[Bren]

Much in the way you can stiff a waitress even though you and her/him never agreed on a price for her service. It's just expected that you'll tip.

Good example - and if you don't tip? You don't owe them anything, because there was no price/contract.

 

[Bado]

This.

If you're a good friend of the father and didnt mention pay...they assumed you didnt want any. It might have been the right thing to do to offer payment...but Im sure they just assumed you are a friend and didnt want any. They didnt mean any harm.

Friends do things for each other, right?

I had a friend bring DJ equipment and play songs i wanted...as well as what she walked down the aisle to.

Another that played sitar at the reception.

And another that sat there with the guest book to make sure people knew to sign.

They didnt expect payment and where happy to help out.

Or maybe they did and they are *****ing on another forum about you stiffing them.:supergrin:

 

[certifiedfunds]

Yes. If you are what I would consider a friend.

If you are an acquaintance then you get a bill.

I live in a small town, with a small group of friends. If you need something within my occupational sector then by all means I will offer my services, for nothing more than a steak and a beer afterwards. I have brought a dozer in and done a weekends worth of dozer work for a friend just because they are a friend. I guess its a perk of being friends with me. But in doing this I also know if their help is needed I dont have to ask but once.

Fair enough.

If it is your occupation you normally get paid for it. That means time is money. If you are doing a gig for free that is a gig you aren't doing for money that you could be. So, if a friend is asking for your professional time, they are asking you for money. I don't ask friends for money.

If you're cool with it, and its your money, that's all that matters. If you do a gig and the friend buys you dinner or at least offers some form of compensation, you're free to decline or accept. In my view the offer is what matters. You've rendered a service.

In the case of the OP I haven't seen an offer. No handshake deal that the kid or his father will return the favor in any fashion nor any offer of compensation. I find it rude at a minimum.

To the OP: I think Pierre! offers the best solution. You receive some compensation, the friend is notified nicely that you delivered a valuable service gratis, the friendship is preserved with no hard feelings and Uncle Sam is deprived of some revenue. Its a win all around.

 

[eracer]

Say "I normally get $X for this type of engagement" and let the chips fall.

If you are a pro, you must be and act like one.

Absolutely! Nowhere in the original post did I read anything that indicated that the OP told the guy his fee for services. Most people don't have ESP, especially when it comes to whether a friend is doing them a favor.

 

[kenpoprofessor]

Much in the way you can stiff a waitress even though you and her/him never agreed on a price for her service. It's just expected that you'll tip.

If it's simply "expected" that you'll tip, the servers would just do the bare minimum and "expect" you to tip. I owe them nothing, their willingness to be a great server determines their tip. Bad service= no tip, great service=great tip. They took the job knowing that the money they earned is dependent on the service they bring, and I've got no sympathy for crap service.

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

 

[Lone_Wolfe]

If it's simply "expected" that you'll tip, the servers would just do the bare minimum and "expect" you to tip. I owe them nothing, their willingness to be a great server determines their tip. Bad service= no tip, great service=great tip. They took the job knowing that the money they earned is dependent on the service they bring, and I've got no sympathy for crap service.

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

Actually I wrote that referring to the vast majority of times the service is at least decent, and we leave an average tip. In fact it's so expected in some areas it's even added into the bill. :steamed: But that's for another thread..........

 

[larry_minn]

Just out of HS I did pics for a couple friends weddings. When PLANNING it (this is a amature photographer/first wedding for 18 yr olds) we talked about when/where/what they wanted/what I needed.... and price. I normally just asked for enough for film/developing. (kinda dates it) Often gave the payment back. Thing is it was talked about.
Such simple things as (in your case) "If you want me to play just one song its $ If you want me to play a half dozen before wedding its a little more (but not much as I have to already be there, set up,prep...) Let me know what songs/if anyone is going to sing with me and I can give you a exact amount"

 

[alexanderg23]

If I asked a friend to play, they would expect or accept payment.

 

[FCastle88]

So, let's see:
"A good friend's son"

"We agreed on songs, points of music in the service. "

You didn't ask for money and he didn't offer any

You paid the wedding and didn't get paid.

Both parties to the contract got what they asked for and both gave what they agreed to give.

Where's the problem?



"Trusting" implies that you took him at his word. Unless you left something out, he made no offer for you to "trust." You haven't said that he failed to live up to his word at any point.

+1 As others have already said, he probably thought that since you were good friends with his father, and you never mentioned payment, that you were doing it as a favor, or maybe he thought his father or the bride's father was paying you.

 

[FCastle88]

Much in the way you can stiff a waitress even though you and her/him never agreed on a price for her service. It's just expected that you'll tip.

