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No Refusal DWI Checkpoints

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Random, Dec 28, 2012.

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  1. certifiedfunds

    certifiedfunds Tewwowist

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    Clearly sober drivers are a far greater danger than drunk drivers.

    With statistics like that it makes me wonder how many of those deaths involving drivers over the 0.08 limit would have happened anyway. In other words, just because a driver with a BAC of 0.08 was involved we can't automatically assume that the BAC was the cause of the accident or even a significant contributing factor. Certainly in a % of those cases it was simply "a factor".

    How can one find out how many fatalities are the direct result of a drunk driver?
     
  2. MAC702

    MAC702 Senior Member

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    HOW FAR over that limit?

    I'd like to know how many drivers under 0.10% are killing people.

    Lowering the standard from 0.10% to 0.08% was all about the money.

    How many arrests are made for drivers between 0.08% and 0.10%?

    I am NOT advocating drinking and driving.
     

  3. MAC702

    MAC702 Senior Member

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    Let's continue to ignore my point, shall we?

    You should not be randomly stopped to check for documents or other non-observed offenses.

    Do you or do you not agree?
     
  4. TBO

    TBO Why so serious? CLM

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    MAC,

    What is your knowledge of the law and court rulings in this area?
     
  5. Random

    Random AtticRat

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    Let's see if I can catch back up.

    1) Last NOLA cop I asked did say checkpoints were overtime for them

    2) They used to post the "success" of the big checkpoints in the paper. I'll see if I can find it this time around. It is interesting reading. Maybe one dui taken into custody, a few dozen expired tags (fines), a few expired or suspended licenses(they let them DRIVE away, but give them a fine and a summons...yeah, I'm not joking), several drug possessions (taken into custody), a few warrants for outstandings(?), a few for brakelights and whatnot.

    3) Bren, no I'm not a cop. I'm a fireman. I did have a brief employment in N. Texas, but I don't believe I've ever mentioned that here.

    4) Rolling your window down partly and passing your papers through it will not work here. Especially if you are under 25 years old. Your window will be broken and you will be pulled out through it.

    5) Sadly, I must repeat YES, choosing not to take the breathalyzer on the side of the road is all they've been using to justify taking your blood forcibly. A couple of you are stuck in good guy mode and find it tough to swallow, but I have seen it happen more than once.

    6) Bren said: "Here's a hint: if the police were arresting people and getting search warrants on the evidence you claim, we'd know, because the trouble the police and judges would be in would be all over CNN. Louisiana doesn't get to define "probable cause" and, if they do, they have to answer to the federal courts. "

    That's so cool that you think that and I wish that was the way things actually worked. Oversight and accountability for the police AND the judges. Nah, man. Haven't seen it. But I have seen a cop punch a driver in the mouth because the driver said "Hey, you're kind of short". Saw that one the first time we provided lighting for a checkpoint. It was... eye-opening. Pulled the guy out of the car and then told him to walk a straight line. The punch drunk dazed guy then couldn't so he got arrested for dui. Blood came back negative. No charges for the cop or driver.




    **It may look like I'm trying to create a thread to rile people up, then I disappear for hours when they ask me a question. I'm not being evasive. The time difference in Iraq just puts me on the forum when everyone else is asleep. I miss all the action and good debate**
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  6. Sharky7

    Sharky7 Boomshakalaka

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    This is not true. Understanding and having a working knowledge of basic search and seizure laws would help you understand this more.

    Seems like plenty of other people have tried to explain it to you - but you seem to want to believe something that is not true.

    1.) There must be an arrest to request the search warrant for blood.
    2.) In order for there to be an arrest, probable cause for that arrest must be established.
    3.) Simply refusing field sobriety tests or a portable breathalyzer does not rise to probable cause for arrest.
     
  7. goldenlight

    goldenlight

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    This.

    Mouthing off to a LEO, even in a small way, is just plain stupid. I was told, by MANY different people, to say 'yes sir', and 'no sir'. Answer questions, as simply as possible. Don't say anything you don't need to. If you haven't been drinking, he'll let you go. He'll let you go quicker if you don't mouth off to him.
     
  8. Random

    Random AtticRat

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    I respect your passionate defense, but you are now telling me that I have not seen what I have seen. I've sat on the bumper and had officers tell me that that is what they are doing. I've been told that everyone in line was a suspected drunk driver and that that was their probable cause until proven otherwise.

    Much like Bren, you are stating how the law is intended to be used. I can almost envy the world you guys must live in.
     
