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Need advice on budget HD firearm

  1. Good day sirs. Hope you guys can help me out with this. My brother-in-law asked me for advice on a home defense firearm. You see he lives with his wife and 3 very young sons in a poorly secured subdivision in Novaliches,Q.C.Their house is surrounded by 3 vacant lots and the adjacent 2 houses have been unoccupied for around 2 years. Their nearest reliable neighbor is half a kilometer away. In the past 6 months they have had at least 4 attempted break-ins, but the final straw was when just recently they found one of their two pitbull guard dogs dead and apparently poisoned. My bayaw is getting paranoid especially when his eldest son reports seeing groups of strange men looking over their wall late one afternoon. Unfortunately, he has no experience whatsoever in firearms handling, and he's on a very tight budget. I was thinking of suggesting an Armscor .38 revolver, but I told him I'd ask more knowledgeable shooters first, being a newbie myself. Ano po sa palagay niyo?
  2. buti nga yon ung revolver sir kasi pag untrained pa handler ng baril kahit naka pikit pa mata nya kalabit lang sya ng kalabit ng trigger walang paltos pag revolver. :) considering the tight budget and urgency ng situation sir ha. :)
  3. he might want to consider a shotgun also.
  4. i would suggest he get a shotgun. just point and pull the trigger :)
    less chances of over penetration. tell him to drop by pbDionesio along roces ave. and look at their escort shotgun its around 14k only. kung ako sa kanya.... i would get 1 kagad coz mukang getting ready na yung mga bad guys to break in his house by getting rid of the dogs. mintis maybe u can lend ur bro-in-law a handgun if u have more than 1 for the mean time just to be on the safe side :)
  5. Thanks very much for the quick replies, sirs. Oo nga, there is some urgency to the situation. But with the gun ban on, it will take a little more time before he can bring his FA home. Madalas ko nga siyang biruin na lumipat na lang ng residence.
  6. mintis pahiramin mo muna bayaw mo ng FA if u have more than 1.... medyo nkakatok nga situation nya.
  7. It would also help kung makuhanan mo ng pictures yung mga tambay na umaaligid.
  8. how strange were the men?

    We're almost in the same boat
    My house is in a remote bukid , neihbors are far away , and suspicious looking men parang nag susurveillance paminsan minsan

    Pero , I'm suspicious looking myself plus I know how to shoot a little
    I would suggest a 4inch revolver ( shotguns have a more complicated manual of arms ), vhf radio naka tune in sa barangay hall/emergancy response group , dogs, and more light spag gabi

    Pero tools lang yan
    Kahit walang baril basta may mindset
    I always challenge any strangers na lumiligidligid sa akin bukid
    I address them politely - @#$%^^ namo , sino nagpapasok sayo dito?!!
    If someone looks over your wall, sigawan mo - @#$#$%^ado! ano hinahanap mo artista?!!
    ( warning - this can be an invitation for some a-hole to lob a grenade over your wall )
    Ika nga sa TR , if look like food , you will be eaten

    anyway , thats been my experience in living in remote places and being robbed a few times including 1 armed robbery long time ago

    Goodluck to your bro in law
  9. Here are my suggestions...

    Go get him a 2nd hand Taurus revolver - revos are the way to go here, so he doesn't have to fumble with safeties. One thing though, you said he has young children, make sure they don't have access to his firearm!

    A non-lethal thing he can consider are those teargas cans that are build like fire extinguishers. (I think they're sold at either Jethro or Hahn)

    Another thing he could get is an alarm system that makes a wild racket when triggered. He may not have neighbors, but the BG's may get rattled when they hear an alarm go off.

    Also, get him to put more locks on his doors.

