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Do you really think that the media and the Democrats would be saying anything?
If it was really bad they’d be hoping that it would kill Trump, and they’d keep their mouth shut about it !
 

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Do you really think that the media and the Democrats would be saying anything?
If it was really bad they’d be hoping that it would kill Trump, and they’d keep their mouth shut about it !
If nothing else, they'd be able to support their hysteria with examples of it hurting people by now, if it was harmful. Notice that, as much as they hate it, they haven't been able to do that as far as I have seen.
 

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If nothing else, they'd be able to support their hysteria with examples of it hurting people by now, if it was harmful. Notice that, as much as they hate it, they haven't been able to do that as far as I have seen.
Yeah, funny the drug has been around so long but we have not gotten any examples of people hurt by it, just fishtank cleaner morons.

Every drug can hurt you if administered improperly. Is there some reason the people that get it for lupus are immune to its negative effects?

The other thing that bothers me is they talk about how it does not work by itself or with a Z pack. That is not what it is supposed to do, you need to take it with Zinc, it lets Zinc into the cells to kill the virus. It isn't effective by itself if you don't have enough Zinc and I have no idea where the Z pack came from. That just seems to be the go to drug for respiratory problems.
 

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It was funny to watch the fake news heads explode when Our President told them he was taking it LOL. The drug has been in use for like 50 years, if there was anything dangerous with it I think they would have known about it by now.
 

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Based on what Picard MD has said in other threads, there ARE some dangers in its use. (Like most drugs.) The thing is, given that it has been in use for so long the dangers are mostly known and doctors take them into account when prescribing it, and know to monitor and modify if there are issues. The hysteria around it is ridiculous, but then the MSM is full of sensationalist idiots who live to spin and overblow things when it suits their purposes.

-Pat
 

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It was funny to watch the fake news heads explode when Our President told them he was taking it LOL. The drug has been in use for like 50 years, if there was anything dangerous with it I think they would have known about it by now.
They do.

upload_2020-5-24_14-37-59.png


And don't forgot emotional lability. There's something we want with the guy that controls the nuclear button.
 

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Do you really think that the media and the Democrats would be saying anything?
If it was really bad they’d be hoping that it would kill Trump, and they’d keep their mouth shut about it !
If President Trump said he wouldn't take the drug is the left would be all over him for not taking it. I enjoy watching them make asses out of themselves.
 

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It’s more than a little ironic that as much as many complain about the Democrats always complaining about it, it keeps coming up here.

Go figure.
 

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Are you guys saying that this is the first ever drug with absolutely no side effects? My impression was that it's like every other drug, in that there is a slew of potential adverse reactions. If it isn't proven to help COVID, then you're just accepting the possible consequences for no reason whatsoever.
 

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I get my quinine from gin and tonics.
 

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As a rheumatologist I prescribe Hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) as well as monitor patients for adverse events far more frequently than most, if not all, other sub specialties. The real world risks of drug related adverse events relative to HCQ use in the setting of COVID patients must be considered relative to the context of the treatment population.

Picard MD made some very valid points relative to use of HCQ in the critically ill/ ICU COVID patient population. The use of HCQ in that population is a concern primarily due to a potential, but rare arrhythmia called torsades de pointes (TdP). HCQ causes elongation in QT interval, a change known to be related to TdP. This is even further a concern due to potential drug-drug interaction when combination of HCQ and Azithromycin are utilized, as is done in treating COVID. However, there is a far from linear relationship between TdP and QT segment prolongation, and even less perfect correlation between QT prolongation and fatal arrhythmia. Yet, due to a lack of empirical data on the use of combination HCQ and Azithromycin, we must approach HCQ use with caution in this specific setting.

Even further complicating the issue is that critically ill patients admitted with COVID-19 are likely to inherently have higher potential arrhythmic risks as a result of the metabolic and physiologic sequelae of their illness, and a typically greater burden of comorbid disease. ( ACC, March 29, 2020).

