[Haham]

If you were living in XYZ city, and you absolutely decided you WERE going to obtain and keep a weapon in your home for self-defense (even knowing this is illegal), which one of the following would you get?

I ask, because I am under the impression (I could be right or wrong here), that among the following weapon types, one may be LESS of a penalty if you were caught:

1) Centerfire handgun

2) Centerfire rifle (i.e. AR-15 type)

3) Pump shotgun

4) *Rimshot* rifle, I.E. .22 GSG-5 or a 10/22 (and yes, I understand about the “no hi-cap mags” laws.)

It's an interesting "legal" question. Again, this is only from a theoretical legal standpoint, not a "which one is better" for defense. I am not seeking legal advice.

best,
Robert

 

[COLOSHOOTR]

Violating the law is violating the law period no matter what illegal weapon you pick. I don't know NY law and don't feel like looking it up but you'll be punished the same for a handgun as you would for a shotgun or rifle if they are all considered illegal. It's like asking whats form of cocaine should you do crack or powder.... Illegal either way you look at it!

I wouldn't push it and would refrain from any threads asking about what way to best violate the law even if they are only theoretical questions.

 

[LawScholar]

If you are in any way soliciting aid to commit an illegal act, I strongly advise that you discontinue your actions.

I also disclaim that my input is not that of a licensed lawyer practicing under the bar in the state of New York.

I STRONGLY ADVISE AGAINST BREAKING ANY LAW FOR ANY REASON.

This is the law on point, from New York State Chart XI, McKinney's Sentence Charts:

<table width="100%"><tbody><tr><td class="DocumentBody" style="vertical-align: top;text-align: left;padding: 0px 0.18in 0px 0px;border-bottom: 1px solid black;" width="33.3%">Loaded firearm, in home or business, but firearm is an &#8220;assault weapon&#8221;:
</td> <td class="DocumentBody" style="vertical-align: top;text-align: left;padding: 0px 0.18in 0px 0px;border-bottom: 1px solid black;" width="32.2%">CPW-2. C violent felony. [PL 265.03(3)].
</td> <td style="text-align:left;border-bottom: 1px solid black;" width="34.4%">
</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="DocumentBody" style="vertical-align: top;text-align: left;padding: 0px 0.18in 0px 0px;border-bottom: 1px solid black;" width="33.3%">Other loaded firearm in home or business
</td> <td class="DocumentBody" style="vertical-align: top;text-align: left;padding: 0px 0.18in 0px 0px;border-bottom: 1px solid black;" width="32.2%">CPW-4. A misdemeanor. [PL 265.01(1); 265.03(3)].
</td></tr></tbody></table>

 

[Haham]

Oh please people, relax. It is theoretical question. I don't even live in that city. The same question can be argued in Chicago which also has DIFFERENT penalties for DIFFERENT crimes (i.e. owning one weapon vs. another). Just forget it.

 

[LawScholar]

Oh please people, relax. It is theoretical question. I don't even live in that city. The same question can be argued in Chicago which also has DIFFERENT penalties for DIFFERENT crimes (i.e. owning one weapon vs. another). Just forget it.

Did you even read my whole post? I answered your question.

 

[Haham]

I did, and thank you for your quick response. This question was argued today at work by a man from California who said that at one time CA had a firearm law that differentiated rimfire weapons from centerfire, but that was before 1994.

 

[Calico Jack]

Oh please people, relax. It is theoretical question. I don't even live in that city. The same question can be argued in Chicago which also has DIFFERENT penalties for DIFFERENT crimes (i.e. owning one weapon vs. another). Just forget it.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

 

[LawScholar]

I did, and thank you for your quick response. This question was argued today at work by a man from California who said that at one time CA had a firearm law that differentiated rimfire weapons from centerfire, but that was before 1994.

New York does not appear to differentiate between the two, except in the case where a weapon is classified as an "assault" weapon (I believe all such classified weapons are centerfire rather than rimfire, but that's not the basis upon which they are differentiated).

California Penal Code did, and does, have penalties which only apply if the caliber is greater than .22LR (West's Annotated California Penal Code, 12276.5)

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

I agree with you in principle, and it looks good underlined and bolded.

Unfortunately it is not the law anymore.

The Supreme Court has ruled that "reasonable regulation" is Constitutional, in Heller applied to the federal government and in McDonald as applied to the states.

The legislature cannot overrule SCOTUS on Constitutional matters. The Supreme Court is the final arbiter on any issues of Constitutional interpretation.

Short of another Amendment specifying specifically that no type of regulation is acceptable, "shall not be infringed" is not good law anymore. Nor is the "militia" component.

Specifically, reasonable regulation including carry and magazine-capacity regulation does not constitute "infringement" according to SCOTUS.

I don't agree with the law, but it IS the law, and will be for a while, possibly forever.

 

[Haham]

Hi,

Is the California law quoted in "West's" online?? I searched but could not find it. I would like to print it and bring it to work. Thanks again.

best,
Robert

 

[LawScholar]

Hi,

Is the California law quoted in "West's" online?? I searched but could not find it. I would like to print it and bring it to work. Thanks again.

best,
Robert

I have access to West as a law student.

Silly as it sounds, the three searches I did to find it, and to print it off, would cost a non-law-student $350. That's why I never posted entire sections or significant chunks. That would not be okay for me to do. Sorry. You may be able to find it on California's web page.

 

[Haham]

You wrote: (California Penal Code did, and does, have penalties which only apply if the caliber is greater than .22LR (West's Annotated California Penal Code, 12276.5))

That is exactly what "I think" the man brought up today at work. I will track it down, thanks again.

