Home > The Main Room > The Okie Corral > Man shot in neck during training drill at shooting class

Man shot in neck during training drill at shooting class



  1. A school in PA called Rockwell Tactical had a shooting accident (the accident was not at Yeager’s school). I used to follow this instructor on YouTube (Gary Marr) and he seemed like a nice guy, but I’m not surprised he borrowed curriculum from Tactical Response when he left to teach elsewhere. Apparently Rockwell Tactical tried to replicate Tactical Response’s force-on-force training but without the same extensive safety precautions (I’m aware of Tactical Response’s own flaws in that regard). Was that a duel challenge at the end?

    https://www.wfmz.com/news/poconos-c...gun-training-facility-police-say-1/1121433078
     
  2. So you’re saying there’s someone out there less safe than Tactical Response?
     
  3. The entire tactical community is a bunch of ass hats and most of these classes are filled with beer belly having neck beards who are walking 5.11 billboards.
     
  4. That's some funny Shi$....So true
     
  5. Well THAT sucks!
     
  6. One reason I’ve never taken any classes. I can train by myself, thanks. I don’t need a bunch of New Yorkers waving loaded guns around me.
     
  7. Only if you go to classes with the likes of Tactical Response or similar.

    Go to classes taught by vetted instructors and you don't see that kind of stuff happening, or those kind of people attending.
     
  8. [​IMG]
     
  9. Watched the video....does he get a bonus for every f-bomb he drops? Nothing says "I'm a professional" like a whole lotta' f-bombs.

    Think I'll pass on his classes.
     
  10. What he said. The internet outs people on a regular basis.
     
  11. I would respectfully disagree...

    I have been to MVT in West VA. 4 times, and found nothing but committed, focused, serious individuals, taught by nothing but guys who have done multiple combat tours, worked for private security overseas, or both.

    Two different times I have been the guy that runs the place has not allowed people to be there if they showed any lack of focus, commitment, or seriousness, or if they weren't proficient enough to run their gear without endangering others.

    I trained with a group of guys from 2013 until I moved from East Tennessee last year, and most of us were in our 40's and 50's, but every one of us was in good shape, worked well as a team, and got very good at edged weapons, hand to hand, and firearms self defense.

    The "tactical community" as far as I have seen is nothing like you describe.
     
  12. That is entirely dependent upon where you train. It sounds like you haven’t had much exposure to the tactical community, because you’re generalizing all of it based on a slice of it. Even a cursory online search disproves your theory.

    Oh come on. An exceptionally small percentage of the population has the expertise to do any real training on their own. Plinking at the range or in your backyard isn’t training. But in any case, training alone will never result in the same preparedness as group training, which is why people train in groups for almost everything.

    Certain training requires groups. Force-on-force training is arguably the best way to train for a self defense scenario, after you’ve mastered the fundamentals. You can’t do force-on-force by yourself.
     
  13. Actually you can.

    But you'll grow hair on your palms and go blind.
     
  14. Just one thing Dude, do you have to use so many cuss words?
     
  15. Is that guy ok? I like James Yeager. Others do not. Whatever.
     
  16. He is very serious. He also knows that profanity as an instructor makes you very cool and elevated in the eyes of your students.

    I wonder if his heroic exploits in Iraq made his lengthy resume.
     
  17. We train differently. The best training I’ve had was from classes put on by companies whose sole focus is tactical training. I’ve been in classes where I was one of the better, and I’ve brought up the rear. Both perspectives teach. Being a bad guy in FoF training in SWAT school is a very eye opening experience. Not sure how much you can learn, by yourself, compared to that.
     
  18. Rockwell has had some bad things going on recently...it is a shame as I have met Jared, the owner, at a few gun shows, talked with him and was going to take a class.....not now.
     
  19. do "we" need to train?
    is there something coming?
    spit it out.
    what is the message of this thread?
    dont shoot with mall ninja fat walking dead dad fans or
    get in shape and make sure that the fat walking dead prepper fan doesnt shoot us?
    i see that Clint endorses James.
    i endorse Clint.
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNqR_xHiG5ibzgm4xXmF-Sw
     
  20. Be careful who you train with. I have seen terrible and good. The cussing and hard talk is usually an indicator your in a bad place. The most serious people i have met and occasiinally trained with are rather calm and move slowly making sure your safe and getting the plan very slowly before any shots are fired. People should not be touching holstered firearms before getting to a shooting area.
     
