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Justified Rant?

Discussion in 'GSSF' started by WiskyT, Apr 9, 2004.

  1. WiskyT

    WiskyT Malcontent

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    Ok, firstly I’d like to say that I might be a “sore looser” here, and if anyone has a logical explanation for this I will admit that I simply wasn’t good enough to win. FWIW, I have won more than enough money to pay for the G17 I used to compete with, and in a sense, I have “won” a gun.

    When I was shooting in the 160’s in AmLE and winning $25 here and there in the B class, I knew I was a mediocre shooter. But I decided to take it seriously and bought a G17 and worked at it. I got to the point where I shot a 103 in the Poconos. But there was a problem, the 10yd target on the 5toGlock only had 5 holes in it. They were all in the center, which was a big ball of tape at this point. The 25yd target was also a tight group, but w/ 6 holes. The shooters watching explained to the RO that rounds all hit the target and the condition of the target was the cause for there only being 5 holes in the 10yd target. The shooters argued that I must have had 6 shots through the 5 holes. The RO was polite, but said essentially that w/ 5 holes he had to score a miss and add 10 points. I ended up with a 113 and took 3rd. I would have beaten the winner w/ a 103. I figured this was just too bad for me and sucked it up and cashed the $75 check.

    I was determined to shoot so well that I wouldn’t have this problem the next year. I shot in the low 90’s at Pocono and was beaten by a guy (I don’t want to post his name because he shouldn’t be dragged into my rant here just because he beat me) who bettered my score by 1 point. I beat the previous record by a significant margin and I get beat by 1 point.

    Okay, so now I really work at it and beat my previous score by another TEN points in Long Island and the same guy beats me by 1 point again. Another record setting score, for this location, and I lose by less than 1%! I mean my 81 is actually better than the Competition class and I lose by 1 point in the AmLE class again.

    So now the results of the NJ ’04 match are posted. I have moved and lost interest in GSSF and didn’t compete in this match. The winner scores a 103. I know this guy and he deserves a win for his daily practice. I don’t want to take anything away from Capt. Umlands well-deserved win. But the guy who beat me twice shoots a 116.

    Why is it that a class that is typically won with scores in the low 100’s, can’t be won with an 81 when it’s the same people shooting the same course of fire? Has the course changed? Am I being a poor sport? Do any other members have similar experiences?

    Sorry for the rant, but when I lose 3 times when shooting winning scores, I just have to wonder about things. Please let me know if I’m being a baby about this. FWIW, there are locations where the winner in AmLE is always in the 70’s, or better, but with these particular matches, the winner was previously in the low 100’s, and the same shooters were involved. Unfortunately, I can’t find the previous match results on the GSSF website. They used to post them. If they are there, check the results and you’ll see what I mean.
     
  2. DaleGribble

    DaleGribble Sandwich!

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    That's just the way the game is played man. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Somebody came out and shot better then you did, it happens, and there's nothing you can do about it but roll with it, until the next match.

    I thought I had a pretty good shot at winning AM/Guardian in Anderson this year. I was only a second or two off of last year's winner. Well somebody else came along and beat me by about 30 seconds. It didn't make me mad, the winner shot a good match, and he deserves the gun he is about to get. My trouncing, and that's what it was, just motivated me to train that much harder.

    It's important to win and be a good sport, but it's even more important to take the frustration of a loss and turn it into something positive.
     

  3. Fireglock

    Fireglock Which is worse?

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    Dale has it. You might not be the only one practicing. A friend of mine shot a real nice score at Jackson, it would have easily won the class either of the last two years. Guess what, he was beaten by 1 second or so. :) I shot an 82.86 at Conyers in 01. That would usually win a match for you. Not for me, I'm sixth and the fourth competitor with a 82. They started with a 82.16 and ended with my 82.86. Some days you eat the bear, some days the bear eats you. :) I feel your pain but I have always had fun and I have a large group of friends to visit with at the matches. I win even when I don't win. ;f

    You're not a sore loser, just frustrated!
     
