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I gather that he's fairly active in the OC world, and works/worked at a gun shop. Have you had any dealings with him that might shed light on this episode?
Based on the name alone I have no recollection of him, unfortunately.
 
you can be asked to leave public property especially parks for any number of reasons .
there are about 6 to 8 parks closer to his house than the 1 he was kicked out of .there is a reason he went to the park that has a full time security person .that reason was to cause a commotion and be noticed because he carries a gun mmm big man .
What are you basing this on?
 
Right, but that appears to pertain to private property only. The park in question is city owned. I'm not sure how it works in GA, or how you could be forced to leave public property. It's kind of impossible...isn't it?

I'm not seeing any actual laws being broken, just the guy being a pain in the butt and the authorities just throwing something general out there sort of like "disturbing the peace" or some such.

Either way, right or wrong, the guy should have just left and came back later. Starting a war with police on the street is never going to end well.
Being publicly owned doesn't mean you get to do as you please there - it is controlled by the government, just like the publicly owned county jail or police department. A representative of the government can tell you to leave, unless there is some law preventing it (constitution, statute, etc.). Think of all those "occupy _" protestors being arrested in public parks. A government official of some kind (including police) tells them to leave and then the police arrest those who don't. Same thing.
 
you can be asked to leave public property especially parks for any number of reasons .
there are about 6 to 8 parks closer to his house than the 1 he was kicked out of .there is a reason he went to the park that has a full time security person .that reason was to cause a commotion and be noticed because he carries a gun mmm big man .

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Without revealing the actual address or street, where does he live?
 
I'm a career firefighter for a Big "West Coast 7" City up here in the NorthWest, and I work in the south "culturally diverse" side of that city... so I get to see you guys and gals in blue on alot of the same runs (I've pulled many taser darts out of your "customers"). I have seen the kind of people you have to deal with... Basically I "get it", just judging from the photo, I'm not inviting Christopher Proescher to my back yard BBQ either.

What I don't get is why these OC confrontations always wind up in a @!$$!#& contest to get the OCer to show ID.

I don't personally OC, but I have several friends who do (one of whom has actually had one of these "Papers Please" encounters). With minor variations, it's always the same story -


  • · Nervous Nellie citizen calls 911 to report OC'er

  • · Cop shows up, knows OC is perfectly legal but wants to see ID - "To ensure the scene is safe" (like that will prove anything).

  • · OC'er just happens to be a Ron Paul libertarian who knows his rights (go figure!). He says something like : "Given the fact that I'm not driving, and am not required to carry my Drivers License when I'm a pedestrian, what kind of ID would you like to see officer?"

  • · Situation either escalates into an arrest for some creative infraction ('cause the initial reason for contact - OC, is legal) OR either OC'er or cop capitulates.
The basic point is that the OC'er isn't breaking the law, so I'll just ask; "Why the need to ID?...What will it prove?" I don't want to get into a big discussion about social psychology and the need to establish Alpha dominance, so I'll circumvent that issue and simply ask - Wouldn't it be pretty easy to articulate the rationale for complete inaction in this case?

You arrive on scene to investigate an OC complaint and witness an adult male carrying an expensive firearm in a quality holster openly on his belt... he's clearly not a "banger", or a 220 nutjob. He's just "That Guy", the passionate gun enthusiast making his statement (one I know drives a minivan... sheesh). If we input the details of this scenario into the critical thinking - Street Smart section of our grey matter, the output would clearly be..... 'This Person Is Not a Threat'... and as an added bonus they weren't even breaking the law in the 1st place! They could win the prize of NOT even being contacted by Law Enforcement today!

Feel free to stop by the station and use the restroom, just don't raid the fridge!

My .02

I've seen kids try to kill us. I've had my life threatened by an old woman with a gun. I've seen a guy that could be a preacher try to run over another cop. I remember the West Memphis, AK incident when a father and son in a church van killed those cops.

I don't care if you look like little red riding hood. You're getting treated the same as I would with anyone. The only exceptions are known trouble makers because my sense of security is heightened.

That mindset is how you get killed in todays world. That's just how things are.

When I'm called to a scene or detain you and you fail to provide ID or provide mis-matching information, a big red flag goes up.

When I ask you for a your drivers license and you tell me you didn't drive I'm one step closer to arresting you.

Just because it says drivers licenses doesn't mean it isn't considered an official form of identification. There are others I can ask for, but that is the hands down most common. I'm not looking for issue a ticket for running a stop sign or checking your DL status. I'm looking for who you are and it is going to tell me.

It's that simple. You fail to prove who you are when I ask and your arrested until you either get over yourself and tell me or I prove it. That's the law and there are reasons that are too obvious to type out.

You have no idea how many people I've arrested on warrants after IDing them at random. If you have nothing to hide, just let us do our jobs and then move on. It's when people argue that 9 times out of 10 something they don't want you to know comes to light.

If the guy you decided to give a break happens to be a serial killer from another state and then goes off and kills someone your close to.. now what. You had a chance and passed it up.

I'm saying "you" in a general sense, not calling you out Ollie. Thanks for serving on the other side :)
 
Without revealing the actual address or street, where does he live?
There's a link to his neighborhood on page one. It's with the mugshot; post #2.
 
Without revealing the actual address or street, where does he live?
it's on the arrest report.

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Does Mr. Proescher have a history of previously doing what he did?
I know he's been asked to leave some restaurants where he likes to open carry .
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Being publicly owned doesn't mean you get to do as you please there - it is controlled by the government, just like the publicly owned county jail or police department. A representative of the government can tell you to leave, unless there is some law preventing it (constitution, statute, etc.). Think of all those "occupy _" protestors being arrested in public parks. A government official of some kind (including police) tells them to leave and then the police arrest those who don't. Same thing.