  21. @15 yrs ago he was a poster here. IIRC his thing was throwing a Glock as far as he could, then pick it up, shoot it. (I think it was tossed loaded)
    He has had students cars shot. IIRC he has had students shoot when other students are down range (not behind solid cover)
    There might still be YouTube of him in the sandbox. Things did not go well.
    100 level classes you get everything, everyone. People who never touched a gun to me who has not taken a class in 5 yrs, never with this group. So they want you to take any 100 level course.

    Partway thru you get informed. "You can take any. 200 level course in any firearm you want".
    The 200 level everyone knows the basics, should be safe...
    Honestly if I lived within 3 hrs of Frontsight. I would be there so much they would think I lived there. At least a class a month, retake some...
     
  22. I have hated it when I am dragging. By 2nd day I'm in the pack. I love being the bad guy. IED's are nasty. (The instructor makes me take them apart to show they are not real). Junk in shop, duct tape, FRS radio. If not in a svhool, permission some snaps, pull string confetti things(they have mild explosive, sold in grocery stores)
     
  23. They'd have to be "Russian Roulette Tactical Training"......

    .... oh, wait ......
     
  24. And they don't even know what 5.11 means, never mind anything to do with Robbins.
     
  25. We don't often agree, but that's the truth right there.
     
  26. I couldn't get half way thru it. He does not impress me with his profanity.
     
  27. When he was talking about his resume he forgot to mention what the color of the boathouse in Hereford is.
     
  28. What a D-bag.
     
  29. There's a lot of tactical garbage out there giving a bad name to educated, experienced instructors who know what they're doing and how to teach a dangerous topic safely.
     
  30. Problem is, their are multiple conflicting misleading and competing definitions of "vetted instructor".

    People always say: get good training. But see above paragraph.
     
  31. Bozo alert! Just a clown-show! Forget the "tactical" training, I want the f-ing "strategic" training.
    :animlol::animlol::animlol:
     
  32. I’ve never found it terribly hard to find quality instruction, with quality instructors.
     
  33. Wonder how he’d fair with a grasshopper?
     
  34. I’m probably more likely to be shot accidentally by someone in a “class” or at the range on a crowded Saturday than to ever need the skills I’d learn in said class in a real life SD scenario. So there’s that. I’m not a SWAT guy that’s going to get in multiple shootouts before I’m 40.

    Practicing some close range draw and shoot drills at touching distance is enough for me. That’s all I’d ever need a gun for anyway. It’s not hard to shoot someone from 5 feet away. Any further than that I’m turning tail and running away.

    I know it might be fun to play operator for a day every now and then but for the average low risk civilian it’s not necessary. You can learn everything you need to know by watching YouTube and putting those drills into play.
     
  35. That’s the other part. I see guys like this all the time in public. Tac gear, vests, logos, cargo pockets etc. The guns are concealed but you know that the dude has at least 2 on him based on the way he’s dressed.

    I go to great lengths to dress completely unlike someone that has a concealed pistol. That way I have the element of complete surprise on my part. That goes a long way in a potential situation, and everyone underestimates the value of being “gray.” I can really make some heads spin on here by saying that I often carry without a holster (no Glocks for that, only guns with a manual safety or a long heavy trigger like a Sig DA/SA) and keep spare mags loose in my pockets.

    The horror!!
     
  36. I am surprised that no one has mentioned the worst gun training ‘expert’ ever, VODA Inc./VODA consulting. In a class by himself, LOL!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  37. None better.

    Pistol, rifle, shotgun.

    hack_1.jpg haught.jpg
     
  38. You mean a decent instructor wouldn't put a cameraman next to the target on a hot range during a class?

    I still cringe at the thought of that video. I cringe further at how much of an idiot the cameraman was to actually do it when told to.
     
  39. Some guys are into all the "tactical" stuff. No harm in that if that's what they like. Tactical Timmy is entitled to his hobby.

