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i still do not understand or trust "squadding"

Discussion in 'GSSF' started by S.Kargoh, Jun 27, 2012.

  1. S.Kargoh

    S.Kargoh

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    I get nervous and stick at one stage until my name is cal/ed.



    Am I a loon?
     
  2. Butch

    Butch RetiredDinosaur Millennium Member CLM

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    That's what yer supposed to do.....after signing in at all three stages.....pick one, stay there and shoot, then pick another.
     

  3. PM720

    PM720

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    Exactly what Butch said. More often than not it does work like its supposed to.

    Scott
     
  4. ron59

    ron59 Bustin Caps

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    You're supposed to simply write your name at all 3 stages *first*.
    Only put an 'X' by your name once you're ready to shoot that stage. Then yes, you stay there.

    The advantage of squadding is that when you finish that stage and move to the next? Your name should be put into the next SQUAD once they do that.

    Technically, they're not just supposed to keep jamming names on the tree. They SQUAD folks, and once all those had shot (a tree full I guess), THEN they squad again. To fill a squad, they go by who signed up first on the sheet and now has an X by the name.

    It isn't always done that way, but that's how it is supposed to work.
     
  5. S.Kargoh

    S.Kargoh

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    I don't turn in all score sheets/ sign in at all stages. I just do one at a time.


    I have never seen a squad of shooters. Are you supposed to move to each stage as a group? I have seen names called and nobody there.

    I am the type who shows up early to places, gets nervous that i am in the right place, doing the right procedure, etc. Don't want to foul it up.


    So,I just get to a stage, watch for a few cycles, sign in, affix label to scoresheet, and wait /help paste.
     
  6. SARDG

    SARDG

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    S. - It doesn't sound like you are using the system to your advantage. Of course, the ROs have to understand the squadding system as well. Do not wait to sign in when you get to a stage; sign in and then watch and paste OR sign in and go to the next stage and sign in, etc. No X'ing until you are staying in one spot.

    All you do is sign in at each stage, staying at or returning to the one you would like to shoot. You do NOT turn in your sticker/label until you have arrived at the stage you wish to shoot, placed an X near your name, and your name has been called to form the next squad. Stay at the stage where you have placed the X next to your name! At that point, when your name is called, you hand the Sign-in RO your label(s) and he or she will place it on a scoresheet, The Sign-in RO will call and assemble 8-12 entries, forming the next squad. This is being done when a couple of entries remain on the tree. When those last couple of entries have shot, the RO is ready to place the next squad (8-12 entries) on the tree and the process starts over. You do NOT move as a squad from stage to stage as is done in some other disciplines. In a way, that's the beauty of GSSF squadding.

    This is a good time to mention that the squad is formed from number of entries (8-12) - not number of shooters (who may have multiple entries) - and each entry is placed on a separate clip on the tree (even if it is the same shooter). Since it takes about 5 minutes to run an entry, a tree-full of entries will take about an hour. This is how you can judge your wait time.

    After you've shot all your entries at a stage, you can move to one of the other stages that you have signed in at. When you get to that next stage, place an X near your name AND WAIT TO BE CALLED. You should be called in the chronological order that you originally signed in at that stage. You hear shooters being called and no one responding because a) the shooter doesn't understand squadding and has placed an X and left the area OR b) the the stage is so backed up that the time between X'ing and being called forced the shooter to leave the stage after X'ing their name. If I leave a stage that I X'ed, I go scribble out the X and tell the RO I'm moving to another stage, lunch, whatever.

    The busiest time in a GSSF match is Saturday morning when everyone shows up early to beat the crowd. In addition, 2/3 of the entries are shot on Saturday. BTW, if you sign-in at a stage on Saturday and don't shoot that stage, you must sign-in again on Sunday - the sign-in sheets don't roll from Saturday to Sunday.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2012
  7. BamaTrooper

    BamaTrooper Retired

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  8. GlockinNJ

    GlockinNJ

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    I really like the way GSSF runs the matches. I think it's fair and as efficient as can be. No matter what, you are bound to run into some delays at stages, but that gives you an opportunity to help paste, chat with other shooters and see them compete, which can be educational and/or humorous.

    You shouldn't be in a race to finish shooting and get home. Try to enjoy the day and get the most out of it. Where else would you rather be anyway?
     
  9. SARDG

    SARDG

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    You're gonna get a headache if you keep that up... :tongueout:
     
  10. lethal tupperwa

    lethal tupperwa

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    but it feels SO good when he stops.
     
  11. SARDG

    SARDG

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    I've been rereading this thread...

