Indian fighting and tactics

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by narkcop128, May 26, 2020.

  1. agtman

    agtman 10mm Philosopher

    Messages:
    5,623
    Likes Received:
    5,087
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2001
    Location:
    Midwest
    Only if shot from crossbows. ;)
     
    Inyo Tim likes this.
  2. wlkjr

    wlkjr

    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    5,140
    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2012
    I'm wondering how many here have jumped off a horse at full gallop? If you shoot the horse and it tumbles, it will stun the rider temporarily, I'd think. But if it was a rider at very short distance, shoot the rider. I have no experience in these situations on a personal level. I have however been thrown from a horse.
     
    rogn and mj9mm like this.

  3. agtman

    agtman 10mm Philosopher

    Messages:
    5,623
    Likes Received:
    5,087
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2001
    Location:
    Midwest
    Actually they could, if properly trained.

    Look up 'The Last Cavalry Charge,' which refers to a horse-mounted charge by a company of of U.S. soldiers on a suspected hideout camp of Poncho Villa's during the 1916 Mexican Punitive Expedition.

    Our guys killed just about everyone there, whether they were on foot or horseback, while suffering no fatalities of their own.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Guerrero

    And during the charge and fighting they were armed with Colt 1911s, like this 1915 model ... which could well have been there:

    photo.JPG
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2020
  4. Terry G

    Terry G

    Messages:
    4,112
    Likes Received:
    6,173
    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2004
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I have fallen off a Horse at full gallop when the cinch broke. I did not roll to my feet ready to shoot or fight. I laid there for a good 20 minutes trying to figure out if I was alive or dead.
     
    Gray_Rider, nikerret, Rotn1 and 8 others like this.
  5. 'Ol Grandad

    'Ol Grandad Director of civil unrest

    Messages:
    6,589
    Likes Received:
    12,824
    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2017
    Location:
    Edge of sanity
    Research the history of the Walker revolver for your answer.
     
  6. agtman

    agtman 10mm Philosopher

    Messages:
    5,623
    Likes Received:
    5,087
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2001
    Location:
    Midwest
    Tenderfoot! :upeyes:

    A real cowboy would've pistol-whipped that damn horse 'till it dropped over, and then, after it regained consciousness and stood up, ... why said cowboy would've gotten right back in the saddle and galloped away into the sunset.

    Old School. Hard core.

    Hence the phrase: 'Cowboy the F- Up.' :whistling:

    :animlol:
     
    Gray_Rider and pgg00 like this.
  7. greg vanstralen

    greg vanstralen

    Messages:
    1,872
    Likes Received:
    1,859
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2017
    The horse was a major reason for the development of the Walker pistol. Sam Walker had been pinned to the ground by a Comanche lance during one battle. It was while he was recuperating with relatives that he met Sam Colt. One of the requirements was that the pistol have enough force to kill an Indian horse. Before that, the Rangers largely used .36 Pattersons.
     
  8. greg vanstralen

    greg vanstralen

    Messages:
    1,872
    Likes Received:
    1,859
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2017
    Actually, the buffalo hunters likely played a major role==more than the cowboys and maybe even the cavalry.

    "Sharps=the rifle that made the West safe for Winchester".
     
    billy_56081, Inyo Tim and V Gehts like this.
  9. mikeivan

    mikeivan

    Messages:
    759
    Likes Received:
    705
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2007
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Last edited: May 26, 2020
    'Ol Grandad, Bus007 and mj9mm like this.
  10. V Gehts

    V Gehts

    Messages:
    752
    Likes Received:
    927
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2017
    Location:
    Chi-Town
    Lot’sa great history of the Native Peoples of North America and superb displays.
    Some Nations were “Way More” advanced than most common folks know or is portrayed in media and books.
    The Bill Cody Museum pays great tribute to these First Nations Peoples.
    Well worth the trip to visit.

    69C76E52-0D91-4DB9-8CAF-3A08D231CC4E.jpeg

    Excellent artist renditions of Native Americans abound in the building along with many other fine paintings of our migration west.
    Photos don’t do justice.....just a quick couple pictures...
    CA67FE5C-94FB-456F-A172-DBF1A6F4CDF2.jpeg F8BEE662-F753-42AD-9981-6431D95E82B4.jpeg

    Apologies if I put a curve in your thread....
     
