New Reloader 9mm starting point

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by Darbur, Mar 31, 2020.

  1. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Its people gaming. I know a couple guys that ride the 126pf stupid. A chrono can vary, test conditions do vary, its just stupid.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2020
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  2. fredj338

    fredj338

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    That is awefully fast for any of those loads???
     
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  3. sciolist

    sciolist On the Border

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    You have to try pretty hard to not make minor. And a 10 PF drop is huge. If that doesn't change your shooting, you're not very perceptive. But I will agree the perceived difference is bigger than the actual difference in HF.

    In real HF terms, the time is in transitions, not splits. But the ability to manage splits can make a big difference in points.

    Set up for production, your gun should run fine at 127PF. 130PF should be more than safe, both in terms of mechanical function and making power. 135PF is excessive.

    In terms of time, malfunctions generally cost a lot more than modest increases in splits. So making sure your gun runs 100% is the top priority.
     
  4. unclebob

    unclebob DFC, MSM, 12 Air Medals.

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    Okay what does HF stand for?
     
  5. 10or45

    10or45 NRA Benefactor Life Member

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    Good powder choices for 9mm. Unique is a good powder but it burns dirtier and meters worse than the others. I like BE86 best for 9mm. It is fluffier, followed by WSF, and then CFE Pistol; which has a higher density. I am a big fan of using a fluffy enough powder to get good case fill with proper charge. BE86 does this well. A double charge will overflow the case. Avoid Titegroup. It is so dense you could double or triple charge a case and seat a bullet on top. That would destroy a gun and body parts. Titegroup is fertilizer imo. I crimp separately from seating and only remove the flare from powder die. Too much taper crimp will swage bullet and lose neck tension.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
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  6. GIockGuy24

    GIockGuy24 Bliksem

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    It took me a while to warm up to some of the CFE powders, but CFE Pistol been some of the best 9mm powder for me.
     
  7. APERS

    APERS

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    This. Pay heed to it.
     
  8. Sniff

    Sniff

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    He made some excuse about his wife wanting a load with less recoil.
     
  9. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Yet the diff between 125pf & 130 cant really be felt by an avg shooter. As I noted, switching powders can give a softer felt recoil at the same pf. No he was trying to game the load & hope he ddnt get caught but when you know there is a chrono, your ammo needs to make min pf. Besides, doesnt get much softer shooting than 147gr bullets at 875fps with the right powder.
    Some powders offer a sharper recoil & report, which blast plays into felt recoil. VV320 & Wst feel softer than TG or BE at the same vel/pf.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
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  10. GenBraddock

    GenBraddock

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    Interesting...I don't recall the oal off the top of my head but I am pretty sure it was nothing unusual... I normally check and recheck my length. I have often wondered if you would get an erroneous reading on the chrono if the bullet is not exactly parallel with the sensors as it passes over....thoughts?
     
  11. WVWoods

    WVWoods

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    9mm is really cheap. Not cost effective to load. I have 9mm tooling for my 650. I only load 147 subs now.
     
  12. Darbur

    Darbur

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    Not sure what you consider cheap, here in rural Northern California I paid $110 for 500 rds Blazer ( ammo, tax, and background check fee). Top it off with a 35 mile drive to Sportsman’s Whse (3 gallons of diesel @ 3.75/ gal). Ended up about $121 for 500 rds.
    That was in January, I saw 50 rds for $20 in a local place last week.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
  13. 9x45

    9x45 Millennium Member

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    Hit Factor, or HF, is the way USPSA/IPSC is scored. It's points earned minus penalties divided by time. Ok, so for example, you have 10 targets worth 10 points each (5 each for Alpha), and you run the stage in 10 seconds, so you have a HF of 10. It's a winner take all, so if you score the highest HF in your Division, even if you did not earn all the points, you get 100% for the highest HF. So if you only earned 80 points in 10 seconds, you HF drops to 8, and you are scored against the shooter with the highest HF by percentage. And if you have one miss, it's a 10 point reduction, so 70 points in 10 seconds, goes to 7. And if you walk by a target completely you earn a 40 point penalty, 10 down for each miss, 10 for a procedural, and 5 each for the 2 alphas you could have earned. Now your score drops by 40 points from the 90 points you earned, ie, if you walked by one of ten targets, now your HF is only 5. So the lesson is to miss fast. Time is what drives competition. Usually walking by a target pretty much tanks your score. These are just examples. Also the overall is reduced by the highest score, so your Division score drops even lower. That's the game.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2020
  14. 9x45

    9x45 Millennium Member

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    Remember, it's just a gun game. Not training or tactics, just speed and accuracy.
     
  15. 9x45

    9x45 Millennium Member

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    No, it was somewhat cheap before the run. I load 124's for about $5 a box. Still half the cost, but not, you can't get 9mm anywhere. So what's that worth?
     
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  16. GIockGuy24

    GIockGuy24 Bliksem

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    BE86 gives me good velocity and pressure, but it just doesn't give me any accuracy in 9mm.
    CFE Pistol seems to work well and leaves space for seating 147 grain bullets while also giving accuracy with 115 and 124 grain bullets.
     
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  17. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Some times too close to screens gives an odd reading. 1300fos with a 115gr bullet is generally well into +p range. Also screens need to be set exactly correct. If you have a folding Chrony, not open flat will cause odd readings.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
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  18. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Well lets do numbers. Buying components at none panic prices, I can load quality 9mm for practice about 11c per rd. If I Buy sim quality at say 18c, thsts $70/1000 savings. Loading on a 650, I can do a very honest 600rds + an hour. So that is a net $42/hr. So I have to work & gross about $65/hr to buy the ammo, yeah you have to pay taxes. Most of us dont make $135,000 annually, so cost effective, sure it can be, if you make less than $120k a year. I wont tell you what it really costs me reloading with primers & powders I bought 10-12y ago.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
  19. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Makes my head hurt, one reason I prefer idpa, scoring is easier.:help::okie:
     
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  20. fredj338

    fredj338

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    I've found over the years that bullet type plays a huge role in accuracy with a given pwder. Example is Universal. It is very accurate with jacketd bullets in many of my guns, 9mm thru 44mag. With lead bullets, pretty mediocre. Some powders will do well with any bullet type, some are finicky as are some guns.