Open Carry/Cars in TX PT II

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by DonD, Aug 22, 2018.

  1. DonD

    DonD

    Messages:
    11,988
    Likes Received:
    18,199
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2001
    Location:
    Central TX
    I go to my local range and have handguns I'm going to shoot on the passenger seat. I was under the impression that since open carry was legalized in TX, if you have a TX CHL which I do, you can have the guns in plain sight.

    Wow, was I wrong and if caught with something in plain sight, I could be cited. This came from a Sgt in the local Cty Sheriff's dept. He fully understood/agreed that this was a bit contradictory.

    He said that I could have a handgun, open carry on my hip, anything else has to be out of sight. Won't work for me, it'd be biting my hip and a partial rotator cuff tear would make a draw unpleasant and slow.

    So, he said any other guns need to be out of sight and under a jacket or a towel suffices. Very glad I talked to him. I haven't been stopped by any LE on the way to the range (or for that matter any LE) in the 6+ yrs I've had the CHL.

    So, since I think not having a loaded CCW capable gun in your car enroute to the range is simply dumb, I'll stash the one loaded gun in the console compartment. Being educated here was very welcome. Don
     
  2. Lt. Donn

    Lt. Donn PSO Survivor. currently in NW Georgia

    Messages:
    9,648
    Likes Received:
    21,179
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    Location:
    NW Georgia
    Not familiar with the CHL laws in Texas, but when in Rome...
     
    Paul53 likes this.

  3. sciolist

    sciolist On the Border

    Messages:
    15,285
    Likes Received:
    17,078
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Location:
    PNW
    So you're saying that when you go to the range, you leave your carry gun at home and substitute a loaded range gun on the drive? Where is your carry gun when you're driving to places other than the range?
     
    Inyo Tim likes this.
  4. mmcbeat

    mmcbeat

    Messages:
    4,162
    Likes Received:
    6,794
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Location:
    Texas
    I carry my concealed gun as normal, other guns are in a range bag in rear footwell.
     
  5. Need4Speed

    Need4Speed

    Messages:
    3,293
    Likes Received:
    9,407
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2014
    Location:
    Central MN
    Wonder if it’s the same here in MN. I routinely yank out my pocket carry 38 and leave it in the open on the passenger seat when I am driving.
     
  6. DonD

    DonD

    Messages:
    11,988
    Likes Received:
    18,199
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2001
    Location:
    Central TX
    No, I always carry a loaded CCW gun at the ready, regardless of what else I might be taking to the range. Often a second, loaded gun.

    But now, unless I want to use a beach towel, rifles will have to go into the trunk in a case. Don
     
  7. sciolist

    sciolist On the Border

    Messages:
    15,285
    Likes Received:
    17,078
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2009
    Location:
    PNW
    I take my carry gun to the range same as I would anywhere else. The guns I'm going to shoot at the range are bagged for ease of transport, but I wouldn't want them just loose in the car. You never know...

    Every once in a while I take a pistol out to the pit for 15 minutes to print sights, chony ammo, etc. Pretty much just the gun and a mag, ear plugs in my pocket. Even then, I put the gun in a pistol sleeve. What if the car dies or I end up first on scene at a wreck? I just don't want the gun banging around completely loose.

    One time I actually did have to flatbed my car back to town from a range trip. That would have been weird without having all my gear in a bag.

    Part of the reason I keep my carry gun on in the car is in case I need to bail out in an emergency, maybe not my emergency. There might be cops around who don't know me. I don't want to be screwing around with a hot/open gun in that situation.

    As a primarily-competition shooter, I'm in the habit of transporting non-carry guns unloaded. Carry gun is always loaded/holstered. Other guns are always unloaded/bagged.
     
  8. Vic Rattlehead

    Vic Rattlehead

    Messages:
    433
    Likes Received:
    780
    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2017
    Are you saying you got stopped and the officer saw that you had a handgun just sitting in the passenger seat out in the open? It was not contained in a closed range back, backpack, briefcase, or duffle bag?

    I have a range bag that I keep pistols in, but it says "Glock- GSSF" on it. Does that mean I need to cover up my range bag with a towel or something?
     
  9. ChuteTheMall

    ChuteTheMall Wallbuilder and Weapon Bearer

    Messages:
    116,203
    Likes Received:
    312,848
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2000
    Location:
    Colluder in Cahoots
    Are the statutes in Texas put into writing, or is it whatever the cop says?

