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Resisting arrest requires you in fact have an arrest able offense……being a jerk is not it.
they could have called him over and tell him they received a call , safely got his Creds and bingo no problem……instead of ordering him to the ground at gun point. Of course it wouldn’t make such a cringeworthy display .
He was being detained, not arrested. His actions determined their reactions. They were perfectly within their rights to order him to the ground and cuff him until they could confirm he was who he claimed to be. He was resisting their efforts. He was refusing to comply, technically resisting and obstructing their efforts to invesigate who and what he was.

Randy
 

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Reminds me of an old joke...
A DEA officer stopped at a ranch in Texas , and talked with an old rancher.
He told the rancher, "I need to inspect your ranch for illegally grown drugs."
The rancher said, "Okay , but don't go in that field over there.", as he pointed out the location.
The DEA officer verbally exploded saying, " Mister, I have the authority of the Federal Government with me !" Reaching into his rear pants pocket, he removed his badge and proudly displayed it to the rancher. "See this badge?! This badge means I am allowed to go wherever I wish.... On any land! No questions asked! Do you understand ?!!" The rancher nodded politely, apologized, and went about his chores. A short time later, the old rancher heard loud screams, looked up, and saw the DEA officer running for his life, being chased by the rancher's big Santa Gertrudis bull...... With every step the bull was gaining ground on the officer, and it seemed likely that he'd sure enough get gored before he reached safety. The officer was clearly terrified. The rancher threw down his tools, ran to the fence and yelled at the top of his lungs..... "Your badge, show him your BADGE!!"
 

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He was being detained, not arrested. His actions determined their reactions. They were perfectly within their rights to order him to the ground and cuff him until they could confirm he was who he claimed to be. He was resisting their efforts. He was refusing to comply, technically resisting and obstructing their efforts to invesigate who and what he was.

Randy
Sigh it was heavy Handed from the get…would you say the same if the first responding officer was confronted standing at the door by federal agents with guns drawn? would they be within their rights ?
city police don’t own the city there are many other entities that have full jusridiction and have to ask permission to conduct their business.
 

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Reminds me of an old joke...
A DEA officer stopped at a ranch in Texas , and talked with an old rancher.
He told the rancher, "I need to inspect your ranch for illegally grown drugs."
The rancher said, "Okay , but don't go in that field over there.", as he pointed out the location.
The DEA officer verbally exploded saying, " Mister, I have the authority of the Federal Government with me !" Reaching into his rear pants pocket, he removed his badge and proudly displayed it to the rancher. "See this badge?! This badge means I am allowed to go wherever I wish.... On any land! No questions asked! Do you understand ?!!" The rancher nodded politely, apologized, and went about his chores. A short time later, the old rancher heard loud screams, looked up, and saw the DEA officer running for his life, being chased by the rancher's big Santa Gertrudis bull...... With every step the bull was gaining ground on the officer, and it seemed likely that he'd sure enough get gored before he reached safety. The officer was clearly terrified. The rancher threw down his tools, ran to the fence and yelled at the top of his lungs..... "Your badge, show him your BADGE!!"
I spewed coffee.
 

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Unfair Facist
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Sung to the tune of “i’m a little teapot”

i‘m a federal agent, hear me shout,
take me at gun point and prone me out,
when you go to cuff me, hear me shout,
i’m a federal agent, you jackbooted lout!
😂😎
 

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Rule number one when working in plain clothes…….the man in uniform is always right.

I would never respond to uniforms like that because I’d prefer not to get shot. In fact I always notify the local agency I am doing something in their yard ahead of time.
From a "plain clothes" LEO - collim1 is 100% correct. There is always time to address "conduct issues" after the scene is secure...

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

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Resisting arrest requires you in fact have an arrest able offense……being a jerk is not it.
they could have called him over and tell him they received a call , safely got his Creds and bingo no problem……instead of ordering him to the ground at gun point. Of course it wouldn’t make such a cringeworthy display .
Dang, I might have to call BS on the last word of that user name of yours.
 

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From a "plain clothes" LEO - collim1 is 100% correct. There is always time to address "conduct issues" after the scene is secure...

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
I agree I was just pointing out the initial conduct coupled with a jerk led to this absurd encounter. if you don’t think so well so be it.
 

