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Questions on TV show death. When is it murder?

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by larry_minn, Nov 29, 2012.

  1. larry_minn

    larry_minn Silver Member Millennium Member

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    The other night I saw first 10 min of a show. Thought they made a interresting situation. So would like to get some others opinions.

    Late at night, couple sleeping in apt in 20+ story building. Burgler broke in from balcony. Apt owner hears and see burgler climbing up rope.(escaping)

    At this point only property taken, theif escaping up rope.

    So he grabs rope/jerks and burgler slides down/hits homeowner. Then slides down to try to get on balcony below/I assume escape thru next apt. So still nobody hurt/items gone, MAYBE you could argue threat to residents in apts below you?

    The apt owner is upset (property stolen, and minor bruise that was more accident then assult) sees a pruning shears and cuts rope. Burglar falls @18 stories to death.

    What charges should homeowner face?

    IF we remove possibility of residents on floors below possibly being in danger how is cutting rope any different then shooting in back?

    Most important. If that had been you on ledge. Could you have stopped yourself from grabbing rope as you saw crook excape with your money?
     
  2. Glock20 10mm

    Glock20 10mm Use Linux!

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    That would be murder with malice. And had it been me on the ledge he would have been looking at the business end of my 12GA and told to get his ass back on my patio where I could keep his ass under the barrel while I call the po-po to come do their job.
     

  3. Phaze5ive

    Phaze5ive

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    And if he calls your bluff, what would you do then?
     
  4. ray9898

    ray9898

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    Murder....no threat of death or GBH.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2012
  5. larry_minn

    larry_minn Silver Member Millennium Member

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    So you have guy on rope above you. You whip out 12 Guage and order him down. He keeps climbing. Now what?

    I just thought it was a common situation but presented in a unique way.
     
  6. Glock20 10mm

    Glock20 10mm Use Linux!

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    Call him a lot of really nasty names... otherwise since I don't want to go to prison go about calming my nerves down and strategizing a better defense for that kind of invasion.
     
  7. Dennis in MA

    Dennis in MA Get off my lawn

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    Charged with stupidity. Always untie the rope, not cut it.

    "the knot slipped y'onnah."

    Yew and yer F'in rewp!

    Charlie Bronson always had rewp!
     
  8. Booker

    Booker

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    If the bad guy landed on someones car, then vandalism. Otherwise, No Charges!
     
  9. Angry Fist

    Angry Fist Dehumanizer® Lifetime Member

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    Light the rope on fire?
     
  10. Sam Spade

    Sam Spade Staff Member Lifetime Member

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    Manslaughter. Unlawful killing without premeditation and in the heat of passion.
     
  11. Zombiegargoyle

    Zombiegargoyle

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    When the crook fell on to the ledge, the home owner should have put 17 9mm's into the crook, placed a "clean" hunting knife in his hand and called the cops.
     
  12. TBO

    TBO Why so serious? CLM

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    Littering.

    Sent from the toe of my jack boot using Tapatalk 2
     
  13. Kilrain

    Kilrain Señor Member

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    This or some form of it would likely apply in California I reckon'.
     
  14. Huaco Kid

    Huaco Kid

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    Whistle loudly so thief looks up and sees you slowly cutting through the rope with your trusty pocket knife.

    Enjoy the show, as thief starts thickly smoking and possibly combusts, as he rapidly descends the rope from 18 stories up.
     
  15. singularity35

    singularity35

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    Just keep pulling the rope up as the burglar climbs down so the he never reaches the next apt...:tongueout:
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2012
  16. ChiefWPD

    ChiefWPD

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    Depends on the jurisdiction. In NY State you may use deadly physical force to terminate the burglary of an occupied dwelling at night. At least according to my failing memory of the Penal Law....
     
  17. DoubleWide

    DoubleWide

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    It's all a question of location.

    Did that state have a castle law that allowed protection of property as justification for lethal force?
     
  18. Hamilton Burger

    Hamilton Burger Incompetent

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    Sounds like probably cause to me :thumbsup:
     
  19. Critias

    Critias Freelancer CLM

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    Yeah, what could go wrong?
     
  20. Inebriated

    Inebriated

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    Withdrawal means the situation is over, and the burglar isn't a threat anymore. Self defense ceases to exist, because there wasn't anything for you to defend yourself from. So when the homeowner went outside, the burglar was already retreating, meaning he wasn't a threat. The homeowner pulling him back inside is initiating another confrontation, so now neither of them are in the right. When the burglar is trying to get away, and the homeowner cuts the rope, the homeowner is committing murder. There was nothing to defend himself from, and the burglar had tried to retreat twice.

    Is it to be expected (dying while breaking into another person's home)? Certainly. Is it right to kill a person simply for having been in your home? NO! Unless they've got a family member in their arms as they're leaving, your job is not to follow than and pursue the confrontation.

    If it were me in the situation, I would call 911, and go out on the balcony with my 19. I'd yell for the burglar to stay put until police arrived, and hope he listened. If he keeps going to get away, fine... there's only so many places a person can go when scaling a building. If he comes at me, THEN deadly force can be justified.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2012