Krav Mega

Discussion in 'The Martial Arts Forum' started by m1shooter, Mar 21, 2007.

  1. gr81disp

    gr81disp Bushbot v1.0

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    Bruce Lee might have bitten a BJJ guy's ear off, but then he would never walk or do martial arts again, assuming the bjj guy didn't just choke him to death. Say what you want about bjj, but it didn't originate as a sport and I would take a bjj purple over just about any other black belt in a fight.
     
  2. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    and i would disagree...


    remember the doctors said the same thing after he broke his back, only to come back stronger than ever..


    and if you think the wrestler, or bjj practicioner would continue his attack with his ear being bitting off, come on over for a demo.


    and as to bjj not being a sport style art... ask yourself this question, how many eye gouges do you work on.. how many times do you bite..

    i think an arm bar is a perfect example of the sport aspect. there are lots of examples online where the bjj guy locks the other dude in an arm bar and the other guys face is resting on the calf of the bjj guy. now if the rules of biting are followed, the bjj guy would lose a mouth full of calf muscle.

    i like bjj, i like wrestling, i like all martial arts, but gotta keep things in perspective bro.

    wolves travel in packs, in that sense bjj could get you very very hurt.

    wanna know the rule about biteing, since they dont/wont teach it in bjj?

    "the only rule about biteing is make sure your teeth meet each other"
    -bruce lee
     

  3. Halojumper

    Halojumper

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    Even TKD, the 7-11 of martial arts? :)
     
  4. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    yup, im a 2nd dan



    you know.. there is alot of variance in the way the style is taught.. prolly the most usless is the WTF olympic organization. equally useless is any school who concentrates on tournament type competition.

    any school that takes more of a kickboxing approach is much much better.

    (we do lots of different styles at our school, the tkd is great for physical conditioning and kicks. we augment with boxing, judo, jiu-jitsu, and Haginah as our modern style.)




    edit: (by the way, dont make me kick you!:banana: )
     
  5. A_Fletcher

    A_Fletcher Guest

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    Eaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaasy Chuck!





    :tongueout: :animlol: :rofl: :laughabove:
     
  6. Halojumper

    Halojumper

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    From what I've seen, ATA is even worse.


    Yeah, at least a kickboxer can take and give a reasonable shot.



    Oh, that's no problem. I generally try to be pretty accomodating. Feel free to attempt to kick me anytime! :)
     
  7. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    lol fear me! lol
     
  8. gr81disp

    gr81disp Bushbot v1.0

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    Oh NO! NOT the "d34dly" eye gouge!! :upeyes:

    No, I am not going to use bjj in a multiple attacker scenario. Nor am I going to use Muay thai kickboxing, sambo, kung fu, tkd, or any myriad of martial arts except the 500 meter dash and a glock. If you are dumb enough to say that multiple attackers proves bjj is ineffective, guess what, you have just proven EVERY martial art ineffective. There is no martial art where you can be attacked by three guys at one time and come out of it on the winning side unless you are armed and they are not. No, Enter the Dragon does not count as a valid reference for a multiple attacker scenario.

    As for biting and eye gouging, well, what is your striking martial art going to do if I kick you in the groin. It is the same argument. Groin strikes, eye gouges and biting DO NOT END FIGHTS!!! If you rely on biting me to escape my armbar, you have a broken arm and afterwards, I am going to REALLY hurt you for pissing me off! As for eye gouging, it isn't a 1-way street. You try to eye gouge me on the ground, I am in superior position, stop it and eye gouge you right back. Then, once again, I REALLY hurt you for pissing me off.

    Is Bjj the most effective martial art? No, a cross-trained martial artist will eat a pure bjj guy alive, but guess what? Bruce Lee was not a true cross-trained martial artist, he couldn't wrestle and would be KILLED by a bjj guy. He is worshipped because he is the genesis of perhaps the most valuable martial arts idea in centuries, namely that to be complete, you must cross-train. But he wasn't invincible and to seriously think he could even compete today without learning some type of grappling art is stupid. Bruce Lee should be respected for his ideas and his skill level in his art, but not worshipped.
     
  9. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    wow... just wow..


    your agressive and opinionated, thats fine.

    but your wrong about bruce lee, as anyone who actually knows anything about the man can tell you..


    edited to ad: i have attempted to remove eyeballs on two seperate real world occasions..

    the first time i was being choked and the eyeballs didnt come out but a whole lot of blood did, i still lost the fight but only because i did it incorrectly, i used the middle and pointer finger instead of the thumbs.


    the second time a guy was getting his finger bitten off, i forced the same two fingers into the biter's eye sockets and pulled back to open his jaw, this saved the other guy's finger.


    i am a big fan of running away, its a big part of my plan.


    you just seem so young and foolish when you make agressive posts like this.
     
  10. Halojumper

    Halojumper

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    Well that sounds like a good plan exept that running is not always an option. Bad guys may have your route cut off or have already grabbed you. While I agree that no martial art will make you a superman that can automatically whip any number of opponents, having the best MA skill set you can is a definite plus in this case, though I would not put BJJ on the top of the list.
     