I could be wrong, and feel free to correct me. I don't think the police did anything wrong. They arrested him for criminal tresspass after checking with a magistrate. Where the problem comes in is why the security guard asked him to leave. Usually on public property to be asked to leave and be considered tresspasing you have to be breaking a law/statute/ordinance. As you referenced the OWS crowd, they weren't arrested for protesting... they were arrested for violation of law/statute/ordinance/usage policy or trespassing after they were asked to leave to because of said violation. The security guard asked him to leave because he was being evasive. This is where he has an legitimate issues. It will be interesting to see what comes of it.
 
Discussion starter · #53 ·
Take a look at your State's Trespass law(s).

You don't get to refuse to leave because "you don't think the person authorized to tell you to leave doesn't have a good reason".

You have to leave. If your "rights" have been abridged you have recourse later through court.
 
Drain You, when you say "justified," well, first, lets break it down into the security guard's actions and then the police officers' actions.

When you say you do not find anything that justified the security guard approaching Proescher, do you mean he had no legal reason to approach him, or he no reason to approach him.

As to the police officers, they responded to a call from the security guard. Is that not a justification to approach?

If you or I had approached him and told him that he was breaking a law/rule by carrying, we would be incorrect. Also our opinion wouldn't matter because we are not security guards or LEO there.

That someone authorized to have authority there did, that is the problem. The security guard wasn't doing his job properly, (dare I say he was probably projecting his own feelings on gun ownership?) and when he didn't get his way he involved the police.

Now of course the police are not at fault for responding or for engaging the chap, but their reasons for arrest seem little flimsy to me. At least how that is I see it when I look at the big picture.

Some may say the guy should have acted differently or just left when asked, but I bet the security guards & local police have learned something and this won't happen again.
 
Take a look at your State's Trespass law(s).

You don't get to refuse to leave because "you don't think the person authorized to tell you to leave doesn't have a good reason".

You have to leave. If your "rights" have been abridged you have recourse later through court.
Agreed. And that's why I agree the police didn't do anything wrong and the only traction he may have is with the security guard..
 
Take a look at your State's Trespass law(s).

You don't get to refuse to leave because "you don't think the person authorized to tell you to leave doesn't have a good reason".

You have to leave. If your "rights" have been abridged you have recourse later through court.
That's what I meant in my earlier post. I was at work and had quite a few things going on so my thoughts kept getting broken. :(

Whether the guy was right or wrong didn't much matter. He was being asked to leave the area, and instead of sucking it up and complying for the time being, he tried to fight the law on the street. Wrong place. Wrong time.

So yes, the officers were more than justified in their actions and this guy really has no case.
 
Interesting questions. Simply OC'ing in the park was not justification in GA for being asked to leave. I would urge GA residents to make sure you read the fine print on carrying in parks. For example, if you have a permit, you can carry in state parks; HOWEVER, there are exceptions - e.g., "except sites where prohibited by federal law."

His whole interaction with the security guard and police was stupid (assuming the police report is accurate), IMHO. However, he wasn't arrested for being stupid...if that were the case, never mind. He was arrested for trespassing. The security guard asked him to leave on multiple occasions due to his perception that the individual had "ill-intent" due to being "evasive" in responding to the security guard's questions. What this all tells me - you want to act like a jerk, you will likely be asked to leave. Refuse to leave, you will likely get the cops called. Be a jerk to the cops, you will likely go to jail for refusing to leave when initially asked. VERSUS...be polite and cooperate, you will likely enjoy your day in the park. Sounds so simple.

When you have an agenda nothing is simple...I've seen this guy he's not out getting in a cardio workout..he's a creeper.
 
Being publicly owned doesn't mean you get to do as you please there - it is controlled by the government, just like the publicly owned county jail or police department. A representative of the government can tell you to leave, unless there is some law preventing it (constitution, statute, etc.). Think of all those "occupy _" protestors being arrested in public parks. A government official of some kind (including police) tells them to leave and then the police arrest those who don't. Same thing.
Bren, yea, that's what I meant but I was unable to put out complete thoughts at the time of my posting. You can most certainly be asked to leave the area.

I think what I meant was there's no property owner in this regard since it's public property, and I'm not sure if the security guard has/had the authority to do what he did. He may have exceeded his role in this whole thing. However, the police most certainly do and this guy should have complied with them.

I think that's what I was trying to say at the time I posted, but sorry for the confusion at any rate lol. :)
 
Agreed. And that's why I agree the police didn't do anything wrong and the only traction he may have is with the security guard..
Didn't the article say the security guard was acting on a local ordinance against carrying guns in the park?

Georgiacarry.org seems to be saying that Georgia has a preemption statute, but many local governments still have a ban on carry, especially in parks, that they are suing to get rid of.
 
Didn't the article say the security guard was acting on a local ordinance against carrying guns in the park?

Georgiacarry.org seems to be saying that Georgia has a preemption statute, but many local governments still have a ban on carry, especially in parks, that they are suing to get rid of.

I'll go back and read it again. You may be correct, but my first reading of it was that there wasn't a problem with the weapon or carrying it in the park..

ETA:I read where the man arrested said where he had checked with the city and it was ok.. I haven't been able to verify that is the truth yet. So you could be correct. In which case, I would suspect additional charges coming in addition to the criminal trespass charges..
 
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