  11. V Gehts

    V Gehts

    Messages:
    752
    Likes Received:
    927
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2017
    Location:
    Chi-Town
    Sorry....just a few more.... ;’)

    67E4CDA9-CC27-4CF1-ABC0-08413CAEF590.jpeg 732815EB-4B0F-49DD-B385-715DD9797A9C.jpeg D3A698C6-DFA3-438E-A769-109161224EBE.jpeg 30BA00CA-E581-4A92-92C6-937C5B0E8B30.jpeg
     
    APERS, agtman, Inyo Tim and 2 others like this.
  12. APERS

    APERS

    Messages:
    1,971
    Likes Received:
    2,658
    Joined:
    May 29, 2009
    Location:
    Kansas
    This, horses were highly valued back then. A much sought after commodity as I understand it.
    Plus horses are just plain cool, even now.
     
    agtman and V Gehts like this.
  13. mj9mm

    mj9mm

    Messages:
    9,600
    Likes Received:
    8,602
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Location:
    WI, i want my Walker back...
    this is an excellent museum, in Lawton,OK
    http://comanchemuseum.com
    also, the Fort Sill Historical Museum on base is fantastic, Geronimo,Apache, and others from his family and Tribe are buried there on base as well.
     
    V Gehts likes this.
  14. clancy

    clancy Oh, for a muse of fire

    Messages:
    8,096
    Likes Received:
    14,520
    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2011
    Empire of the Summer moon is an excellent book, but if you really want to get into the history of the Comanche Nation, the book The Comanche Empire by Pekka Hamalainen(he is Finnish, go figure) goes into amazing detail about the origins and history of the Comanches. They were uniquely located in the perfect spot in the Southwest to steal horses from Mexico and trade them to tribes further north of them. Among the world's great horse breeders, they were great traders and about the baddest Indian warriors ever seen on this continent. Any tribe that scared the Apaches into forming an alliance with Spain, conquered more territory than any other Indian tribe in North America, and were able to form a trade agreement with New Mexico at incredible terms, just to get them to stop raiding New Mexico shows the power they held in the Southwest for well over a century and a half. It took smallpox, the annihilation of the buffalo herds, repeating firearms and the US Cavalry to beat them, and it still took about 50 years to do so.
     
  15. 'Ol Grandad

    'Ol Grandad Director of civil unrest

    Messages:
    6,589
    Likes Received:
    12,824
    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2017
    Location:
    Edge of sanity
    Went there last year. We loved it!!

    PS: We ran into gun Jesus while we were there. Shook his hand.
     
    pgg00 and V Gehts like this.
  16. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

    Messages:
    32,012
    Likes Received:
    28,006
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2000
    Location:
    Upstate NY, USA
    Yes.
     
    Inyo Tim likes this.
  17. rotorhead1026

    rotorhead1026

    Messages:
    521
    Likes Received:
    792
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2019
    Not to mention Mexico’s inability to pacify the Comanche and settle Texas - which forced them to open Texas up to Americans in the hope of getting enough warm bodies to stave off Indian raids. Then came Santa Anna ...
     
    billy_56081 and clancy like this.
  18. Gray Dood

    Gray Dood

    Messages:
    4,293
    Likes Received:
    9,833
    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2017
    Little Big Horn was against the Sioux IIRC.

    And it wasn't a small unit action.

    It was command arrogance in splitting up the US Army forces in the face of an unknown much larger indigenous force, armed with superior weapons for short range attack. This allowed the 7th Cavalry to be chopped up piecemeal.
     
    Caver 60, Terry G and rotorhead1026 like this.
  19. agtman

    agtman 10mm Philosopher

    Messages:
    5,623
    Likes Received:
    5,087
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2001
    Location:
    Midwest
    Mostly Sioux and Cheyenne.

    Yes, splitting up the full command into three units, only two of which actually engaged most of the Indians initially (Reno's charge & Custer down-river attack), with virtually zero recon of enemy force strength before those commands engaged, was doomed to fail.

    Lots of scalping and gutting on Last Stand Hill there at the end.

    IMG_0185.JPG