    Finally, asking him to move may not be such a bad idea.
  10. shotgun! kung walang experience yung tao sa firearms, hindi maganda handgun as a first firearm.

    pump shotgun ang the best. tignan ninyo escort and armscor shotguns. Kung sa PBD, get fiocchi 00 buck and No. 4 shot.

    tama si fafa allegra. get more dogs and lights sa gabi. lagyan nila madami bubog and barb wire perimeter walls. electrify yung bakod para ma kuryente hahawak.

    timbre sa mobile patrol kung may kakilala. dito sa barangay namin merong nahuling mga #*(@#&*$^#($^(#()@_)!)!%(! bantay salakay na mga barangay tanod!!!
  11. As a precaution against poisoning of dogs, train the dogs not to eat food tossed at them and to eat only from a dog dish. What they do to train daw is to toss meat stuffed with salt or hot sauce to the dog. The dog will eventually associate tossed food with extrmeely salty or spicy meat. This is to be done periodically until the dog becomes wary of tossed meat and will eat only from a dog dish.
  12. good day sir. i am new to this forum and this is my first post. i am not an expert on this field but i have had some experiences of break ins in our house. i was young then and no access to guns but there are a couple of things i would like to suggest and hope it will help you and your family.

    1) dogs are great. if your dogs have been poisoned before, try feeding them at night para medyo busog sila. if they are full, mas hindi sila matakaw kumain ng kung anu ano. dont over feed them too. over feeding them at night will lead them to sleeping the whole night.

    dogs can be trained not to eat food kung wala sa plato nila. if your house is near your fence, you can install a net para kung magtapon sila ng food, hindi makain ng dogs nyo.

    if you have more than 1 dog, dapat nakatali ang isa or nasa loob ng cage. if in case ma poison ang isa, u still have one who can bark and make noise. noise is what distracts and discourages thieves.

    2) if dogs are great, ducks are better! yep, ducks. this is not a typo. ducks may not bite like dogs but they make good alarm systems. kung may tao, maiingay sila and i have yet to see a duck being poisoned.

    3) try to install an alarm, bell, siren or anything that attracts attention. kahit na manually activated pwede na to. make sure the controls are in your bedroom.

    4) try to install lights around your perimeter. switching them on kapag may suspect kayo would also discourage them from going into your house.

    5) kung maliliit pa bata nyo, better sleep in one room and make sure your door is properly secured. locks are good but reinforcements to your door would be better. remember this is your last line of defense. make sure it is very secured. how? invest either in good locks and wood or better if ipa steel plate mo na ito. this may be an overkill but this may also save your life.

    6) keep the revolver. that is a great gun. i find revolvers very good for self defense. no misfeeds, no jamming. just pull the trigger. shotguns are also good. you want simplicity? get a double barrel shotgun. that is the simplest i can think of. i recently reserved for one na.

    i would suggest that you leave the fighting of the criminals to the professionals though.... wala kang laban sa mga ganyan. dont risk your life. it is not worth it. you and your guns shouldnt leave your bedroom. kung may papasok, patayin mo na. dead men tell no tales.

    never try to scare them away by going out of your room with a gun. the moment you come out of the room, consider yourself dead. common sense lang yan... kahit na magnanakaw ka lang at habol mo pera a gamit, the moment you see someone with a gun, first instinct mo nyan is to protect ur life first. when you go out of the room, hindi mo alam nasaan sila. pero yung mga magnanakaw, your room is being monitored and the moments you come out of the room, kitang kita ka na.

    7) make sure your cellfones are always charged and you have a strong flashlight in the bedroom. medyo extreme na ito pero if the thieves cut your phone lines and electricity, at least may naiiwan pa sa room nyo.

    8) there are 3 phone numbers you should always store in your cellfone..... police, fire station and hospital. dont just call the police. call all three in case of emergency. kung matagal ang police at incase na may kinalaman rin sila sa break in, the moment may siren maririnig ang mga magnanakaw, tatakbo at tatakbo yan. they dont want a complicated situation.

    9) lastly, try to save money and move somewhere else safer.

    marami pa pwedeng gawin like installing state of the art this and that. pero for someone who is medyo gipit sa pera, this is what i can suggest. these are just on top of my head and i may have missed something. ill just update it if may maisip ako.

    hope this helps.
  13. remote area? just get any reliable firearm, tapos mag alaga ka ng maraming PATO(yun ba yun? yung nanghahabol na duck tapos nanga-gagat), i remember one time i was attacked by a bunch on them on my lolo's farm, cute pa naman, maingay pa sa aso.
  14. tama sir pato or ganza?? some say ganza / goose is better pa sa aso in terms of pagiingay kung me mga tao sa paligid..