  11. gr81disp

    gr81disp Bushbot v1.0

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    What about Bruce Lee was I wrong about? Was he an accomplished grappler? No. Is he worshipped? Yes. Did he contribute an extremely vital idea to martial arts (to discard what did not work and use what did)? Yes. Should he be highly respected because of his philosophy? Yes. Was he extremely skilled? Yes.

    So, the only two things you could possibly have any problems with is either that he doesn't deserve the worship he receives (which I don't think you are arguing) or my assertion that he would get owned by any competent submission grappler. Would he have a chance? Of course, somebody as skilled as Lee would always have a chance, but it would be a very small one. Strikers do not fare well against grapplers, this is already a settled question. I may look foolish to those set in their ways, but I wonder which of us looks foolish to those with an open mind?

    Halojumper, yeah, if you are cornered, unless your opponents are incompetent or you are just amazing, it is time for a beatdown. Bjj is poor for multiple opponents, but that is why I train in muay thai also. Rickson Gracie, probably the greatest Jiu-Jitsu practitioner to have ever lived, was asked what his favorite technique was for mulitple opponents. He replied, "My Sig Sauer P229."
     
  12. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    bruce lee's "idea" is what you now call mma.


    he was the first to realise that to their is no reason to be true to a particular style other than, like you have said, being closed minded/ignorant.


    and as far as your example about the wrestler pinning him and then claiming a bjj guy would destroy him because of this event..


    three words..



    hughes vs gracie


    there is something in you that makes you a fighter, it cannot be taught, you can learn the skills but the mental edge that is required to implement is what makes the man a fighter..

    bruce lee had this edge.

    edit: is vs a word?
     
  13. gr81disp

    gr81disp Bushbot v1.0

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    Hold on, so your idea that Lee, a striker, would beat a grappler, is that Hughes, a grappler, beat Gracie, a grappler :freak:

    I know that Lee's ideas taken to the their logical conclusion is the advent of MMA, but Lee WAS NEVER A GRAPPLER. Supposedly he began studying some at the end of his life, but that is a moot point, he was a striker. I have said in the last couple of posts that Lee's ideas are some of the most important to have come along in martial arts history, so I have no idea what you are trying to prove with that comment about MMA. The only argument you have put forth is that a grappler beat a grappler, which has NO point in this discussion.
     
  14. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    the wrestler vs grappler thing...



    you were pointing out that since a champion wrestler pinned lee one time that the bjj guy would have no problem.

    this is implying that bjj trumps wrestling.


    this is true for the most part but it comes out to the individual more than the style, as is apparent in hughes vs gracie.


    i never said it was better to be a striker than a grappler, its best to be both.


    and as far as a striker being better than a grappler 3 more words..



    st. pierre vs hughes
     
  15. gr81disp

    gr81disp Bushbot v1.0

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    No, it is implying that wrestling goes for merely pins and such, that is the nature of wrestling, which the wrestler was able to impose because he was a grappler. A bjj guy would go for submissions and would win, not because he is a bjj guy, but because he is a grappler. I could be a sambo or catch wrestler also.

    As for GSP beating Hughes, you must mean the rematch, since Hughes beat GSP in the first round, by submission, the first time they met. And it is GSP's grappling ability which enabled him to avoid Hughes' takedown attempts. Personally, I hope Hughes wins the third, but GSP might just be the first true 100% mixed martial artist with elite striking and sick grappling.

    As for strikers beating grapplers in general, it is a rare enough occurence that they tend to stick out. The most successful strikers have very good takedown defense and at least moderate grappling skills to get them out of tough spots. (Cro Cop, Liddell, Silva, Sylvia, GSP, etc.) For the most part, there are no more pure strikers in MMA but there are still a few almost pure grapplers (Sherk, Pe De Pano, Monson, Gracie)
     
  16. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    ok, you just put cro cop and sylvia in the same sentence.


    thats all i need to know about your knowledge of martial arts.


    edit to ad: peda pano cruise is a joke.
     
  17. gr81disp

    gr81disp Bushbot v1.0

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    Hold on, you call an Abu Dhabie Combat Club World Submission Wrestling champion, Marcio Pe De Pano Cruz (at least spell it right) a joke? I have tried to stay away from personal insults but after calling me foolish, and insulting my knowledge of martial arts, I have to say that you are a fool. I say that Bruce Lee would probably lose a fight and you throw a hissy fit and insults. Then, you say that a world champion and black belt, Cruz is a joke. Of course I just put Sylvia and Cro Cop in the same sentence, they are both good strikers with excellent takedown defense. Cro Cop is better, but they both fight with the same formula. I expected you to respond in good faith, but instead you expect your word to be the end of your arguments. Maybe if you would understand that the joke of "dirty fighting" is not the instant touch of death you think it is you would come to a more complete understanding of martial arts instead of burying your head in the sand and complaining that bjj and wrestling are just sports and not real fighting techniques.
     
  18. Gonetodarkside

    Gonetodarkside owl protector

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    relax dude...

    im assuming you saw the fight between cruz? and arlovski.


    you remind me of that guy with the tapout shirt and hat i seem to see everywhere.
     
  19. gr81disp

    gr81disp Bushbot v1.0

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    So he loses to a former UFC HW champ in his fourth MMA fight and automatically sucks?