However, as we moved forward it became clear that HCQ , if beneficial, was most likely so in the early stages of disease or as a prophylactic. Clearly it’s use in this outpatient, less ill population warrants very different consideration than in the critically ill patient. One paper From the American College of Cardiology discussing the issue stated “Despite these suggestive findings, several hundred million courses of chloroquine have been used worldwide making it one of the most widely used drugs in history, without reports of arrhythmic death under World Health Organization surveillance.”

The use of HCQ in less ill, community, non hospitalized patients, or as prophylaxis, more closely correlates to its use in the cohort of patient I use the HCQ for to treat autoimmune disease. Although the concern for arrhythmia is taken into consideration, the true presentation of these events in real world use is minuscule both in practice and in recorded empirical data. Personally I prescribe HCQ several hundred times every month, and monitor for adverse events. Over 29 years of clinical practice I have never seen an arrhythmia definitively attributed to HCQ, and have only discontinued its use due to concern for arrhythmia or abnormal EKG findings less than 10 times. The vast majority of adverse events I see, though in themselves rare, are minor such as GI issues or headache.

Another consideration is the brevity of use to potentially treat COVID. Short term this drug is exceedingly safe. This is particularly true for the retinal adverse event discussed, which is a non event in the several week duration of use likely with use treating COVID patients.

Thus far, there is no definitive, empirical data regarding use of HCQ in treating COVID, and at this point, most study outcomes have been disappointing( as well as being littered with flaws, design and otherwise). One of the most solid pieces of data recently published in Annals of Rheumatic Disease in early May and states, “data from the COVID-19 Global Rheumatology Alliance registry shows that lupus patients taking routine doses of HCQ are NOT universally protected from COVID-19“. They did qualify by stating that suggested serum concentrations of HCQ often recommended to treat COVID were higher than those exhibited in Lupus patients( ~6700ng/ml vs ~1679-5038ng/ml found in lupus patients).

So, safe in less ill patients or as prophylaxis?? Yes.
Effective??......the jury is still out, but the weight of the evidence presently is NO, not likely effective. Now the $64000 question........with all that I know, if I test positive for COVID, would I take HCQ?........definitively YES based on high degree of safety even as compared to a low potential benefit.
 

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The worst thing is that it created a shortage for those who really needed it.
This is what I really wonder about. I’m not a Dr. I’m not going to pretend to know how this medicine works with my little masters degree in Biology and 4 microbio classes taken over 10 years ago. But what I do think I understand is that it is a fairly safe drug as long as taken as prescribed and it does work for malaria and some autoimmune disorders. What I don’t think anyone is sure of right now is if there is any benefit at all for treatment of COVID-19. I would say if there is a chance it could help and doses are monitored the drug has a long history so I would consider it safe. It doesnt appear to have any effect on a healthy person getting or not getting the virus so why should any healthy person be given this drug when there are others that truly need it. It someone is sick then let them take it to see if it could help fighting the virus. Somehow someone smarter than me has thought the mechanism how this drug works will be beneficial in fighting COVID for some reason but it appears the benefit of this for COVID patients is shaky at best. If there is enough to go around try it on all the COVID patients they can but not at the expense of making a single person that has a disease that hydroxychloroquine is proven to be effective against.


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Picard MD explained more in his post than this thread will in 4 pages. There are a list of reasons why it can be a bad idea for the critically ill.
 

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NBC nightly news had a Dr. on for a few days that was in bed with the virus. It followed his recovery from the time where he thought he was exposed (on a flight to New Orleans) until he was up walking around. I turns out that over the years he had travelled to many third world countries helping the medicos in those countries. He said he had Malaria three different times. Any guesses if NBC asked him if he had ever taken Hydrocloraquine? The answer is No.
 
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Local news article about a local MD who was diagnosed with Covid. He took HCQ and recovered. He reported as feelin "rotten," but was never sick enough to be hospitalized. He attributed HCQ to 'helping" his recovery.
 
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