    in this case youll be alarm agad and get ready before they came in eh masasaludar mo sila na maayos (i mean ur in a safe shooting position na and ur fmily is in secured place na)
    i suggest u get a shotgun even ur wife can use it.. just aim and shoot..then sama ka sa mga tropa and shoot in a range once in a while. so ul get use of shooting. even ur bayaws wife and kids if posible.

    bisoy welcome here sa BOGs.. galing ka sa pinoy guns diba?

    tama si bisoy sir get a alarm also ung dinig nung kapitbahay nyo na half kilometer ang lau hehe.. (actualy alarm can oush away this badguys..

    get the no. of nearest police station and barngay police.
  15. hahaha ducks
    Deterrent nga yon , dami pupuntang mga alagad manghihingi ng pulutan
    sorry couldnt resist

    Tama si Choi , you guys meant gansa yung nanghahabol na maingay
    Kaso they are annoying and poop all over the place

    Kung talagang paranoid na sya , just move
  16. +1 for the dogs

    re affordable firearms, i would recommend an armscor .38 revolver or an akkar pump-action shotgun, i think around 11k lang each. medyo matagal lang processing, di mo agad makuha.
  17. mintis - PM sent.
  18. yes sir! :banana:
  19. You are right Choi, the gansa(s) (English trans.-goose/geese)makes a lot of noise when they see "particulars" in your yard. We used to have them as "alarm systems" together with our dogs in the province during my youth...have two cages with 2(m&f)gansa each cage at opposite far corners of the lot so that the property is covered all the time and solving the "poop" kalat (english trans.-mess all over the place)...And the goose eggs are really big about 3 to 4 times bigger than chickens...armscor 38 spl is affordable at less than l5K but the waiting period can get your relatives in harms'way so while waiting get or borrow an interim tool, to secure the family and answer the questions later
  20. mintis check ur pm
  21. Maraming salamat sa lahat ng mga input niyo, mga sir! I'm really learning a lot. The use of ducks or geese as early warning devices come to think of it can be a very practical solution. Ok din yung tips on dog training, especially since pahihiram ko yung sarili kong pitbull sa kanila this weekend. Plus most likely pahihiramin din sila ng temporary "tool" until they can get their own. Maybe sis should get her own FA as well. I'll share all your suggestions with them, including the designation of a "panic room".
    As for mindset, twice na na-hold up at gunpoint si bayaw when he was still working night shifts with a food supply chain, so I guess alam na niya kung paano pakiramdam nung nasa wrong end ng baril.
    I'm a late starter in shooting myself (because of possible immigration issues, baka maiwan lang yung mga baril) so I really appreciate all your advice.
  22. Unless you and your brother-in-law have the same address, if ever the firearm is used in a self-defense situation, the fact that it wasn't at the address indicated in the FA license could mean some legal troubles for the license holder.

    I could be mistaken though, so fellow BoGs, please feel free to validate or refute the above warning.
  23. I had a friend who had a ganza/goose.

    They are not just noisy, they attack.

    As a matter of fact, he had problems keeping them from attacking ANYONE who went to his house.

    Get a ganza, and get a gun, and shoot the ganza.

    (Seriously, ganzas are fine but beware they can be vicious to ANY visitors.)

    Gun-wise, an Armscor .38 is sufficient and easy to use, and not so expensive.
  24. Mintis, you've got good advise regarding the goose and revolvers. My personal experience with goose was during my elementary days in the province. Hinabol ako at nadapa ako. Pero ang sarap nang itlog nila!
  25. ...also keep your mobile phone fully charged ( syempre may load dapat) at night and if the kids stay in a separate room, dapat meron din sila...a lot easier to call police
  26. Hindi pa yata madali malason ang ganza/goose right? :supergrin:

    Get a .38 and/or a shotgun
  27. a change of address would be the most prudent thing to do. even if all the BGs are "terminated with extreme prejudice" (i've always wanted to use this line, hehehe)their relatives will keep coming back at him until they exact revenge. it a'int worth it!;)
  28. i feel your pain brother.....i am in the same situation, i just moved to a new house in a new subdivision, as of the moment 3 palang bahay sa buong subd., what i did was:

    1. i got 3 dogs, dalawa (labs) naka kulong pag gabi, positioned at the left and right side of the house, 1 naka alpas (sheperd). pag umaga lahat naka alpas.