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Why so serious?
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Sent from my Jackboot using Copatalk
 

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Sigh it was heavy Handed from the get…would you say the same if the first responding officer was confronted standing at the door by federal agents with guns drawn? would they be within their rights ?
city police don’t own the city there are many other entities that have full jusridiction and have to ask permission to conduct their business.
Maybe, but that doesn't mean it was the wrong approach. How else should you approach that? Can you really go into a situation like that assuming he's legit and not a threat until proven otherwise? When the call is for an armed guy impersonating a cop, who turns out to be armed, and then displays very un-cop-like non-compliant behavior when contacted? Immediate red flag to me. I'm not going to be mad at the cops for making sure they were ahead of the curve on this one. Only one side gets to be in charge in cases like that, and it ain't the guy in plain clothes.

That is exactly how plainclothes cops get hurt when confronted by uniforms that don't know them, and the opposite of how you'd expect real plainclothes cops to act. These guys are from a big city where I'll wager they've likely been to a few LOD funerals. Armed non-compliant contacts are going to get special and immediate attention. Maybe small town cops wihtout that background would be more likely to give him the benefit of the doubt. I grew up in Detroit, maybe that makes me paranoid, but I can justify their behavior way more easily than I can justify the Fed in this encounter.

Randy
 

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Why so serious?
45mm 9ACP
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68,307 Posts
Resisting arrest requires you in fact have an arrest able offense……being a jerk is not it.
they could have called him over and tell him they received a call , safely got his Creds and bingo no problem……instead of ordering him to the ground at gun point. Of course it wouldn’t make such a cringeworthy display .
Really?

Such as:

-Obstruction

-Disobey a lawful order

But please go on.

Sent from my Jackboot using Copatalk
 

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Sigh it was heavy Handed from the get…would you say the same if the first responding officer was confronted standing at the door by federal agents with guns drawn? would they be within their rights ?
city police don’t own the city there are many other entities that have full jusridiction and have to ask permission to conduct their business.
so the EXACT same thing but plain cloths fed points gun at Officer? A Uniformed Officer, pulls up in marked squad Fed pulls gun? Do you realize that apples are not grape fruit?
 

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so the EXACT same thing but plain cloths fed points gun at Officer? A Uniformed Officer, pulls up in marked squad Fed pulls gun? Do you realize that apples are not grape fruit?
The fed was driving his POV ? As to your question a call comes in about a person impersonating a officer does being in uniform automatically make the situation “ different “
and who said the guy was armed ? Or are you just assuming based on the “ call “ ?
 

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Maybe, but that doesn't mean it was the wrong approach. How else should you approach that? Can you really go into a situation like that assuming he's legit and not a threat until proven otherwise? When the call is for an armed guy impersonating a cop, who turns out to be armed, and then displays very un-cop-like non-compliant behavior when contacted? Immediate red flag to me. I'm not going to be mad at the cops for making sure they were ahead of the curve on this one. Only one side gets to be in charge in cases like that, and it ain't the guy in plain clothes.

That is exactly how plainclothes cops get hurt when confronted by uniforms that don't know them, and the opposite of how you'd expect real plainclothes cops to act. These guys are from a big city where I'll wager they've likely been to a few LOD funerals. Armed non-compliant contacts are going to get special and immediate attention. Maybe small town cops wihtout that background would be more likely to give him the benefit of the doubt. I grew up in Detroit, maybe that makes me paranoid, but I can justify their behavior way more easily than I can justify the Fed in this encounter.

Randy
The arriving officer had his car between the fed and himself , he could have said We got a call of someone “ impersonating a federal agent “ presumably the idiot would say “ I am a federal agent “. Ask him to keep his hands in sight and ask if he is armed and where is the weapon on his person , and where his creds are located. The Fed was already bracketed by the second responding officer. That would be a good way to start the encounter. Instead of ordering him to the ground at gunpoint. Escalating is easy to do, no need to start out hard within seconds of arrival.
 

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Bit of a jambog... I stand by my comment from August. I'm a pretty cool guy, so I don't wear a targe---uniform or drive a targe-- marked car.

DIsclaimer: I don't work for ATF or any other Department of Justice agency.

[Insults not relevant to this thread removed]

The local inbred cops and the conflicting commands they jabbered excitedly would be comical if the situation weren't so potentially dangerous.

The special agent from ATF is a fool at best.... [Now with additional info it appears he may be a thief with a wine drinking problem]

I have my communications people patch me through (on a recorded line) to the local dispatch (on a recorded line) when I'm doing work. It's not rocket surgery.

Also, Bren said it first, knocking on a door and talking to people isn't in any way a violation of the fourth amendment.

[Insulting media clip not relevant to this thread, most of which I skipped, removed]
 
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