    But to be honest, sometimes I wish I was wearing body armor on a trip to the local range. Some of the people I see there shouldn't be within 5 miles of a loaded firearm.

    And personally, I don't care what each man's job is in the stack, or how to deploy as a team from a vehicle, or whatever. My job doesn't require that and if it did, I would be training with the guys I was working with.

    Like they say, it's all in good fun until someone gets their feelings hurt, or in this case until someone gets a bullet in the neck.

    Regards,
    Happyguy :)
     
  40. There was a professor in Canada who would run and throw himself against a window in a high rise as part of his lecture (I don't recall what he was demonstrating). One day after repeated impacts the screws holding the frame in place sheared off and the professor plunged 30 floors to his death.

    Same principle.

    If you do something stupid long enough eventually you will get a bad result.

    Regards,
    Happyguy :)
     
  41. I see a recurring theme where whole classes of people are condemned when something bad happens due to ignorance, poor planning, outright malice, etc. Not blaming anyone on this forum, it is a human reaction, but not well thought out.
     
  42. This is sort of off topic, but why does swearing bother grown men?

    This is a legitimate point that I don’t necessarily disagree with. It just depends on the class you’re taking and who the instructors are.
     
  43. I took one of their classes in 2000. It was very good and he seemed like a good guy. At one point, I needed a ride to get cell phone coverage and he drove me there himself.

    I haven't kept up with what he has done or said since then.
     

  44. Swearing doesn't bother me per se but when I see people do it a lot it tells me they are either incapable of articulating themselves without it which could be problematic for you if you get in a shooting and say you learned what you did from them. Then up on the stand they either drop f bombs everywhere or they can't communicate effectively because they don't know how to talk without it.

    The other more likely scenario is that he is trying to establish himself as some sort of alpha male. He is using swear words to mark his territory. It shows me he is actually insecure. Someone who is secure in who they are don't have to go running around peeing in the corners to mark their territory.
     
  45. To a point. Do you have someone watching you perform said drills? Do you have someone who knows what to look for? Do you move when you draw? Do you move when you shoot?

    We had a great shooter at our department. The only problem was he walked with his legs straight, no bending at the knees. He had to walk slower while shooting to stay accurate. A quick, "Bend your knees" got him moving faster.
     
  46. This is not the first questionable event to happen at Yeager’s school. A couple of years ago an ND happened, the bullet flew parallel to the line of students and hit a student’s truck. How this had been handled by the “MFCEO” (as he calls himself) is itself highly suspect.

    If you go and read up on Yeager to try and vet him, the whole “resume” and all of his letters of reference (seriously, who has that many letter of recommendation) scream highly insecure individual. Add that to his elevated grasp of the English language and long background of controversy, it all screams shady and questionable, at best. I find it hard to believe that he is able to sell his classes and stay in business.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  47. Every thanksgiving he makes a video telling his alumni to come to his house if they have nobody to eat thanksgiving dinner with, because "nobody should eat alone on thanksgiving." For all of his faults, deep down he seems to be a very generous person but few people who bash him care to know that - it's kind of comparable to the outrage mob. They only look at the bad things people do.

    There are a lot of articulate people who swear. I have never heard this idea of swearing and articulate being mutually exclusive - especially considering that swear words are regularly used in an articulate fashion by well respected fiction writers. I sincerely doubt James Yeager is going to end up on a stand using f-bombs because someone who took a class from him used lethal force when they shouldn't have. Nothing about that makes sense to me.

    This event didn't happen at Yeager's school - it had nothing to do with Tactical Response. It happened at a school called Rockwell Tactical.
     
  48. Hell, if not for the travel distance, I'd rather do some range time/instruction with a few GT'ers. We got some shooters around here!
     
  49. :rofl:
     
  50. [QUOTE="This event didn't happen at Yeager's school - it had nothing to do with Tactical Response. It happened at a school called Rockwell Tactical.[/QUOTE]

    Actually, this event did happen at Mr. Yeager’s school. It took JY 3 weeks to make a public comment about the incident, in which he threw the guilty party, a friend, under the bus.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk