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Have you ever had a negligent or accident discharge?

  • No

  • Yes, Negligent Discharge

  • Yes, Accidental Discharge

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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey Guys!

I personally have never had a negligent or accidental discharge, but want to talk about them and to hear your stories if you've ever had one. Now for those who aren't clear on the difference between the two:

Negligent Discharge (ND) – a discharge of a firearm that was primarily caused by the failure to follow established safety procedures.

Accidental Discharge (AD) – an unintentional discharge of a firearm that was not caused by any negligence or failure to follow established safety procedures, such as a mechanical failure.

The purpose of this isn't to ridicule, or to make anyone look bad...

The purpose here is to be able to learn from other's mistakes and experiences, to stress the importance of firearm safety, and to remind us to never get complacent and/or careless when handling our firearms.

So that being said, let's hear your ND or AD story. Even if you haven't had a ND or AD personally, maybe you saw one take place or know someone who has had one and can share the story.

When, where, and how did it happen?
What was the aftermath, was anybody hurt or any property damaged?

Thank you!
 

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Both of these fall under "Unintended/Unintentional Discharge".

And there may be a "UD" that falls somewhere between an AD and ND. I read of an instance where a "well worn" leather holster caused a "UD" during holstering. Fortunately, only a car seat and pride were injured in this particular case.
 
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None, and I'm doing all I can to prevent this from happening by constantly educating me, doing safety checks all the time, training without pressure and checking / cleaning my firearms after each range trip.

Call me paranoid but I'm treating everything guns related very carefully. Last thing I would want is having to end a day at the range with stuff like this:

 

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I had an ND or AD last winter with our G19. In our bedroom, where I used to clear it
always. The round(115gr Goldot +P+) went through the wall a few inches above my pillow.
Then went across the room and through the electric fireplace, then out of the house. I'm a safety
OCD type, but this still bothers me for a whole lot of reasons. Since then, I only clear carry guns
pointed straight at the ground, outside. It is completely my fault, but I cannot exactly remember
what happened. I know I dropped the magazine, then bam. I hit the trigger with a live round in the chamber, not intentional. Just don't know if it was the heavy gloves, or me being careless. Thankful to God above that my daughter was out in the kitchen. Scary is an understatement.
 

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My Father in Law shot a mattress once. Forgot to check the chamber which is ironic because the problem with the gun was it wouldn't chamber a round.
 
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Now for those who aren't clear on the difference between the two:

Negligent Discharge (ND) – a discharge of a firearm that was primarily caused by the failure to follow established safety procedures.

Accidental Discharge (AD) – an unintentional discharge of a firearm that was not caused by any negligence or failure to follow established safety procedures, such as a mechanical failure.
Based upon your definitions, every accidental discharge I have heard of was actually a negligent discharge. Properly carried and maintained guns don't go off by themselves.
 

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Before anyone wants to split hairs on ND vs AD...and I agree that overall these things are Negligent, but there are some exceptions...I was running a SAW (M249) in a training environment, I needed to open the feed tray to handle an issue, I pulled the charging handle to the rear and then returned it forward the same as I would do in real life but the bolt didn't stay to the rear and was returned onto the round in the chamber.
 

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I have had the following AD/UDs

1) M16 on F/A fired a short burst, actually dumped entire magazine. Caused by popped primer under disconnector.

2) 870 had a hangfire. We set it aside, but had to unloaded to case it to go home, it went off when we racked it to eject.
 

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Dropped the bolt on my Ruger Mark ll during a bullseye match, immediately followed by two rounds firing in rapid succession. Left grip panel had allowed the pin (hammer pivot, I think-the grip has a cutout for it) to back out of the frame a bit, so it was a bit cockeyed. Had the gun not been pointing a safe direction, it would have been a negligent discharge. I am a stickler for muzzle etiquette.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
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During shift change, USAF armory, 1992, removed the mag from my M16/GAU and was called away to sign something. I placed the unloaded gun in a weapons rack and stepped away.

I returned, picked up my gun, pulled the charging handle to the rear, chamber was empty, let the bolt go and pulled the trigger. BANG!! (thank goodness it was pointed in the clearing barrel)

I was surprised, this gun had a magazine, but my mag was in my belt?

Turned the gun over, not my gun. I picked up the wrong rifle, it had a mag and the light above the clearing barrel was not bright enough or off, and I wasn't careful. My clearing official was in a hurry and had looked away. Not uncommon back then.

In a small 15x15 room, with two other guys in it, that was very loud.

Completely my fault.
 

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Unless it is a gun malfunction, any shot not triggered intentionally is a negligent one. Accidents are not your fault, out of your control, negligence is just that.
 

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I was handed a gun with the magazine set off to the side. I racked it to check the chamber and one flew out. Slightly miffed at having been handed a loaded gun I pointed it in a safe direction and decided to feel how good the trigger was. Turns out this model had a flush fit magazine IN it and all I did was rack another round. The magazine off to the side was an extra. Scared the living crap out of me and I was sick about it for a long time. It still bothers me. No damage or injuries because I did follow one rule of pointing in a safe direction but I am now OCD about checking and rechecking. And even then, I step out on the back porch to dry fire. My buddy got a chuckle out of the whole thing, which I didn't find too amusing either. He could see me slowly squeezing the trigger to feel any grit to it and knew what was about to happen.
 