 

[LawScholar]

You wrote: (California Penal Code did, and does, have penalties which only apply if the caliber is greater than .22LR (West's Annotated California Penal Code, 12276.5))

That is exactly what "I think" the man brought up today at work. I will track it down, thanks again.

Haha no problem! Thank you for understanding that I have a pretty rigid honor code I'm sworn to!

 

[Haham]

A lawyer with integrity !!! Ok, that's cool, call me when you are running for Senate and I will vote for you.

goodnight

 

[ADK_40GLKr]

If you were living in XYZ city, and you absolutely decided you WERE going to obtain and keep a weapon in your home for self-defense (even knowing this is illegal), which one of the following would you get?

I ask, because I am under the impression (I could be right or wrong here), that among the following weapon types, one may be LESS of a penalty if you were caught:

1) Centerfire handgun

2) Centerfire rifle (i.e. AR-15 type)

3) Pump shotgun

4) *Rimshot* rifle, I.E. .22 GSG-5 or a 10/22 (and yes, I understand about the “no hi-cap mags” laws.)

It's an interesting "legal" question. Again, this is only from a theoretical legal standpoint, not a "which one is better" for defense. I am not seeking legal advice.

best,
Robert

Although it doesn't spell out penalties, this site might be of interest to you:
http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/nyc.aspx

 

[ViennaGambit]

A handgun in NYC is mandatory 3 years prison sentence... not worth it.

Generic 26" vent rib 870 express all the way - very "friendly" & easier to explain and you dont get a better HD weapon than a shotgun.

There is a law in NYC that you can keep a rifle/shotgun for 72 hours on your premises without a permit or notifying local precinct if you are intending on traveling or flying with it...

But rules are rules and illegal is illegal - get pepper spray and a machete - they are both legal and more people are killed worldwide each year BY FAR with a machete or 8" chef knife than any other weapon including firearms...
.

 

[american lockpicker]

Back when I was a teen apparently it was illegal for me to have a handgun but that didn't stop me. I started off with sawn offs as I already had long guns and they were easily convertable with basic hand tools, later I got a Raven 25 as it was cheap and eventually I moved up to used Glocks, Walther P1, Norinco 213, Miroku 38(it actually belonged to the ex chief of police of Parkersburg before I bought it from his grandson :rofl and a HK machine pistol. Then I turned 21 and could buy in shops...

Really though if your breaking a law by having a gun you might as well go all the way and get something NFA like an Uzi, Mac, or underfolder AK in full auto.

 

[bustedknee]

The media loves to say things like high-powered rifle!

So, sure, a jury can be influenced by the type of gun.

 

[Sgt_Gold]

I'm a NY resident and pretty familiar with the gun laws in both NYC, (which is why I moved), and NYS. Here's a few things not already covered.

Pistol grip shotguns are illegal in NYC.

We still have an AWB, and any post Sept 1994 magazine is limited to 10 rounds. Possession of a post ban high cap magazine is a felony.

NYS recently changed the law on illegal handguns. Possession in the home is no longer a felony, but the misdemeanor will forever disqualify you from getting a pistol license.

Any rifle that can hold more then five rounds is illegal in NYC. NYPD makes on the spot decisions when you try to license a long arm that they have never heard of.

There is more stupidity than you can shake a stick at when it comes to gun law in NYC\NYS. It's the main reason I never put in for a NYC pistol license.

 

[LawScholar]

I'm a NY resident and pretty familiar with the gun laws in both NYC, (which is why I moved), and NYS. Here's a few things not already covered.

Pistol grip shotguns are illegal in NYC.

We still have an AWB, and any post Sept 1994 magazine is limited to 10 rounds. Possession of a post ban high cap magazine is a felony.

NYS recently changed the law on illegal handguns. Possession in the home is no longer a felony, but the misdemeanor will forever disqualify you from getting a pistol license.

Any rifle that can hold more then five rounds is illegal in NYC. NYPD makes on the spot decisions when you try to license a long arm that they have never heard of.

There is more stupidity than you can shake a stick at when it comes to gun law in NYC\NYS. It's the main reason I never put in for a NYC pistol license.

Good. LORD.

I have an AR-15 with two loaded 30-round Magpul magazines in the trunk of my car to go to the range after classes.

I'm like a three-felony offender in NY.

Sad thing is, girlfriend is aiming at top microbiology Ph.D programs in Maryland and New York (Johns Hopkins in Baltimore and ??? in Rochester).

I can't decide which will be worse on my shooting hobby

 

[Sgt_Gold]

Good. LORD.

I have an AR-15 with two loaded 30-round Magpul magazines in the trunk of my car to go to the range after classes.

I'm like a three-felony offender in NY.

Sad thing is, girlfriend is aiming at top microbiology Ph.D programs in Maryland and New York (Johns Hopkins in Baltimore and ??? in Rochester).

I can't decide which will be worse on my shooting hobby

I could go on forever but I'll give you two actual issues a friend of mine ran across trying to register firearms.

My friend is a competitive shooter. He wanted to register a S&W Model 52 on his pistol license. Part of the procedure in getting a gun on your license is you have to bring the gun to One Police Plaza so they can verify the serial number and make sure you're not trying to slip one by them. The NYPD refused to allow him to register the pistol because they said there was no semi auto pistol that is chambered in .38 special wadcutter. They didn't want to even see the gun because they didn't want to believe it existed. He won this round because he knew other shooters with M52's, and was able to show the NYPD that they had registered them in the past.

Same friend wanted a target quality air rifle to train indoors. Because he has so many guns he didn't want to risk running a foul on any NYC regulations. He asked what to do about the air rifle and was told he had to put it on his long arm license. The licensing bureau would not register the air rifle because it didn't meet the definition of a firearm. He moved later that year.