The fact that tipping is considered almost mandatory is why service in many restaurants is terrible. People don't want to appear cheap, so they leave a big tip even when they get poor service, which means there's no incentive for the waitress to actually do her job well, which is the whole point of tipping to begin with. I have no problem with tipping 20%-25% if I get good service, but I'm in my mid-twenties and I'll often get ignored for older, wealthier looking costumers because the wait staff assumes they'll leave an extra large tip, and everyone else is is just expected to leave a decent tip anyway. The whole concept of tipping has gotten way out of hand, most bartenders get paid $8-$12 an hour, but they still expect to be tipped as much as waitresses, who get paid almost entirely from tips. Waitresses take the order, and make multiple trips bringing drink refills and the food, but the bartender expects to get the same tip, in addition to his hourly wage, just for handing me a drink, or spending maybe 1 minute tops mixing a drink. How does that make any sense? There was even a thread on here where a few people said they tip their UPS/Fedex driver, who's already getting paid $30 an hour. Tipping either needs to go back to being considered an incentive that needs to be earned, or done away with completely and restaurants, bars, etc., just pay their employees normal wages like other businesses.

 

[Dennis in MA]

I had almost the opposite thing happen several yrs ago. A guy from church in construction was out of work. I had him put some windows in my house.

He wanted hourly. Ok, I said, reluctantly.

He billed me for lunch, going back to HD 3x in one day bc he couldn't make a list and for sitting around waiting for his buddy to show and help.

Arguing over it would have caused a bruhaha in church so I let it go. The first of 3 experiences that have taught me to never hire the well meaning people in church. I'm better off hiring a pro and just handing them a check.

 

[dmjonez]

What does the groom do for a living? Next time you need whatever service/job he performs, ask him for a favor.

 

[F14Scott]

I agree that the time for a financial arrangement is ovWhat;s ier. Suck up the "loss" and learn from the event.

Sidebar - What's the rationale of sole proprietors who charge a fee and then request/expect a tip on top of the fee; it's all going to the same place. There must be some economic advantage to doing this, but it seems weird, to me.

 

[certifiedfunds]

I had almost the opposite thing happen several yrs ago. A guy from church in construction was out of work. I had him put some windows in my house.

He wanted hourly. Ok, I said, reluctantly.

He billed me for lunch, going back to HD 3x in one day bc he couldn't make a list and for sitting around waiting for his buddy to show and help.

Arguing over it would have caused a bruhaha in church so I let it go. The first of 3 experiences that have taught me to never hire the well meaning people in church. I'm better off hiring a pro and just handing them a check.

That's kinda like my soft rule about not doing business with friends.

I say soft rule because I break it on occasion and sometimes business relationships turn into friendships. But I've been burnt on enough occasions to be very careful about it.

 

[GLWyandotte]

You didn't seem to have a business contract with the couple-stop squawking like a beaten seagull.

Well, thanks for the kind words sweetie pie! :wavey:

 

[Wolfgang]

What if you had said: " I'd love to play for your wedding. Normally I get $250.00 for this, but since you are such a close friend, I'll do it for $100.00."

 

[turretg]

I used to shoot Weddings professionally for years. I will not do them anymore because of the hassles some people here described. The money can be good when it works out ...
but nowadays too many bargain hunters and scammers. Contracts are a must.

 

[jp3975]

Or maybe they did and they are *****ing on another forum about you stiffing them.:supergrin:

Then they shouldnt have volunteered to help.:rofl:

 

[686Owner]

The fact that tipping is considered almost mandatory is why service in many restaurants is terrible. People don't want to appear cheap, so they leave a big tip even when they get poor service, which means there's no incentive for the waitress to actually do her job well, which is the whole point of tipping to begin with. I have no problem with tipping 20%-25% if I get good service, but I'm in my mid-twenties and I'll often get ignored for older, wealthier looking costumers because the wait staff assumes they'll leave an extra large tip, and everyone else is is just expected to leave a decent tip anyway. The whole concept of tipping has gotten way out of hand, most bartenders get paid $8-$12 an hour, but they still expect to be tipped as much as waitresses, who get paid almost entirely from tips. Waitresses take the order, and make multiple trips bringing drink refills and the food, but the bartender expects to get the same tip, in addition to his hourly wage, just for handing me a drink, or spending maybe 1 minute tops mixing a drink. How does that make any sense? There was even a thread on here where a few people said they tip their UPS/Fedex driver, who's already getting paid $30 an hour. Tipping either needs to go back to being considered an incentive that needs to be earned, or done away with completely and restaurants, bars, etc., just pay their employees normal wages like other businesses.

Bartenders get a better tip often because people don't want their drinks watered down the next time.