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Yrs ago, night after informal shoot. Camp fire for cooking brats... Guy had pickup he wanted line of bullet holes along bed. (Deputy Sheriff) wanted to pull his boss's chain. Truck was going to be used on property, not lic in future...
I have mag that I "thought" I knew how many rds. I fired them, slide went foreward. (not unusual with that gun)
I remove mag, pull slide, RO looks, calls it clear, tells me to drop slide, dry fire, holster.
I do and BANG. Seems there was another rd in mag, for some reason it did not pick up, kick rd out of chamber.
RO tried to see with fire light...
AS it was pointed at target (truck bed) the ND was inches from last rd.
 

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Former boss of mine at the NYPD Firearms & Tactics Unit had a saying; "If you are around firearms there are those that have had accidental discharges and those that will."

Lt. Frank McGee (passed on many years ago, great guy, knew his stuff)
 

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I could talk for a long time about friends, and others, that have shot their TV's, front door, chair, telephone pole, patio glass door, even their bed with them in it.

I'll tell one of mine.
About 9 PM in my shop cleaning a AR after shooting it.

Ready to go up the house to put the AR by the nightstand.

I'm thinking about what I'm going to do at the house.

I'm thinking I want the hammer down and bolt closed on a empty chamber with a full magazine in the gun.

With my mind on whatever I was going to do at the house..............
I insert the loaded mag, release the bolt (chambering a round) and pull the trigger.

It got very loud and very interesting.

The bullet went through both sides of the top and sides (3 layers of 50 cal ammo can) of the loaded, almost to the top at the time, with 223 rounds. The bullet missed the live rounds by an estimated 1/2 inch.


Back side.


Then the bullet cut open a quart plastic sack of loaded 223 rounds, on a metal shelf, without touching one round.

The bullet continued on to blow a hole in the metal shelf about 3/4 inches wide and about a inch and a quarter long.
Then the bullet blew about a 3/4 inch hole in the steel shelf leg.

Not finished yet the bullet (fragments) went through the shop wood and insulated wall.

Still not finished the bullet fragments exited the shop's metal wall and hit the barn wall several feet away.
A lot of holes for one 55 grain 22 bullet.



The people that scare me, whether shooters or pilots, are the people that say/believe, "It will never happen to me".
 

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I could talk for a long time about friends, and others, that have shot their TV's, front door, chair, telephone pole, patio glass door, even their bed with them in it.

I'll tell one of mine.
About 9 PM in my shop cleaning a AR after shooting it.

Ready to go up the house to put the AR by the nightstand.

I'm thinking about what I'm going to do at the house.

I'm thinking I want the hammer down and bolt closed on a empty chamber with a full magazine in the gun.

With my mind on whatever I was going to do at the house..............
I insert the loaded mag, release the bolt (chambering a round) and pull the trigger.

It got very loud and very interesting.

The bullet went through both sides of the top and sides (3 layers of 50 cal ammo can) of the loaded, almost to the top at the time, with 223 rounds. The bullet missed the live rounds by an estimated 1/2 inch.


Back side.


Then the bullet cut open a quart plastic sack of loaded 223 rounds, on a metal shelf, without touching one round.

The bullet continued on to blow a hole in the metal shelf about 3/4 inches wide and about a inch and a quarter long.
Then the bullet blew about a 3/4 inch hole in the steel shelf leg.

Not finished yet the bullet (fragments) went through the shop wood and insulated wall.

Still not finished the bullet fragments exited the shop's metal wall and hit the barn wall several feet away.
A lot of holes for one 55 grain 22 bullet.



The people that scare me, whether shooters or pilots, are the people that say/believe, "It will never happen to me".
So much for the reasoning that a 5.56/.223 won't penetrate much.
 

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Another funny one because no one was hurt.

Years back a good friend had a heart bypass operation. Back when they really split your chest open.

One night, in the bedroom, in his underwear, my friend was cleaning his Makarov. Then loaded it, round in the chamber, in preparation of putting it away.

He laid down on the bed to watch TV.
Absentmindedly he reached over and picked up the Mak and with the gun about parallel with his leg he pulled the trigger.
(why we do such unthinking dumb stuff like this I'll never know, but we do)

Lucky the bullet missed his leg and went down through the bed. The bullet went clean through the bed and almost through a wood box full of junk that was under the bed.
(Later my friend said the 9x18 JHP reloads I gave him did pretty good)

Now my friend's Wife, Linda picks up the story. Imagine Her being pissed.

First the shot scared everyone. Then Linda sees her husband in the bedroom doorway.
He's in his drawers, gun in his right hand, left hand over his Heart.
Linda was scared bad and didn't know if her husband had just shot himself, or if his Heart was giving out, or both.

Needless to say, my friend caught hell from his Wife for a long time, and his friends took every opportunity to rag him about it. :)
 

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Former boss of mine at the NYPD Firearms & Tactics Unit had a saying; "If you are around firearms there are those that have had accidental discharges and those that will."

Lt. Frank McGee (passed on many years ago, great guy, knew his stuff)
SOunds like someone that has had one or two. I've been shooting for 40yrs now, many years in competition, 100s of 1000s of rds downrange. I can honestly say I have never had an ND. Check, recheck, on sights on trigger, off sights off trigger. Not saying it won't ever happen, but negligence is just that.
 
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