuals who don't belong to any particular group.

    The problem is, the people who would actually make the laws about "hate groups" would never, if they took 5 years to write the law, even bother to learn as much as I just typed, much less figure out how to incorporrate it into a law.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012
  12. Kasinefect

    Kasinefect

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    Various liberal groups have applied the title of "hate group" to the NRA, military veterans, people who are advocates of personal liberty and free speech; where does it end? Research it for yourself as it will be easy to find. I have no use for the Nazis, KKK, or assorted groups such as the New Black Panthers, ect. Funny thing though, Someone like me who works, pays his taxes, owns guns, votes, would wind up the target of gun banners liberals or people like George Will, Charles Krauthammer, who call themselves conservative but would love to see us disarmed as well.

    Is it any wonder we want to keep our guns?
     
  13. cowboy1964

    cowboy1964

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    Krauthammer is a smart guy but I can't believe how ignorant he is on guns in "civilized society". Law-abiding civilian guns don't prevent "civilized society", they ensure the continuation of it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012
  14. Paul Barrett

    Paul Barrett

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    Hold the phone, DustyJacket. That is the handsomest Dachsie I've seen today, apart from my boy, Beau, the 19-pound beauty waiting for me at home on the couch. Let's focus on something important: Obey the Dachshund. - Paul Barrett
     
  15. Paul Barrett

    Paul Barrett

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    I've been very busy lately getting my next book going. It is not about guns. It is about the oil industry in the Amazon. Publication in 2014. - PMB
     
  16. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

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    Agree.

    Nobody needs more than 100 free speech words a day, outside of the government.
     
  17. redbaron007

    redbaron007 Some Dude Lifetime Member

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    Interesting article.

    :wavey:

    red
     
  18. GAFinch

    GAFinch

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    Good article, but the problem with the call for tightening background checks is that it can easily be used to have background check records stored for years while an "understaffed" DOJ processes the massive backlog of records. Stored records=backdoor gun registration. Gun bans are, of course, frequently preceded by gun registration.
     
  19. Minnow

    Minnow

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    Better than your average article which is usually just a hit and run for pro gun control. I don't agree with the articles declaration that machine gun ownership is illegal. I think a short clarification (cite the laws, accessibility, cost, paperwork) is in order for future articles. If you see a full auto weapon in the hands of a civilian in this country, it may be perfectly within the law and not wise to make a valid determination that the person in possession is committing any kind of crime.
     
  20. humanguerrilla

    humanguerrilla

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    I've been meaning to check out your book.

    The 100 round drum part is kind of ignorant and not just because it plays into a antigun narrative. As a reader I don't care what you personally think when you haven't invested enough research for responsible editorializing. There ARE legitimate competition and fun uses to extended magazines.

    [That said most drums for the AR15 are crap, even the ones the military have tried and now stay away from. The malfunctioning drum magazine probably saved lives in Aurora. Its use also signals that the shooter did not know and respect firearms.]

    Don't let your standards go out the window when it comes to guns like other journalists. It has been interesting over the years. From the progressively worse, ignorant coverage to the Newspeak AP style adoption of political antigun buzzwords dumbing down everything. "Assault weapon". The standard capacity magazines many of our guns were designed for are "high capacity","large capacity". Extend that to shoot a competition stage or to feed class III weapons you have jumped through hurdles and have been a fine upstanding citizen to own and what have you got?

    With the "Military-style" stuff you are talking cosmetics, appearances. Good points there. It would have been more accurate to note that hunting rifles were derived more directly not just cosmetically from actual military weapons( omitting the -style) and that some are the actual guns.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012