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Discussion in 'Black Rifle Forum' started by TheDud, May 4, 2012.
I'll agree with you on that.
I think the Sport is the best option in that price range for it's intended purpose.
The gun club I belong to has one of these. It's the rental AR. It came from the box into service no mods or optics. It has passed many hands, noobs, kids, woman, old people, even a few LEO's & fired many thousands of rounds & doesn't get cleaned much. It has also sat outside in a locked shed every time the range is open in 85 degree heat & humidity & rain. It looks a little beat & scratched up yes but functions just fine & has needed only a new extractor & buffer spring. It started to chew up the case rims & have extraction issues. Not sure what rounds count was.
I really don't see a problem with the S&W Sport. If you want to spend a ton of money to be cool and run and gun with the hi-speed, low drag crowd, go for it. If you want a basic AR for self defense, and/or to play with at the range then the Sport is a good value and a good choice.
Just because you have a DC and FA doesn't mean you have to spend a lot more on the gun. That's a concept that seems missed on this thread.
It's really simple.
The Sport does not come with a DC/FA.
It retails for $650.
It's a very reliable rifle.
It's a remarkably accurate rifle.
1:8 twist gobbles up a wide array of bullet weights.
It's all mil-spec measurements allow for any mods you can put on a typical AR.
There aren't many ARs at that price.
There are plenty of ARs with DC/FA for a few hundred more.
Many of those rifles do not feature the quality of the Sport.
If you are familiar with ARs, and want an inexpensive rifle for the range/practice, that will devour the crappiest, nastiest ammo out there, this is a great buy. Will save you the wear and tear on your LMTs, Noveskes, etc...
If you are just getting into the AR scene, looking to get your first without blowing the bank, you'd be hard pressed to find a better deal. IMO, you simply WON'T find a better deal. Leave it as it comes, or build the hell out of it as you get familiar with the platform.
This AR delivers, and is a ton of fun.
So there it is, in a nutshell.
But you are not getting a gun backed by a manufacturer with a history like S&W. You are not getting a lifetime warranty. Sure, you could build a PSA rifle for about the same cost. But it is not a factory rifle, does not have the same level of customer support and service, and frankly, they have not been around long enough to make it worth while to go to them for the price. S&W has been around since the mid 1800's. For a first AR, some find comfort in purchasing a factory rifle with a long standing manufacturer to back the product.
I didn't want to build one. I wanted to go to the store, purchase a rifle, and go shoot. I may go the build route on the next one, but for now, I am still learning what I like and what I don't.
Bang the buttstock on the ground and problem is solved.
Of course this would work on an M16/AR15 with a real buttstock instead of the cute flopsy collapsible whatever.
You have Bud's selling double star rifles for $659 (you'll need a rear site ($30-150). Seeing deals like this is what makes me question why on the m&p sport. They haven't been in the gun industry as long as S&W but have been making ARs and other contract parts for 20 years+.
If the warranty is that important then I understand, as S&W has a great warranty.
$659 + $20 (non-cash purchase so you don't get the discount) + $25 transfer fee + $50 magpul rear sight = $754 which is more than I paid for the Sport. I was able to handle the Sport prior to purchasing at a local shop as well. I have not seen a Double Star at a local shop. Bud's doesn't give much info about the rifle. What is the twist rate? Is it chrome lined?
A quick review on the net and there is less love for the Double Star than there is for the Sport...
What is it about the Sport that you just don't understand or like? Is it just your preference to have the FA and dust cover?
Honestly I see no reason to have the DC & FA on an AR. I agree they are hold overs from the M16. You better believe that the gov just left them on there for the sake of $. It would cost too much to delete them.
If there was a Special Olympics for gear review - Nutnfancy would be the Michael Phelps of those games.
It's just that. I like the 2 features. I've not had to use the DC but I have used the FA where it came in really handy (read a few posts back). Then again I'm a gadget guy when it comes to guns. I love sks rifles with folding bayonets, nagant revolvers, and mysterious bags of accessories that come with surplus rifles.
I think if one was to go with the Double Star rifle, they are giving up some quality that the Sport offers to get a forward assist and dust cover. Quality in areas such as HPT/MPI bolt in the Sport, not sure on the Double Star. Also, the melonited barrel of the Sport vs. plain barrel, without a treatment or chrome lining on the Double Star. I think these features on the Sport trump the dust cover and forward assist at the same price range. There are other ways to clear the malfunction you described that would be preferred, unless in combat. If you are on a two way range, then you do whatever you got to do to get back into the fight.
Cypher, I served in Iraq for 14 months and don't remember ever having to use my FA on my M-4.
They (DS) batch test their bolts if memory serves me correctly. I must have gotten bad info somewhere, but the last time I remember reading about S&W was that they weren't considered milspec by the "milspec" crowd (M&P15T). So that had me thinking the sport was on the same page minus those feature.
The M&P line isn't 100% mil-spec. The original M&P15T used 4140 in the barrel. The bolt is a semi auto bolt, but is HPT/MPI. Also uses a CAR buffer instead of a heavier buffer. The M&P line isn't considered top tier by the the mil-spec crowd, but it is considered as a capable rifle. I think the question with the most of the top of the M&P line is why buy it when you can get a mil-spec Colt at the same price, and I would agree there, but with the Sport we are not in the same price range. I don't view mil-spec as being the be all, end all requirements for an AR. Many of those specs are what they are to support full auto or sustained rates of fire, which is not my intended use. The Sport meets my needs, and didn't require as much cash layout.
Basically, with the Sport you are getting the same bolt and BCG as the rest of the M&P line. You are getting a barrel with a faster twist rate, 1:8, and melonited vs a chrome lined 1:9 twist rate. (Some of the newer models are coming with the 1:8 melonited barrel and using 4150 CMV instead of the 4140 Smith used in the past, but none of the S&W barrels are mil-spec). They left off the dust cover and FA, and no heat shields in the hand guards. I guess they figured most would change the hand guards to Magpul or something else anyway, so it was a good place to scrimp. The trigger guard on the Sport is also part of the forged lower, and it is enlarged for shooting with gloves. Follows the same line as if you put the Magpul enlarged trigger guard on an AR. They must be doing something right, since stores can't keep them in stock.
That makes it a more clear on the S&W. Thanks! My step father recently bought one, so I'll be shooting it in about 2 weeks