  4. TJC

    TJC "No Compromise" Millennium Member

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    To even more directly answer your concerns, sometimes the same people have off days causing their normally lower scores to be higher.
    They also have certain days where everything just works better than normal and they have a good day.
    When I shot the matches I knew about where my Stock and UL scores would fall. There were days when either would suffer because of an "oops" when shooting. There were also the days when I just clicked "one better" and had a little bit better day than normal.
    Those are the days I needed to pull when shooting against some of those guys in UL that are still there, Bobby, Tony, Dale etc.

    The same held true when I shot IPSC years ago. I knew depending on which match I was at who the competition was, normally. If you stop and take a drink, you lose when you are shooting in certain matches not to mention any "given" day.

    Keep practicing in what ever sport you are shooting. It is the way to come out on top.
     
  5. WiskyT

    WiskyT Malcontent

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    I figured it was just dumb luck and inexpirience. I could have made a beef about my target being scored wrong, and with the onlookers on my side it would have gone my way, but I didn't know better. It just seemed like alot of coincidences were happening and I wanted to know if others had similar expiriences. I'll go cry me a river now...
     
  6. FESTUS

    FESTUS Horse Whisperer

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    I have been trying to practice....and I mean concentrate on what I am doing and to quote GSSF Mentors not throwing lead down range..about 12,000 rounds a year. Last year I had a brief period where I seemed to be getting better...I headed out to a match last year and was on my way to posting an 83.00 in Am Civilian...and for me considering my best was a 129.00 I was very excited...anyway on the 5 to Glock as we were starting to score the D1s...we all made the mistake at starting at the 25 yd target to score...I was looking to have run a clean round BUT....pasters had already started pasting the 5 and 10 yd targets...you guessed it a reshoot was what I received and it started to rain to boot...needless to say I do not have my emotions yet under control nor the game savy yet to overcome this small setback I blew the reshoot to say the least. I have accepted the fact that this is how we measure ourselves and I will continue to try to improve as a shooter and as a person in handling this type of diversity...I'd suggest that you seem to have alot more natural talent than myself...and give Gssf another go...;f
     
  7. Rusty Phillips

    Rusty Phillips Moderator Millennium Member

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  8. Rusty Phillips

    Rusty Phillips Moderator Millennium Member

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    I believe that this simply means that no-one who shot competition class that weekend brought their game with them.

    It also means that you should have entered the competition class.

    Hindsight is great isnt it?

    Looking through the gssf website Long Island results, I think you are talking about the Oct 2003 match - right?

    http://www.gssfonline.com/results/2003/2003ny_li.pdf

    Is this the one you are talking about?

    Maybe instead of feeling bitter that your score (82.28 - right?) was better than the competition class pistol winner (83.61), I would suggest that you be thankful that the subcompact winner (68.82) wasn't allowed to shoot against you in AM-LE.

    At least that is what I would try to tell myself.

    You really shouldn't give up on GSSF. Richmond is right around the corner, and Statesville and Conyers are going to be here before we know it.

    One of these days you are going to put all the pieces together.

    And after you do it three times, you get sent into the deep water with the big fish.

    Welcome to the Carolina's
     
  9. GJM89

    GJM89

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    One whole second, don't feel so bad, I was actually beaten two years ago by .01 sec., by a shooter with almost the same last name, as they say Poop Happens.
     
  10. DEJ/FL

    DEJ/FL Millennium Member

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    Been Their, Done That! Got the Check Stub to prove it!;P
    Dan:cool:
     
  11. njl

    njl

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    Your only real beef is the misscored target where you put two through the same hole. IMO, you got screwed by the RO, who must have been having a bad day. I did the same thing in Orlando in 2003. I can't remember if it was 5-to-Glock or Glock-M, but it was either a 5 or 10yd target. My 5 hole grouping was tight enough that the RO's (a pair of them) agreed there was no way I missed and one of them had to be a double. I don't know if there's a good solution to the multi-shot hole target scoring issue.

    And as you've seen, you never know how the scores are going to line up. Looking at last years (or a nearby match's) scores doesn't necessarily tell you how this year's match will go. People have good/bad days or get lucky (or not), don't show up, or someone talks their friend who's incredibly good/fast into competing in GSSF for the first time. All it takes is a few stray shots to make or break a good score.
     