  9. NOLA_glock

    NOLA_glock Shrug Life

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    :rofl: Do we even have DWI checkpoints in the city? I've honestly never even seen one here.

    I've been through them in St John parish, Hammond, and Baton Rouge, and I'm hardly in those places at drinking time.
     
  10. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    Keeping people impaired by alcohol off the road, of course.

    What did you think I meant?
     
  11. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    Random, read this blog piece by
    a DUI/DWI attorney here DWI mandatory blood testing.

    Two sentences from the piece...
    It seems in Louisiana they are well organized against impaired drivers.

    You are saying that they are asking drivers without alcohol on their breath, who are not slurring their speech, who exhibit no physical symptoms of having alcohol on board to submit to a breathalyzer test. A good DWI/DUI attorney in LA should be able to beat that.
     
  12. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    Can you elaborate a bit on the part I put in red?

    You provide the lighting at DUI/DWI check points in Louisiana?

    You are making money providing services to law enforcement agencies conducting these check points?
     
  13. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    While providing the lighting for the check point...
    Probable cause to do what?
    What proof would that be?
     
  14. JLB768

    JLB768 Old & Grumpy Lifetime Member

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    No, I don't hate them, what I did hate, was watching my Mom and Grandmother sobbing over the fact that someone killed him. And to make it worse, left him like an animal laying in the road, to be run over a second time. Around here, we have state police, sheriff, and city, so even if there is a checkpoint, there are still police patroling. Late for dinner? My Uncle has been late for dinner, since 1988. I suspect that if the police make you late for dinner, you'll be able to warm it in the microwave...
     
  15. Bill Lumberg

    Bill Lumberg BTF Inventor

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    :rofl:You wouldn't know whether they were or not. Don't drink and drive and you're good to go.
     
  16. airmotive

    airmotive Tin Kicker

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    Slippery slope.
    Thousands of people use similar arguments to justify taking away all your assault weapons.

    I'm sorry for your loss, but don't do warrantless searches on me because of it. Next time, it will be a warrantless search of your house looking for assault weapons, while the news does nothing but replay video of a grieving mother who lost all 14 of her children in a drive-by.
     
  17. Random

    Random AtticRat

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    Certain fire trucks have light arrays on them. Some have towers that go up on a telescoping pole and most have portable directional lights that you can place on the ground. They can be plugged into the fire truck or the generator kept on the truck. On a few occassions the local pd has asked for fd assistance in providing light at some of their checkpoints. Not much to it, really. Once it's all set up you either sit in the truck all anti-social like or you sit on the large front bumper of the fire truck. If no cars are lined up you talk with the cops. You pay attention to what the people around you are doing and saying. You see how they choose who they're gonna wave through without stopping. You see who they push for a vehicle search based on what they look like. You listen to them verbal judo their way into searches. It gets predictable after a while.
    **Let's see if I can explain this without messing it up: That was where I got to see the difference in the way younger people were treated in some police interactions. I thought being black was bad on a traffic stop. Holy cow, try being a kid. I've seen cops tell kids all sorts of lies and threats to get them to forfeit their rights and capitulate to searches.**

    No, I didn't make any money off of the dwi checkpoints. I was on shift anyway. All the checkpoints did was get us out of bed from 01:00-03:00 or whatever. I see how my post read though. Like I was a part of a lighting and rigging crew. :)
     
  18. jakebrake

    jakebrake cracker

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    i know exactly how to deal with these checkpoints.....the cops will fume!


    don't drink and drive....they don't get to arrest you, and will end up having to arrest a drunk! won't that piss em off!

    sorry, way too many of you need to grow the hell up.
     
  19. Lowjiber

    Lowjiber

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    I was darn near killed by a drunk driver in 1980.

    The cops can set a DUI checkpoint in front of my house and I'll make the coffee.

    I've been stopped at a checkpoint by Florida HWP. No issues at all. Since I obviously hadn't been drinking, I was outta there in five minutes, max.
     
  20. Random

    Random AtticRat

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    My bar is 40 feet from my front door. I don't have to drive after drinking. That being said your comment should have read

    "Don't drink and drive, make sure you don't have any attachments for your arrest, look like anyone the police may be looking for, have valid insurance on your person, have an up to date brake tag, don't have expired plates, have a valid license with you, are not legally open carrying, and don't have any visible mechanical issues with your car ie: brake light out, crack in windshield.... and you're good to go."

    My point in this thread was and remains that a DWI checkpoint is not for catching drunks. It is a conveniently acceptable excuse for checking your papers or searching your vehicle and body at will. That is how it is being used.
     
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