    I offered to do a New Shooters Clinic at the matches I attend, but GSSF isn't biting. Why actually train folks when you can simply have our new shooters wander aimlessly in the dark for match after match (after match)...............

    Glockrunner suggested this too and we've spoken about it a little. Never gonna happen I guess... :brickwall:
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2012
  12. PM720

    PM720

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    I suppose you could set up your own little tent in the parking lot? :dunno:

    Scott
     
  13. SARDG

    SARDG

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    That's what I like about you Scott... you're always thinking of great solutions like that one. :whistling:
     
  14. PM720

    PM720

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    Hey, I agree that there should be some kind of new shooter orientation. Even if it's just a volunteer of to the side at registration or maybe a short video playing on a laptop or something. Just another way to improve the system. :dunno:

    And yes, I know as well as the rest of us here that most of that info is in the Annual or on here but many people find out about these matches from local forums or word of mouth and actually sign up/ join up AT the match so a short primer on the program might help. Considering how long the lines in registration can be a 5 minute video playing in a loop might go a long way. :whistling:

    Scott
     
  15. lethal tupperwa

    lethal tupperwa

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    hasn't the vidio of which you speak been moved to the GSSF web site

    where it can be viewed BEFORE you go to a match RIGHT AFTER YOU READ THE RULES?

    try this----


    http://www.gssfonline.com/hot-topics.cfm
     
  16. S.Kargoh

    S.Kargoh

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    After reading this several times, i am not convinced.


    Seems like it never works that way. I never hear any mention of squads at the matches I see. They just take sheets and call new shooters most of the tine (it seems to me anyway).
     
  17. PM720

    PM720

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    I didn't see any video but I haven't looked at every page on the GSSF site in a while. Regardless, this does not help newbies AT the match.

    Since the subject is squadding, I found this in the FAQ's-

    1. When and where do I sign-in?​
    After you have registered and received your self-adhesive entry labels, look for the “Sign-In” areas usually located at the
    front of the shooting pits.
    Be sure to sign in at three locations; one for each course of fire. To clarify, GSSF matches may have multiple set-up’s
    and sign-in areas for one or all courses of fire. Choose which shooting pit for a particular stage you wish to shoot and
    only sign-in at that location.​
    The courses of fire you need to sign-in at are GLOCK’M, Five to GLOCK and GLOCK the Plates.

    To my reading it is not clear that you should go to all 3 stages and sign in FIRST and then pick the one you want to start shooting at. It is a bit vague to me and I understand how the system works. Just saying a short tutorial could go a long way.

    Scott
     
  18. PM720

    PM720

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    Well, after shooting 5 matches, 2 of witch did NOT use the squadding trees I can tell you for a fact that it DOES work WHEN it is used properly. At the last Norco match 5ToG followed proper procedure and M did not and M ran much slower in my opinion. They had 3 plate setups so plates ran VERY quickly. I was able to shoot all 5 divisions back to back because no one was really waiting. :whistling:

    I can't wait to go to Conyers to see how a "home" match is run. You just know it has to be the model of effeciency to get 1000+ entries through in 2 days.

    Scott
     
  19. SARDG

    SARDG

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    The shooter may never hear the actual word "squad", though it would be nice if they understood they were part of one - which they are when it's done correctly.

    I also offered to give more formal RO training - but GSSF is largely not budging on that either. Even IF the ROs shoot other disciplines, they've probably never seen anything like GSSF squadding. And as often happens, the competition-experienced are running the timers, the second most competition-experienced are acting as Scorekeeper, and the least experienced are doing Sign-in (squadding). Once in a great while, someone that really understands GSSF squadding shows up as Sign-in RO - Mrs. Glockrunner comes to mind, but there are a few others.

    Personally, I think there is little hope for resolution and compliance on either side of the sign-in table without some formal training/orientation.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2012
  20. SARDG

    SARDG

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    Cindy Noyes (GSSF) is a member and USPSA Rangemaster/MD at SRGC (Conyers - Covington actually). She has been extremely organized in pursuing and selecting ROs for the Conyers GSSF match; recruiting known-experienced ROs, then sending out a questionaire to remaining volunteers to gauge their experience and training. The ROs are pre-assigned as they are at all the better matches. She trys to pair an experienced RO with those who may need some training.

    No other GSSF match happens that weekend so for them it is All Hands on Deck.

    Still, people being people... stuff happens. There are never enough ROs - never. And there are many things to do - it's like a carnival of sorts. If anyone wants to begin making a difference, and understands the rules, they can step up for a day, a half day, whatever - at any of these matches.