  12. mike from philly

    mike from philly

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    Just so everyone knows .... its ok to ask the RO to pull the target and get the Match Director's opinion of whether its a double. It happens all the time and always at the competitor's request/prodding.
    In USPSA/IPSC, RO's are given overlays that do help identify doubles.

    Also, all RO's are volunteer and are not 100% 100% of the time. We get tired, hungry, pissy, forgetful, etc. If we mess up and we do .... please be forgiving. When in doubt, ask for the match director's opinion. Explain the situation to him calmly. Also, don't have your shooting buddies gang up on an RO, it never gets the results you are hoping for.

    Personally, that RO wasn't doing good (like I said above, it happens). He should have replaced the targets well before it became a taped up mess. He should have given "the shooter the benefit of the doubt" since he most likely could see any grease rings to prove or disprove a double.

    As for scores, its all a gamble about whether you win or not. My first match ever was Conyers .... I won $50. I been shooting USPSA/IPSC and GSSF in several cities for 3 years and yet have won anything else. Ironic.

    I'm thinking about sitting this year out myself since I'm in the dreaded prize black hole between A and B. I'm not good enough to finish in the top 10 and well above the top B. I'll probally RO Conyers but not shoot it. I have limited match funds so I'd like to save it for matches that have something special about them.
     
  13. Fireglock

    Fireglock Which is worse?

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    Mike, I can't believe you said that, Conyers is ALWAYS special! ;f
     
  14. njl

    njl

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    You never know. Last year the day of the Orlando match, if you'd asked me if I thought I had a shot at the top 10 in AmCiv A class, I'd have said no way. I thought I'd be at the tail end of A at best, mid to high B at worst. I ended up 7th in A and shot my best score ever (including practice).
     
  15. WiskyT

    WiskyT Malcontent

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    Thanks for the input Rusty. I'm not doing the GSSF thing this year, probably not again. But it's not because I didn't win a gun. It's because I'm more interested in local competitions like ppc and idpa that meet every month. It's just not worth the trouble to do all the practicing and hope that everything comes togeather in terms of logistics so that I can pay $50.00 (entry fee + part of gssf membership) to drive 5 hours and spend 80 seconds shooting. It never fails that I have to do the equivelant of parting the red sea in terms of job and family to be able to go on that particular day. I can drive 20 minutes, just about any week, pay $5 and shoot in some type of match around here. If I can't make one, there's always next week. There is a gssf indoor match here and I plan to check it out. If it's fun, I'll probably maintian my mebership and go to statesville since it's only 45 min from here.

    And thanks for the welocme to the Carolina's. Moving here has been one of the best decisions of made.
     
  16. FotoTomas

    FotoTomas Pure Polymer

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    I do not practice the GSSF course of fire but am a pretty good shot anyhow. I am a reliable 105 second shooter with occasional days of providence. I won two guns so far in the subcompact class with scores in the low 70's and low 80's. Since then my 105's have been climbing and I have yet to get close to another pistol for the bump. It does get depressing.

    I remember Richmond last year and I also had 5 holes in the 5 yard target on the 5 to GLOCK. The RO was acting a little silly and did not want to give it to me. Fortunatly the other RO on the stage had a bit more tact and said it was a double. It could have gone either way.

    I will say one thing that was a bit of a PO for me. Waldorf Maryland was shortly after Richmond. I had hoped to go but decided to save the travel expense from Asheville. The subcompact class had NO ONE that shot under 130 seconds. I know that $#!+ happens but I feel confident with my scores to have been in the low 100's or better and I WAS NOT THERE! ARGH!!!!! As mentioned earlier, hindsight is a wonderful thing. :)
     
  17. DannyR

    DannyR Moderator Millennium Member

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    WiskyT,

    When there is a scoring issue on cardboard, request that the RO pull the target down and let the Match Director make the call. Your times are recorded, all the other cardboard is scored and pasted. They just remove the questionable target and replace it with a new one so the match will not be delayed.

    I once had a similar situation in Topton, 5 holes on the 10 yard target. The RO gave me the 6th "A" hit. Had I taken the miss, I would have won the B Pistol. Later that year, same thing at Conyers, only I accepted the miss. You guessed it, 2nd Place B Category, missing another pistol. That's life.;Q