    2. i got 2 househelp, 1 old (reliable, doesnt know how to text) 1 young (masipag, cooks to). point is, all the time me tao sa bahay, kung nautosan ko mamalengke ang isa, me isa pa natira.

    noon nung wala pa kami meralco ninakaw ang wire namin, sa galit ko the ff. night nagpaputok ako sa lupa 2magazines ng m16 full auto, kung makabili na bayaw mo baril, btw i recommend a .38 revolver that way even your sister can use it, i cannot picture a women effectively using a 12guage w/o practice , good idea din magpaputok sya sa lupa once in a while, it informs the bad guys that you are armed and dangerous.

    btw, alam mo kung gano ka galing ang revolver? when my kumander and i go away for a vacation or kung me convention sya, i leave my 38 taurus snub nose w/ my househelp, i have thought them how to use it in our backyard, its so simple, all they do is....kalabit:thumbsup: oh and i also tell them to bring the cordless phone inside their room when they sleep when we are away:thumbsup:
  29. Bro, that's really alarming, those f#@$&%s, do mean harm.
    But you must also take into consideration, what the BGs may have been planning to do next, since you have all the signs and warnings, that come low or high tide, they're going to get a shot at your bro. in laws' house. I suggest that you make a big publicity out if it. Inform the police, the barangays, your nearest neighbors if there's any, goosip mongers etc. and if possible the municipal authorities. Invite some policemen, male relatives (more is better) to stay in your house for some night watch or dinner, so as to alarm the BGs, and make them think, that they are also being profiled to whoever they are - sons of b#@*$es. All our bros are right, get a good alarm - dogs, goose, communication system access to police station, hospitals, and enough perimeter lights at night. Your bro. in law must get a firearm - a shotgun. If worst comes to worst, Sir bisoy has a good point that he must use it ONLY in the room where he and all his family members are confined to sleep; if ever any BGs dare to enter their room at night. But if they come daytime, well that's another story, pump them out good. Good luck.
  30. Thanks again for all the suggestions, sirs. Tomorrow being a saturday i'm taking my pitbull and a pug/maltese/cocker spaniel cross(noisemaker duty) to bayaw's house and maybe we'll go looking for ganza/geese/pato stock :) Point well taken about legal responsiblities for lending licensed FAs, guess we'll just have to weigh the pros and cons and hope they won't need to use it yet. I think their ultimate goal at this time is to find a place to move to, even if it's smaller but in a more civilized area.
    Re: warning shots? Any comments on their effectiveness/drawbacks?

  31. Warning shots,depende sa tao
    Kung baguhan sa krimen , it might work
    But we've used felons as bad boys sa range , di man lang nag flinch pagpinapaputikan namin downrange
    I doubt these guys would be afraid of guns
    Tools lang yung baril,aso,pato,gansa etc
    Mindset ang importante
    Of course moving is the best option
  32. Not advisable, you can be charged for brandishing. Once you draw your FA you need to use it. If I am the BG I'll be ready for you next time.

  33. It's all about barriers and delays.

    Put as many barriers you can afford between you and your would be intruders thus creating a lot of delays before they reach you. The longer the delay the better.

    Barriers would include physical (walls, gates, fences, grills. etc.), electronic (alarms, live wires,tv monitors, perimeter lights, etc.), human and animal (security guards, dogs, geese,etc.) and so on and so forth.

    The gun would be your last resort should all else fail and would best be categorized as the "tool which you should rather not emloy 'til you see their eyeballs" category (Read: Don't go out of your house with a gun and flashlight in hand when you hear that proverbial 'bump' in the night). Does not really matter much what gun you have as long as it functions properly and you are proficient in it's use.

    Of course, it goes without saying that you and your family should be ready for any and all eventualities in case of any security breach and you all know and have practiced the drill of what each and every one of you should and should not do in case of an actual intrusion.