    I'm not very familiar with Texas laws, but even a quick Google search reveals that a shoulder holster would also suffice for open carry in a vehicle. 46.15 (b)(6)

    And, as usual, concealed carry would have prevented this.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2018
  10. DonD

    DonD

    Messages:
    11,988
    Likes Received:
    18,199
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2001
    Location:
    Central TX
    If you're talking to me? It's not at all clear. I was very clear in my comment that I've never been stopped in the 7 yrs I've been in TX, gun or no gun.

    No, if your gun is in a duffle bag, doesn't matter if it says Glock, S&W, Ruger, CZ, FN and on and on, if it's not visible it's OK.

    So, as I said, my recourse is a loaded CCW gun under the flip top cover to the console compartment, any other handguns on the floorboard covered with a towel etc.

    Too, in TX if you have a CHL, you're supposed to inform the officer, makes them less suspicious as it means that you've had a background check, even if it isn't recent. Don
     
  11. DonD

    DonD

    Messages:
    11,988
    Likes Received:
    18,199
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2001
    Location:
    Central TX
    Good God, prevented this? What "this", nothing happened, I got the real skinny from a Sgt Sheriff's Deputy. My CCW/CHL will be in the console from now on.

    Yes, if you have a CHL permit, a shoulder holster is your open carry right in your car, no other way if it's visible. Don
     
  12. DonD

    DonD

    Messages:
    11,988
    Likes Received:
    18,199
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2001
    Location:
    Central TX
    Good God, "prevented this"???? NOTHING happened, prevent what? I clearly said I've never been stopped.

    I got the straight skinny from a friendly Sgt Sheriff's Deputy.

    I'm sure the material is in the statutes somewhere, this also gives me the perspective of an on the street cop, not some lawyerese.

    My position will be to put a loaded CCW into the console compartment where it isn't visible or if it's too large, on the passenger seat covered by a towel. End of the issue. Don
     
  13. Adjuster

    Adjuster

    Messages:
    20,375
    Likes Received:
    12,206
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2006
    Location:
    Port Richey Florida USA
    I thought you just put your guns on the rear window mounted rack?!



    /
     
  14. Ftttu

    Ftttu

    Messages:
    5,711
    Likes Received:
    4,769
    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2011
    Location:
    Canyon Lake, Texas
    46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person:
    (1) intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun or club; and
    (2) is not:
    (A) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or
    (B) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle or watercraft that is owned by the person or under the person's control.
    (a-1) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun in a motor vehicle or watercraft that is owned by the person or under the person's control at any time in which:
    (1) the handgun is in plain view, unless the person is licensed to carry a handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, and the handgun is carried in a shoulder or belt holster;
     
    KWalrad likes this.
  15. Adjuster

    Adjuster

    Messages:
    20,375
    Likes Received:
    12,206
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2006
    Location:
    Port Richey Florida USA
    People just try to make things complicated. I drove across the entire state of Florida last night with two pistols in my front seat. I did throw a towel over them when I went thru the McDonalds drive thru at 12am. No sense in scaring the high school kids.


    /
     
    AdamRodgers likes this.
  16. ChuteTheMall

    ChuteTheMall Wallbuilder and Weapon Bearer

    Messages:
    116,203
    Likes Received:
    312,848
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2000
    Location:
    Colluder in Cahoots
    Isn't that always required for lawful open carry, whether or not in a vehicle?
     
  17. Adjuster

    Adjuster

    Messages:
    20,375
    Likes Received:
    12,206
    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2006
    Location:
    Port Richey Florida USA
    To be honest I was more concerned about the open bottle of vodka laying on the floorboard in front of the front seat!



    /
     
    Fatboy2001 and ChuteTheMall like this.
  18. DonD

    DonD

    Messages:
    11,988
    Likes Received:
    18,199
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2001
    Location:
    Central TX
    Some states like NM consider the car an extension of the home and you can carry a gun openly on you seat and don't need a CCW permit. That's the way it should be. Don
     
  19. capnjim01

    capnjim01

    Messages:
    3,848
    Likes Received:
    1,915
    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2006
    Location:
    East, Texas
    My wife and I were traveling last labor through Texas last Labor Day, from Lufkin to New Braunfels, and had car trouble. We flagged down a couple of young sheriff deputties for help to get the car restarted, bad battery. One of them says he'll jump in the passenger seat an try to get it going and I stopped him and said "officer we have two guns in the car one in each map pocket of the doors".He says no big deal everyone is Texas has a gun but thanked me for informing him. Helped us get it jumped off and then told us where the closest auto store was to get a new battery.Really , LEO's in Texas don't care if you act like you have sense.
     
