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No Refusal DWI Checkpoints

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Random, Dec 28, 2012.

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  1. Jonesee

    Jonesee

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    It sounds more like you "USE" the laws in addition to following them.

    I'm not here to bash you or argue with you. I'm not one of those guys.

    Your post is worrisome. We can leave it at that.
     
  2. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    Wow, not even close to what I posted.
     

  3. Random

    Random AtticRat

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    Now that I'm in the contract world I don't have a badge anymore. Got a State Department ID but I've never tried to use it to get out of a stop.

    My biggest problem with the DWI checkpoints is more fundamental. It's a papers check. I've seen the arrests and fines they make off of them. Maybe one dui arrest in the bunch. The rest are fines and 'justified searches'. Walk up and ask me if I've been drinking. Fine. Why are you checking my brake tag, running my insurance, and my license? THAT is no longer a DWI checkpoint. You're calling it one to make it easier for the public to support/swallow, but if you're using it to check whether I look like I should be in that neighborhood, have expired insurance, have a warrant, or if I've paid my vehicle tax that year it is something else.

    Saying a DWI checkpoint is about stopping drunk drivers is like saying smoking laws are put in place to protect you from cancer.
     
  4. DanaT

    DanaT Pharaoh

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    When you can say that YOU can be inconvenienced, or suspected of doing something, because of someone else, yes, it is close. Once the individual is marginalized, then the rights of an individual no longer matter. If it is not close, how can you morally justify that checking me for something that you have no reason to suspect me of doing is not marginalizing the individual?
     
  5. DanaT

    DanaT Pharaoh

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    HE already explained. :rofl::rofl: It's not about YOU.
     
  6. Random

    Random AtticRat

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    You really got me on that one. Picture looks just like me. :rofl:

    Your understanding of how the law should work is sound, but sadly you're misunderstanding how it is being used.
    As it currently stands you can stand there stone cold sober with no evidence to the contrary. Your sober refusal to submit to a breathalyzer is being used as the (only) probable cause for them to take you into custody, restrain you, and draw your blood against your will.

    While I enjoyed your whigger picture you are mistaken. Twice.
     
  7. Kingarthurhk

    Kingarthurhk Isaiah 53:4-9

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    Again, not it.
     
  8. Random

    Random AtticRat

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    I've never understood why some people are proud when they choose ignorance. "Well, the book said something I didn't like. I stopped reading right there."

    I've only seen that behavior in 3 types of people.

    1) The ultra-religious
    2) The ultra-political
    3) The ultra-'patriotic'

    Now, I'm gonna be stuck wondering which one you are.
     
  9. F14Scott

    F14Scott Luggage CLM

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    Serious question. Instead of casting the net of random checkpoints that ensnare plenty of people who haven't been drinking, why don't LEOs conduct surveillance of a bar each weekend. Post an officer with a radio near the parking lot, have him ID drunks driving off the lot, and have a pre-staged cruiser follow the drunk until he commits a moving violation, then stop him and get him.

    The operation could move from bar to bar, even on a published schedule, so no one business could complain about unfair targeting.

    Seems like shooting fish in a barrel is better than casting the net.
     
  10. DanaT

    DanaT Pharaoh

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    Explain it to me then. What moral justification do you have to stop me with ZERO probable cause that I have done anything wrong. A check point is ZERO probable cause.

    You will notice I said moral. Not legal. Because some judges have interpreted laws in a manner consistent with trampling individual liberty does not in fact make them moral.

    This guy did nothing "illegal" either. Everyone of his actions were approved by judges and he was acting within the law. History is full of many other people just like him who were acting in a "legal" manner but legal was not the same as moral. Shall I start a list for you?

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Bruce M

    Bruce M

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    That may be how it is happening or it may be your opinion of how it is happening. At least around here the refusal with no other evidence is not sufficient to get to the point where blood is forcibly drawn. Do you by chance have any cases in which blood was forced based solely on the refusal?
     
  12. WarCry

    WarCry

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    Have you - honestly - been pulled aside for a breathalyzer? Because I find that incredibly hard to believe if you weren't first showing some other indication - slurred speech, smell of alcohol, etc - first. As was noted, a breathalyzer isn't just a random test they break out "just in case", it's to confirm prior suspicions.

    Louisiana has the implied consent, though. As so as your request and sign your name to a driver's license, you a consenting to that breathalyzer every time you turn the key. By trying to refuse, you've already violated a contract that you set up with the state, because when you signed it, you said "yes, sir, Mr. Office of Motor Vehicles, I agree that I will do these tests any time I'm asked."

    If you didn't read the fine print, go turn in your license now and I guarantee you shouldn't ever be asked at a checkpoint like that again. See how easy that is?

    Your other course of action is to work through the government to remove the implied consent law. I wish you luck, and until that happens, if you drive and they say blow, you blow.

    YOU agreed to it, no one's forcing you.
     
  13. harlenm

    harlenm Millennium Member

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    Is it a CT thing to announce the dates, times and locations of dwi or seatbelt checks ahead of time, or is that standard practice in other places?

    posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
     
  14. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    How about those on the road after drinking at private homes?
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  15. fjrdc

    fjrdc

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    Remember Driving IS a privlidge NOT a right. When you sign your name on the application you ARE agreeing to follow ALL the rules and laws that govern. As for refusing the test.. it's called implied consent (Remember What YOU signed):whistling:
     
  16. Jonesee

    Jonesee

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    Like speeding or any other crime, you are not going to catch everyone. But if you are looking for drug dealers I would say you need to look in those areas where they are known to congregate. Same for drunk drivers. If reducing hazard to the public is the real goal. It would make sense to go where you have the greatest impact.

    In business it is called utilizing your resources for their highest and best use.

    Those driving after drinking at a private residence are still on the street and bound to pass a policeman on the way hom anyway.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  17. Jonesee

    Jonesee

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    Actually where I am from (Florida). You can get a drunk driving charge on a bicycle or on a boat and neither require a license.

    You haven't signed or agreed to anything to operate either but the charge still stands as well as the rules of evidence etc.

    No implied consent as far as I can see when I climb on a bike. But it happens.

    And a drunk on a bike is not a true hazard to the general public.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  18. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    Let me get this straight - are you claiming, in other posts, that you were once a police officer? because just this paragraph is enough to know you are either lying or you had no legal training at all.

    Here's a hint: if the police were arresting people and getting search warrants on the evidence you claim, we'd know, because the trouble the police and judges would be in would be all over CNN. Louisiana doesn't get to define "probable cause" and, if they do, they have to answer to the federal courts.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012
  19. fjrdc

    fjrdc

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    Here,( Minnesoota) on a bike, lawn tractor,boat, horse, snowmobile. You don't need a licence for any of them but your DL will be affected by a OWI conviction:wow:
     
  20. TBO

    TBO Why so serious? CLM

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    Remember the schtick of the online community:

    - If something is legal, you must support it, no matter how uncomfortable it makes you, or how much you dislike it.

    Checkpoints are legal /]

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using Copatalk 2
     
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