    Tell your bayaw to keep his fingers crossed, his eyes open and his powder dry.
  34. im not fond of warning shots. pwede ako mag warning shot sa ulo ng mga magnanakaw. like i said, dead men tell no tales.

    i think i failed to mention that there should be an element of surprise. wag mong ipakita ang baril mo. wag mo rin ipaalam na may baril ka. IF they really have the intention to go into your house, they will kahit na sampung aso na ang nandyan, isang dosenang pato, at kahit na alam nya may mga baril ka.

    for me, mas delikado na malaman nya na may may baril ka coz his intention will not only be robbing you of your valuables pero aagaw rin yan ng armas. when people have the intent to get your firearm, they make sure they kill you first. they will barge into your house well prepared with their own firearms too.

    parang kwento ng karetista yan eh.... pag alam ng mga tao na karetista (someone who practices karate) ka, they dont fight with you one on one or harap harapan. salbahe mga yan at papaluin nalang ulo mo sa likod. pero kung hindi nila alam na marunong ka, bugbog yan sila. i would rather people underestimate me and i will be able to catch them off guard rather than let people be very prepared at ako ang magugulat.

    these are just my thoughts.
  35. Train the ganza to use the shotgun. That would be optimum.
  36. Perps commit crimes against helpless and or defenseless persons or families...Predators like wolves,lions, hyenas, killer whales will always select the smallest if not the weakest among the prospective prey...Having done the selection, they will attack in packs. The result is almost always death to the intended prey or victim. Humans with our sometimes uncontrollable savage instincts are like these animals, too...To prevent from being targeted, visible or audible deterrence are a must...economy lights around the property, so are Ganzas, dogs and the M16s full auto noises in the wee hours of the morning mandatory.

    In the early 80s(similar post in another thread)I transferred to subdivision in a remote part of QC during that time where taxi drivers will refuse to bring you and no bus lines ply the area either...Jeepneys last trip is about 6PM and tricycles are far and few and the district is known as a "salvage area"...And yes there was an attempt of "akyat bahay" (English trans.:House climbers)via my open dirty kitchen once...My course of action was to enclose my dirty kitchen with roof, thick wrought iron windows with jalousies and screen and lighting. No dogs or ganzas because it was a townhome...I used the barking and honking of John B. several times at the empty lots behind my property as my audible deterrence. It worked
  37. +1 marinig pa lang nila yung kasa ng shotgun magdadalawang isip na sila.
  38. Set up traps, if you know how to, maybe even explosives.

    A tank of gasul might be good,if you know what to do with it.;)
  39. IMO, a revolver is much better than a shotgun to a newbie. Easier overall manual of arms. No need to cock unlike the shotgun na pwede ma short-stroke. Just point and shoot!
  40. Hinde pwede pagsabayin nakawala ang aso at gansa at baka kainin ng aso ang gansa.
  41. depends on what dog, 5 ganzas vs 1 askal?
  42. he!he!he lagyan nyo na rin po ng moat ang paligid ng bahay tutal e wala po nakatira sa paligid nyo...

    dito po kasi sa amin e ako ang male sa house so what i did was ipagkalat sa paligid na i have a FA coz i knew na malaki kalokohan ng kapitbahay ko... di nila alam now na i sold it na... ayun at behave pa rin si bad boy...
  43. i usually stay two nights in my farm and fishpond at least every week. Its super remote and the nearest police station is 10km away.

    I suggest you buy yourself a shotgun and a revolver, a sensor motion alarm and dogs.

    Practice alot with your firearms. remember its the man and not the gun
  44. Update:

    Once again, thanks very much for all the advice. These will all be listed down in my notebook on HD 101 :) Things have gotten a little quiet at bayaw's place. They now have their perimeter wall topped with electrified wire (i forgot how many volts, but its not me but bayaw who has engineering experience). The dogs are set up in cages or tied in different corners of the 300 sqm lot. Additional lights have been installed around the house. Both doors now have deadbolts. But what made us sigh with relief was when they decided to move out by mid-May. I don't think it's a retreat, i told them to think of it as an advance to the rear:) However, bayaw doesn't want to return the revolver he borrowed, at least not until he gets his own piece.

    Sorry guys, no ganzas were called into action.
  45. nice to hear mintis..

    hehe nanikit a ung revo mu sa bayaw mu ?? ganyan talga pakiramdam if u got a gun for ur family protection .. yah advice him to get one na soon.. just beep me