    Lord and Ftttu like this.
  20. Lunch Meat

    Lunch Meat Tactical Mennonite

    Messages:
    2,404
    Likes Received:
    2,633
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2017
    Location:
    Somewhere out on that horizon
    I think you need to actually read the statutes for your self. Just because a cop pulled something out of his ass doesn't mean it's actually in tbe Texas Revised Code
     
  21. holidaypf

    holidaypf

    Messages:
    573
    Likes Received:
    814
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2018
    Location:
    Texas
    Hey, at least we finally got rid of the stupid knife restrictions in Texas that were originally enacted with the intention of locking up folks from further South or someone a LEO just disliked (ask any ER nurse or doctor - some groups cut while others shoot each other on Saturday nights).
     
  22. Lord

    Lord Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,997
    Likes Received:
    2,064
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Location:
    San Antonio, Texas
    Texas open carry laws and the Motorist Protection Act are very specific when it comes to where and how guns are carried in cars etc.

    Under the Motorist Protection Act, a person who is not excluded from owning or possessing a gun can keep a fully locked and loaded firearm in the vehicle at all times, even if they do not have a License to Carry (formerly concealed handgun license). This law was enacted and referred to "Castle Doctrine" as a 'a man's home is his castle, and that castle (or home) extends to that person's vehicle.' It should be noted that even if you're driving a car that you don't own, and this is referred to as "in your control", the MPA still covers you. You cannot be a passenger, and carry a gun without a license to carry (but I am researching this). The requirement for keeping that firearm in the car is that it simply needs to be out of plain sight, but can be within easy reach of the driver. i.e. center console or even on the seat as long as it's covered and can't be seen.

    The concealed and open carry laws, 30.06 and 30.07 respectively, say that a person with a valid License to Carry, can carry their firearms openly or concealed wherever they have a right to be, and as long as it's not a place where carry is not allowed (schools, polling places, establishments that make 51% or more of their revenue via alcohol sales, courthouses, or any place that is posted with either a 30.06 or 30.07 sign or both). Concealed carry does not have a restriction on where on your body you can carry your weapon, as long as it's concealed.

    Open carry, however, identifies only TWO places on your body that you are allowed to carry:
    1. in a holster, on your hip attached to your belt.
    2. In a shoulder holster, that you are wearing.

    Where the two meet: if you have a License to Carry, and you're in your car where the MPA also applies... the open carry rule STILL applies to shoulder rig or hip holster. End of story. If your intention is to be under the MPA, it MUST be concealed. PERIOD. Open carry is not covered by the Motorist Protection Act at all. So even though you're allowed to have a loaded gun in the car and easy to access, it cannot be seen if you don't have an LTC or in any other location than hip or shoulder rig.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2018
  23. Ftttu

    Ftttu

    Messages:
    5,711
    Likes Received:
    4,769
    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2011
    Location:
    Canyon Lake, Texas
    As you may know, the CHL(outdated law) and the new LTC(current law) in Texas haven't been around for a long time, and the laws relating to them have been changing. Before CHL and LTC, which wasn't really that long ago to me, I could and did arrest for UCW(unlawful carrying weapons) whether or not the handguns were concealed, holstered or in plain view. After CHL/LTC, the law appears to want people to either have their handguns concealed or secured in holsters. But to answer your question, I only know about Texas, and it appears so.

    I remember when the change in the law happened where it was added to the defenses to prosecution a person was able claim was that the person was a peace officer. There was instant hell about that because I could actually arrest my partner sitting next to me for carrying his duty weapon ON DUTY or not, and he can only claim he was carrying it as a peace officer as his defense. Crazy law, but it was changed.
     
  24. Lord

    Lord Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,997
    Likes Received:
    2,064
    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2006
    Location:
    San Antonio, Texas
    thank God the democrats were voted out of the Governor's mansion and common sense took over, right?