Glock Talk banner
1 - 12 of 12 Posts

·
NRA Life Member
Joined
·
369 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
No I am not asking what I should carry. According to my dept policy "Officers shall have a weapon in their possession when they are not on active duty status as to exercise appropriate authority under the color of law. Then it list the criteria of back up weapons. Caliber .380 to .40 and semi auto only. Must be no larger than your smallest service weapon.
Ok now you have the back ground, my question is this (this is more for the people who have wrote policies and been in command); What would happen if I was carrying my Colt Defender and shot someone robbing a gas station? The standard answer has been, "Your dept will not cover you." What does that mean? I was acting under the color of law. Would the FOP legal defense help? What is the difference if you are at home? If I get awaken one night at 0200 with crashing glass I dont plan on shooting someone with a hand gun I plan on sending .223 rounds that way or some 12 gauge hunks of lead. Would my dept not cover me there? I have always said I not Officer Humor at home I am Papa Bear.
I see a difference in "back up" weapons and "off duty" weapons. One you carry on duty and the other is off duty. The reason I am asking here is I know there is TONS of experience, AND I am still on Probation and dont want them to see me as a trouble maker. I am more curious of what yall have to say. I know that I have rambled for way to long. Thanks :cool:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,951 Posts
There are a multitude of things that could happen to you for utilizing an unauthorized weapon in a shooting.

It all depends on your department (and who is in charge at the time of the shooting), the local Prosecutor or District Attorney in the area the shooting takes place, and the circumstances of the shooting itself.

You could conceivably get the wrong prosecutor, the wrong chief, and the wrong (or questionable circumstances) and end up with a jail sentence. You never know how a jury will react to a prosecuting attorney who doesn't like cops or is looking to make a name for himself. He or she will be putting a negative spin on you, the "gunnut" with an unauthorized weapon who shot and killed little JoJo for strealing money for a sandwich becuase he was hungry. :innocent: :whistling:

I just recently convinced someone I know to get something authorized to carry instead of what he had. Why wouldn't you carry something authorized? You will stand up much better with your department and your Attorney General if you have to shoot somebody with it.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,170 Posts
It wasn't a shooting, but the Department "killed" a friend of mine. It concerned a situation where the Department backed away and said they were not going to cover him civilly or in a court of law. That said, he lost his job, he lost his house, his wife and kids, and soon thereafter, he died a broken man.

When I hear these Rambo types talk about rather being tried by 12 than carried by 6, I always think about Paul and wonder if he would think likewise.
 

·
NRA Life Member
Joined
·
369 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the advise. I will stick with my two approved off duty weapons.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,170 Posts
Ralphumor;11471514 said:
Thanks for the advise. I will stick with my two approved off duty weapons.
The rule they always taught me is that if you follow Department Policy, most civil lawsuits go after the Department for damages and compensation. If you go "off the reservation," they go after the officer as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,115 Posts
When you have a OIS, especially an off duty OIS you've got enough to worry about without adding a policy violation. Besides, its not the weapon that wins gunfights, its tactics and marksmanship.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,771 Posts
SAR;11470395 said:
...When I hear these Rambo types talk about rather being tried by 12 than carried by 6, I always think about Paul and wonder if he would think likewise.
Yeah, lots of bravado out there. I was a defendant in a federal trial (use of deadly force situation). Dept picked up the tab for two (really two plus one part time) attorneys for six months. We won, they didn't get squat. You do the numbers on what that bill would have been if I was the guy paying the freight.
 

·
Pretty Ladies!
Joined
·
4,983 Posts
I've had this conversation dozens of times with our range officer. We're limited to Glock 9mm or .40, on- duty or off. A lot of guys gripe about it. A lot of guys carry whatever they want. I admit to carrying a Kel- Tec P32 on occasion, especially during the summer when wearing shorts. Most of the time I'm carrying either a G23 or a G26 off- duty.

There are so many ways to "what if" this issue. I live outside my jurisdiction. If I get into something off- duty, I can't claim color of authority anyway, so what difference does it make what I carry outside of Fayette County? I had a CCDW before I became a cop and I've maintained it ever since. Of course, I could CCDW on my badge as well.

Range officer's opinion is that since I used my POPS certification to renew my CCDW for free the last time I did it, they could come after me anyway. That seems pretty weak to me, especially if I'm outside of my jurisdiction.

I think the policy should be loosened in order to encourage more people to carry off- duty. There are a lot of thin, single stack 9mm and .380 pistols out there. Why not set some general parameters and let folks get them since Glock apparently has no intention of building one?

At the end of the day, the prudent thing to do is abide by your agency's requirements while working to change them. Unfortunately at my department that probably means somebody is either going to have to get killed because they weren't carrying or somebody is going to have to use an unapproved weapon.
 

·
Unfair Facist
Joined
·
30,105 Posts
THe only requirements on off duty weapons should be that it is a good quality firearm and the officer can qualify with it.

I also do not like the "One size fits all" mentality of many departments that mandate ONE weapon for all officers. if an officer wants to buy his own sidearm and have it inspected by the Dept. armorer and shows he can qualify with it. then he should be allowed to carry his choice of weapon rather than a dept. mandated one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,086 Posts
Dragoon44;11527938 said:
THe only requirements on off duty weapons should be that it is a good quality firearm and the officer can qualify with it.

I also do not like the "One size fits all" mentality of many departments that mandate ONE weapon for all officers. if an officer wants to buy his own sidearm and have it inspected by the Dept. armorer and shows he can qualify with it. then he should be allowed to carry his choice of weapon rather than a dept. mandated one.
We just chased that mess down after an OIS. It used to be any gun from an approved list of manufacturers in 9, .40, or .45, as long as it passed armorer inspection. The insurance company FREAKED when they heard it was a personally owned firearm. Because whoever at my department that was conversing with them at the time has no testicles, they mumbled something stupid, and immediately started trying to waste $50k on buying Glocks for everyone. Now the insurance company is happy, but we have equipment falling apart around us. Have nice shiny new Glocks that replaced perfectly good weapons, but we can't afford to fix my freaking light bar.

Sorry, didn't mean for that to turn into a rant.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,170 Posts
Pepper45;11530375 said:
We just chased that mess down after an OIS. It used to be any gun from an approved list of manufacturers in 9, .40, or .45, as long as it passed armorer inspection. The insurance company FREAKED when they heard it was a personally owned firearm. Because whoever at my department that was conversing with them at the time has no testicles, they mumbled something stupid, and immediately started trying to waste $50k on buying Glocks for everyone. Now the insurance company is happy, but we have equipment falling apart around us. Have nice shiny new Glocks that replaced perfectly good weapons, but we can't afford to fix my freaking light bar.

Sorry, didn't mean for that to turn into a rant.
Our Department issues us a primary weapon. As far as they are concerned, you can carry that primary weapon off-duty or any other time you see fit. If you want something smaller, it's up to you to purchase it from a list of approved off-duty weapons. One good thing is that our City is self-insured, so there is no insurance company to freak out.
 
1 - 12 of 12 Posts
Top