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Miami attack, what would you do as observer?

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Nessy, May 31, 2012.

  1. Nessy

    Nessy NRA Benefactor

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    I had this brief discussion today regarding the drug-induced attack in Miami that has been in the news these days. From what I read, it lasted 18 minutes. Security camera footage shows people walk by, drive by (slow down and look), drive by on bicycles.

    I know that the mantra of responsible adults is to call the police and be a good witness. However, I am rather unhappy about all these "That's all you can do" statements. I am not suggesting by any means to become shoot-happy. I am wondering though whether the fundamental belief that the state cannot babysit us all the time does not also lead to the acceptance of an inherent responsibility for fellow human beings.
     
  2. Tim151515

    Tim151515 iHeartGuns

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    Well...nowadays if you tried to physically intervene you would prolly get prosecuted, especially if you had to use force. And God forbid you be a caucasion doing it...then Allie Sharpton and Jessica Jackson would surely make sure that you are a marked man for "targeting minorities". So what would I do? I'd call the cops and wish for the best.
     

  3. Wil Ufgood

    Wil Ufgood GTDS #88 CLM

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    Video and cash in with the local news.
     
  4. concretefuzzynuts

    concretefuzzynuts Brew Crew

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    It is a very good question. I would be tempted to intervene by a bottom of the foot push or kick to separate the attacker from the victim with my weapon drawn. But if this person is crazy enough to bee eating someones face I'm not sure I would want to get that close.

    An outright shot might end with me in jail and Deshawntay spooned up to my back, I definitely don't want that.

    Not really sure what I'd do. But I will be reading the other posts.

    :popcorn:
     
  5. Hurricanes

    Hurricanes

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    I myself have thought the same question being as I am in Miami. I thought of different scenarios on how I would've liked to help other than just calling 911. But we are talking about someone who was drugged up, and eating another mans face. So what other way could you had helped without putting a few rounds into him. If you kick the attacker he'll either come after you, or continue his munching of the other mans face. So I don't see how anything other than shooting him would've stopped the attack.
    -Joel
     
  6. BamaTrooper

    BamaTrooper Retired

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    The responding officer tried to separate him with a shot, and it hit but he didn't stop, so he shot him again.
     
  7. countrygun

    countrygun

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    I can speak to this from a bit of personal experience.

    A couple of decades ago a nationally publicized murder occured less than two blocks from my home (at the time). A black man was beaten to death by a gang of, basically, skinheads. It was a bit of guilt for me in that, I used to walk my dog at about the same time, give or take 20 minutes, every night. I was always armed. On that particular night I had taken the dog out early because I had early morning plans the next day. I never hesitated or doubted that had I been out there I would have intervened. I detest gangs of all types and I believe it is a responsibility of decent people to stand up to them.

    We send our young people across the world to protect the rights of others and to protect our Country, why do we then make excuses for not protecting our own neighborhoods? Is the risk too great for us?

    It isn't "someone else's job"
     
  8. badge315

    badge315

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    ^This.

    The only problem is, we have the advantage of hindsight. Knowing what already happened, I think it's pretty easy to draw the conclusion that opening fire would be appropriate. But in the moment that it's happening, I'd imagine that I'd be full of doubt and apprehension. If you arrived on the scene at the outset of the attack, how much damage has the BG done so far? Is it enough to be life-threatening to his victim? How much damage do you allow him to inflict before it's obvious that only shooting this lunatic will stop him?:dunno:
     
  9. tsmo1066

    tsmo1066 Happy Smiley

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    If I walked up on that scene, I'd dramatically say "It has begun! [the Zombie Apocalypse]". I would then grab my bug-out-bag, ruthlessly fight my way to my house through any intervening traffic, get the family together, blast my way to my safe location deep in the woods and hole up in the wilderness for a year or so living on Beanie-Weenies with no contact whatsoever with the outside world (can't risk exposure to the "Z" virus).

    I read GT and have trained for this event!

