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Discussion in 'Caliber Corner' started by Railsplitter, Mar 10, 2017.
How is the recoil on these, compared to the hst or gold dots?
I've been following Underwood and Lehigh and have 380, 9mm, 357 sig and 40 in both XD and XP stocked at home. I just recently got the 65 grain XD in 357 sig. I'm a believer but just haven't seen much physical proof of results.
Hard to describe other than to say they have the same snap as the heavier bullets but with a lighter push in the recoil. A 357 Sig lite!
Wayyyyyy more than that!!
Thanks for the test and video. The 65gr 9mm XD at 2100 fps out of the carbine matches the velocity of the 65gr XD 357 Sig out of a G32. All the penetration one would need, UA advertises 18 inches of penetration for this round at this velocity, and has a permanent would cavity stretching 11 inches. A barrier blind bullet with a high shock factor and an 11 inch wound cavity....amazing!
I'm not sure how much actual wounding this round would produce, but it certainly hits what many folks call "rifle velocity", and given observation of wounding of other high drag bullets, including the 'x'-series at this velocity from big bore while hunting, we can assume that there would be significant tearing beyond what a slower non-expanding bullet would produce. Ideally tissue is similar enough to the gelatin in structure so as to create a more x-shaped wound, more hemorrhaging with comparatively less actual "tissue destruction".
Then there's modest recoil and general barrier blindness.
Then there's the armor penetration. FYI, Buffman Range (Youtube) has some data with this bullet loaded into hot 9mm from a long barrel.
Buffman video tests about 2 or 3 different level IIIA vests with conflicting results and is limited to only commercial 9mm rounds. So there isn't anything much to be taken from his test.
Yes the UA GD round is tough to beat, I'm thinking 3 mags of 125gr GD one in gun then a mag of XD 65gr and a mag of XP 115gr. I think the XP is ultimately the superior hard barrier penetrator with the XD more for multi purpose use. Then as you say all bases covered!
Paul Harrell testing 357 sig ammo. including the 65gr extreme defender. (12 minutes in)
Paul, we love what you do sir.
SD does NOT remain constant in expanding bullets:
Sectional density (SD) is the numerical result of a calculation that compares a bullet's weight to its diameter. To calculate a bullet's sectional density divide the bullet's weight (in pounds) by its diameter (in inches), squared.
So a solid 36cal bullet that doesn't expand will have a greater SD than a JHP that say doubles. Why the 65gr solid may approach 125gr JHP SD.
My issue with a solid that light is even at 2000fps, momentum is quite low, 130. Where a 124gr solid @ 1200fps has a momentum of 148. So penetration thru heavy muscle bone will suffer.
as Paul mentions in the video, seems like it would fit the bill for someone that is in a jurisdiction where hollow points are illegal but one can carry. typical law made by morons that don't know what over penetration is. here in new jersey, we can buy and use hollow points if we are going from the store to home, or home to the range. but have a single hollow point round floating around your car (no gun) at any other time, it's a felony. god i gotta get out of here.
Musket balls did lots of damage. Big chunks of slow lead.
Makes Kalif sound almost sane, uh, no. If I had to use solids, handloaded 45acp, 210gr lwfn rnning about 900fps.
Anybody here tried loading the 65gr XD bullets from Lehigh in 357 Sig? I have the Underwood manufactured loads, but I’m interested in rolling my own.
I’ve tried searching for load data for that projectile in the Sig, but either there isn’t anything posted or my search-fu sucks too bad for me to find it (quite possibly the latter). Looking for the best powder candidates to try velocity-wise.
The round is so new (3 years since introduction) there might not be data on reloads. When I carry these rounds it's usually in my G31 with a 5 inch threaded barrel. With a 5 inch barrel these UA rounds top 2200 fps velocity.
I’m carrying a G32.4 off duty right now, and I’m in the process of building a G35.4 with a KKM 5.8” Sig barrel. Just waiting on the slide to come back from milling.
I’ve been shooting the Underwood load (and I’m pretty happy with it), but I was hoping maybe ss30378 or one/some of the other guys might have dabbled with it in regular Sig size reloads. I know he’s loaded it in 38 Casull and possibly some other stuff.
I’d like to see how fast I can send it with the fastest reasonable load, then look for any accuracy I can get coming back from there. I plan on shooting a fair bit of it, so rolling my own with the Lehigh projos is pretty much called for. They’re reworking it to their stamped/drawn (instead of machined) version, so it’ll purportedly be a bit cheaper this summer as well. I plan on comparing the machined pills to the newer design when the new ones come out. Hopefully they compare favorably.
It might be prudent to buy extra Lehigh bullets or UA rounds now just in case the newer bullets are disappointing. Just sayin.
Yeah, you’re right. I’m trying to get signed up for their discount. Just been waiting on their reply.
This guy is getting some impressive numbers from this recent test of the UA XD and XP rounds using a G32.
The beauty of the XD round is that in this test it penetrated multiple layers of sweat pants rolled up. It next penetrated about 3 inches of frozen ribs then penetrated more meat and made a wound cavity that looked to have a diameter of at least 2 inches. The XD then still used some of it's 700 ft/lbs of energy to penetrate 3 water jugs and still come out undamaged. Barrier blind and impressive.