    :supergrin:
     
  10. Hurricanes

    Hurricanes

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    I agree there's to many what ifs in the situation. We assume that we'd arrive after most of the victims face has been taken off. But what if you intervene before any serious facial damage has been done? Sure it'll be off having two naked people having an altercation in public, but it's no reason to shoot the attacker. Problem is the attacker then turned zombie, and decided to make a buffet out of the victims face.

    We know the attacker was drugged up, and that it took more than one shot for the officer to put him down for good. And let's consider you are the first to take the shot, how long until your judgement is questioned in shooting the attacker. I'm sure there will be a group mentioning that you didn't have to kill him, and that YOUR life wasn't in danger.

    I would like to think that I would've done something to help the victim. But even if I was armed, I'm not sure how I would've acted on seeing a naked adult eating anothers face.
    -Joel
     
  11. Peace Warrior

    Peace Warrior Am Yisrael Chai CLM

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    I've trained for this scenario. Always shoot "face-eaters" twice.

    Good shoot Officer! :thumbsup:
     
  12. turretg

    turretg

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    I guess it would depend on the situation. I once "intervened"
    when working loss prevention for a large retail outlet I went to the food court on my break to get something to eat and going up the escalator was a mom and a little girl in front of me, as we neared the top of the floor the girls shoes laces which were loose and undone became caught in the spaces between the stairs. I noticed
    this and at the same time the girl looked up at me and said "uh-oh". I quickly bent down and pulled on the laces and they both snapped off in my hands, they seemed old and dry, fortunately. The girl and her foot seemed ok to me it looked like no damage was done.
    Her mom then reacted with some surprise as we all then exited the top of the escalator and looked at her shoes to examine them. The girl seemed ok at that point and didn't want to face the wrath of mom if she was mad at me or herself or both. My concern was giving aid to the little girl for the crucial time period. Never heard any more from it.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2012
  13. SiberianErik

    SiberianErik

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    I call this scenario "an opportunity" :whistling: to test out what kind of stopping power my 230 Gr Win. Ranger T's have :cool:

    The officer fired several shots, Miami-Dade carries the G22 mostly w/ some still using the G17. I will bet it was the G22 and 180 Gr Gold Dots or Golden Sabres. I have read reports he fired 7-9 shots before he slowed down, just goes to show what a determined person can do w/ NO WEAPONS other than teeth, also I am glad I CC a 1911 :supergrin:

    Here in Fl we have a law called something like "In Their Shoes" , where if we happen to come up on a "force able felony" that we can legally take lethal actions to stop it. This covers things like a kidnapping, rape, beating, etc..and it has to be actually going on when you intervene.

    So in other words you could have unloaded on the guy , assuming you are legally carrying.
     
  14. Hurricanes

    Hurricanes

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    My understanding is Miami Dade Police use Glock 17s, and City of Miami Police(officers at scene of attack) carry the Glock 22. So that's something that should be considered, seeing as how it still took a number of shots even with a .40.
    -Joel
     
  15. Angry Fist

    Angry Fist Dehumanizer® Lifetime Member

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    Throw him some BBQ sauce packets from KFC.
     
  16. Gun Shark

    Gun Shark

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    :rofl:


    Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine
     
  17. kiole

    kiole

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    If I saw the guy eating his face and there was no doubt what was happening I would of shot the guy. There is really no other way to intervene in this situation.
     
  18. skeeter7

    skeeter7 Brass Vulture

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    If I walked up on that, I probably would have thrown up. Have you seen the pictures of that guys face??? Absolutely disgusting.
     
  19. RedTop

    RedTop

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    LOL... You, sir, are sick. Especially with that avatar. :shocked:


    ETA - In hindsight I would have called the cops after I blew chunks.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2012
  20. 4TS&W

    4TS&W 2A RKBA 4EVER

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    I would have vomited.

    A lot.

    I haven't tried any shooting drills while wretching and puking... something to test out at the next idpa match. I'll bring the ipecac...